A suggestion to the management!

[M5Clive]

Having just returned from a 5 mile mountain bike ride around Norfolk, I'm full of energy and have a suggestion that I consider would be an improvement to HMVF for 2008.

 

A certain degree of criticism has been voiced in the general direction of HMVF because some of its members are prepared to make statements/comments on this forum but only under the heading of a screen name or handle, and not there own name.

 

Although I don't have a screen name myself and have always made comments both good and bad under my own name, I know that many members use HMVF only under there own screen names.

 

My suggestion therefore is not to remove members screen names, but to have members proper names underneath there handles. After all, I have communicated with many members on here without having a clue who they are.

 

I know that as well as being of benefit to HMVF members ourselves, this would also give our operation a greater degree of credability to others, as people have commented to me that perhaps contentious or hot topics up for discussion on HMVF have been underminded by the fact that those who contribute to the discussion are not prepared to use there own names in these discussions, which I think is a fair and valid point!

 

I have always used my own name, simply because I am prepared to stand by what I think and say - both good and bad!

 

Food for thought perhaps - Over to you guys for what you think!

 

 

[fv1609]

All perfectly reasonable. I agree, have the b*lls to put your name to what you say.

[Marmite!!]

Everything you need to know about me is always in my signature & under HMVF Staff at the top of the page, the Management have a pretty good idea who it's members are as they are checked out before being approved, we always encourage every new member to make a proper introduction as soon as they join the forum. I don't think it's a good idea to start asking members to start publishing their surnames, some people may to a certain extent keep their hobby a bit private... it's all to easy to do an Internet search & find all sorts of things about people.

 

If people want to criticise they are welcome to come on here & voice their opinion, under their real name ;-) everyone has the right to reply on HMVF :-)

 

 

Happy 2008..

[Richard Farrant]

All perfectly reasonable. I agree, have the b*lls to put your name to what you say.

 

 

Clive and Clive,

 

Quite agree with all that, so have now thrown off my "screen name" of Kewelde, although my name has been on the bottom of posts.

 

It gives more credibility to any discussions, especially if viewed by people outside of the forum.

 

Richard

[David Ives]

have always used my real name so when speaking to people at shows straight away know who i am talking to :-D but if did use a psundum then would be the vehicles reg

[ArtistsRifles]

Like Lee - my detaails are in the signature block at the end of each post.

If the management feel that using real names will be an asset to the forum, though, I've no objection to changing to this.

[Snapper]

If you knew my real name I'd have to bill you.

 

I can see ample merit in both arguments. But I do wonder where the criticism is coming from because it doesn't take much to work out who's zooming who; and if it is a "management' dig then even moreso. . I only have a user name because I thought it made sense to.

 

I will add a plea for 2008 - I would like to see less politics (though to be fair, I don't think there is that much on HMVF anyway - but the written electronic word always seems open to wider interpretation than the inky kind and this is where problems and misunderstandings arise - so perhaps I am asking for zero politics - which I know is impossible. Just keep up the commitment and the passion for what we all appear to love a great deal and things will be fine. Genuine concerns and fears need an outlet for discussion. What some people appear to forget is, that this forum is .... a forum, it's the same as your local MV club branch clubhouse, but where what you say lingers on the ether in a wholly more permanent way than your comments over a pint and a packet of pork scratchings. We all need to remember this. The point being what you say in all sincerity over your pint stays in a smaller location than the mega monster that is the tinterweb. So many people are just lining up to be offended/amused/bemused/shot down in flames and once you've typed it...badabingbadaboom. Here endeth the lesson. Happy New Year on the lot of you.

 

Mark B

[Tony B]

To be honest folks, this is a very open public forum. We the members know each others names. An alias is necessary unfortunately because of electronic scams. We swoop a lot of personnel info through PM's, again life is such that we rely on the honesty of each other that info is not misused. Polotics'? everything in life has polotics attached. I have never seen anything that I would be offended at, if offence is caused apologies are quick and sincere. Arguments, sorry, positive discussion is always intelligent. Mickey taking, well if you don't like it go and get a life. Another hoary old saying, 'what right have you to laugh at anyone if you cannot laugh at yourself' Keep it up lad's. :clap: :hug:.

[Jack]

Interesting topic and as always, I will listen and observe before I make a considered reply. I have my own thoughts on this subject but I would be more than interested in hearing some more thought on this from other members........

 

Best wishes.

 

Jack.

[M5Clive]

Your absolutely right there Mark and this is one of the very issues that get used against us as a forum, and I do find myself having to defend against this in the interest of HMVF.

 

Off the cuff comments that I make when I chair the monthly Suffolk Area MVT meetings are rarely recorded (unless I choose to document them in the monthly minutes) but as you so rightly say Mark, an off the cuff comment on here, made by an HMVF member who appears nameless by default, can linger for months if not longer.

 

Regardless of whether comments are political or appears to be criticising other clubs or other individuals (and I have done this myself on HMVF within the past year) or not, I do think it is important that both HMVF members and non-members who view the site can see who is saying what.

 

A prime example, I have been communicating with a very pleasant guy on HMVF known to me as N.O.S. who I think lives quite local to me, but i'm not sure and is keen to find a good home for his T2 hangar. Now wouldn't it be easier if under his handle N.O.S. there was a full name in small type showing his proper name?

 

As you say Mark "Genuine concerns and fears need an outlet for discussion." How true this is, and how successful HMVF is at giving us all a platform that enables us to do so. But, we wouldn't write a letter of concern to the MVT Windscreen magazine (a similar platform for such issues) and sign it Anon would we, nor would we be able to get away without giving our membership name and number.

 

I have to say, I don't see giving out our surnames on here as a major matter of National Security - I think I would be more concerned about the state of our Governments National Security than our names being on HMVF! Ok, so i'm being a bit fliplant about the security issue and yes, if so desired, anyone could tap into information volunteered on here and find out all sorts of things about me, but in all honestly, I think I would be far more concerned about using my debit card to by things with, rather than the fact that someone could find out that Mr. C D Stevens has owned seven GMC's since 1994..............! No doubt the criminal elements on the www. are zeroing in on my potential prized collection of General Motors workshop manuals as you read this!

 

I think that if people are that fearful of internet security issues, then they would be better-off not using forums like these. Just my opinion, for what its worth.

 

"But I do wonder where the criticism is coming from because it doesn't take much to work out who's zooming who; and if it is a "management' dig then even moreso." I don't consider this is so much a management dig, but more a criticism of HMVF in general. Negative comments I have heard go along the lines of "HMVF has an element of people on it who are prepared to say all sorts of things without any policing, yet these people are not even prepared to make these comments under there own name!"

 

Ok, so most of us know that the site is indeed very well policed and a huge amount of work goes on in the background that the average member doesn't even see, but putting generalisations like this to one side, the above comment is a valid point.

 

I just think that it would be a positive move for our brilliant HMVF Forum and gain us all-together greater credability from our critics - And lets not kid ourselves, we know (for whatever reasons) that we do have them too!

 

 

[General Mayhem]

Is there a dig at something here? Or am I missing a point? Any hint of politics on this forum is immediately censored. There have been times when I've had an entry removed and left feeling exasperated, but hey ho, that's the rules so get over it.

As for using my real name, thank goodness it's not Rushbottom or Treblecock.

[Marmite!!]

 

"But I do wonder where the criticism is coming from because it doesn't take much to work out who's zooming who; and if it is a "management' dig then even moreso." I don't consider this is so much a management dig, but more a criticism of HMVF in general. Negative comments I have heard go along the lines of "HMVF has an element of people on it who are prepared to say all sorts of things without any policing, yet these people are not even prepared to make these comments under there own name!"

 

 

 

Again Clive, if they are so concerned why do they not come on here & voice their concerns? seems to me that the ones criticising are the anonymous ones ;-)

[Markheliops]

Man - do I get the hump. :angry:

 

Not sure who is criticising the forum but whoever it is - s-d off. :argh:

 

I love being part of this forum - I like the people on it - I like the topics discussed - and I like the feel of being part of something unique.

 

What I don't like is being asked to furnish my details just to please some unknown quantity who want to criticise the forum. My full details are on my profile and I have no reason to hide my particulars.

 

If members want to show their real names on screen - please feel free as it doesn't matter a hoot what name you show to me.

 

To be honest, if someone wants to think the forum has less credibility because we happen to use screen names - then so be it. I would hate to think we have to change what we have been doing since the beginning because someone starts having a kick at the forum.

 

I didn't join the forum to be credible - I joined it to participate in discussion and share my passion of MV's with like minded people.

 

Markheliops

[Tony B]

Well actually... we ALL criticise the forum :dunno: That's how it evolves. The moderators hold the ring, and throw the necessary buckets over those whose tempers get heated up. the good thing is if outsiders start, they get a unanimous :pfrt: We could install a mud wrestling ring in the club house? Now who had last loan of the dancin girls? :whistle:

[Markheliops]

To be honest Tony - never had the need to criticise the forum -

 

I'm just happy to be here. :banana:

 

I think the mods do a good enough job and I for one do not have any complaints.

 

Members have - as you stated - the right to criticise and make suggestions - and that is only right.

 

Non-members do not.

 

 

[N.O.S.]

Anyone else noticed how much the forum has deteriorated since that chap Kewelde threw in the towel? I'll miss his wit, banter and that good old voice of experience. It'll be a worse place without him :whistle:

 

[Marmite!!]

Anyone else noticed how much the forum has deteriorated since that chap Kewelde threw in the towel? I'll miss his wit, banter that good old voice of experience. It'll be a worse place without him :whistle:

 

 

 

Yes doesn't seem the same without him :-D

[Rick W]

I have been a member of this place for well over a year and found some very good friends on here. I may not know who they are face to face, but as said, you get to know people. I spend a lot of time here helping where I can, as well as receiving help. I like the general chat, MV or not, looking at peoples pics etc,etc. Politics is bound to creep in somewhere no matter how hard you try especially when something is geting " big ", and having been involved in various committees of one sort or another is something I would rather avoid, so I do!!

I think this is a great forum, with some great people, who hopefully I may get to meet someday face to face! And yes if youve got anything to say, say it in the open, thats what forums are for, a place of discussion, as long as its not turned into a slanging match, which doesnt do our hobby any favours.

PS

I think the mods of this and any other related site have their work cut out!

 

Lets have a rust free New Year..... ;-)

[Rick W]

Yes doesn't seem the same without him :-D

 

 

Who....? :whistle:

[ian2b]

A certain degree of criticism has been voiced in the general direction of HMVF because some of its members are prepared to make statements/comments on this forum but only under the heading of a screen name or handle, and not there own name.

 

 

 

Clive the people that have made comments towards HMVF have you asked them to join the forum using there own names and voice there concerns to the members and also the management. As I can see it they are saying things about us and hiding behind you.

 

From what I can see this forum is run much the same as other forums out there including the WW2 reenacting forum which is a very successful forum and they to use screen names or handles. A successful forum like that hasn't found the need to use real names to gain crediability so I dont think HMVF would gain anything by its members using real names.

 

[LeeEnfield]

Man - do I get the hump. :angry:

 

Not sure who is criticising the forum but whoever it is - s-d off. :argh:

 

I love being part of this forum - I like the people on it - I like the topics discussed - and I like the feel of being part of something unique.

 

What I don't like is being asked to furnish my details just to please some unknown quantity who want to criticise the forum. My full details are on my profile and I have no reason to hide my particulars.

 

If members want to show their real names on screen - please feel free as it doesn't matter a hoot what name you show to me.

 

To be honest, if someone wants to think the forum has less credibility because we happen to use screen names - then so be it. I would hate to think we have to change what we have been doing since the beginning because someone starts having a kick at the forum.

 

I didn't join the forum to be credible - I joined it to participate in discussion and share my passion of MV's with like minded people.

 

Markheliops

 

 

 

I'm with you on this point, mate.

 

Like some others here,I, whilst useing a 'forum name', DO 'sign', my postings with real name,...'cept when I forget. :whistle:

For a post to have been opened with seemingly the express wishes of wanting full names used, does seem rather 'Big brother-ish'.

We ALL live military vehicles,.....thats the common bond for all of us, here;

 

Freedom Of Choice;...............something that a lot of blood was shed to protect.

 

(This is NOT knocking anyones sugestion,.well not too much ;-).......just my view.)

 

Andy

[Richard Farrant]

Anyone else noticed how much the forum has deteriorated since that chap Kewelde threw in the towel? I'll miss his wit, banter and that good old voice of experience. It'll be a worse place without him :whistle:

 

 

 

Hi Tony,

 

Still here ;-) I would have shed that "name" long ago, since my real name has been on the bottom of the posts for ages, I could not see the point retaining it. So the banter, wit and everything else will still be the same :whistle: Clive's post just reminded me to do it.

 

I do find trouble relating to who is who with some of these names, when going to shows, like Beltring. It was only by pure chance that we met there this year.

 

Richard

 

 

[Mark]

Well I for one am not changing my handle, it is what I was christened with. :coffee2:

 

On this point if someone does post with a weird name just PM them and ask fro the real one and if they want to give it out then they will, as Ian2B says lots of forums have run for years without peoples names on there so why change just because we are getting a bit of flack from some quarters, do you really think that this will stop because I post under Bert or Sid, dont think so.

Whatever we post on here will be/can be criticised because the outsiders want to, not because we have "handles"

 

Carry on.

[Jessie The Jeep]

At the end of the day, what is said off the forum we have real no control over. If a person using a screen name or real name says anything on the forum that they shouldn't, it won't be long before the post is deleted and the person is banned.

 

Steve ( aka Jessie the Jeep )

[fv1609]

There seem to be three strands to this debate. One is just about anonymity, the other about criticism & another about criticism away from the forum about the criticsm.

 

Although I have always signed with my name, I have now dropped the fv1620 bit, as it serves no purpose. When I signed up I thought a pseudonym was required. To use a respected forum such as MLU you are obliged to use your own name, so my ID can be trawled from there anyway. The anonymity I do find strange. It is a bit like trying to converse with someone at a club meet who insists on wearing a hood over his head all evening. You can converse but it does seem strange. Although I have to say there are a number of pleasant people with stage names with whom I regularly communicate & seem ok & probably perfectly normal. But I still do wonder who they are & where they are & have I actually already met them in real life?

 

There have been criticisms of clubs on the forum & I can understand the annoyance felt by these club officials that this criticism takes place publically sometimes from people without a real name. It has been suggested that these club officials come on the forum & answer their critics using their own names, whilst some of the critics have not used their full real names in the first place!

 

Although I only belong to only one of the two clubs often mentioned, I have a great deal of sympathy for these club officials. Some points raised are important some seem to be less so. One might think why does an official not just respond to the criticism & that would put an end to it. I think it is felt that a public brawl would do the particular club no good at all as it would drag on & on.

 

The correct thing to do, as Lee did a while back, is to contact an official of the club directly & privately with the matter of concern. (In case the WW2/PW issue is mentioned. I should point out that some 15 years ago I had to conduct a lobbying campaign because I couldn’t get articles published in Windscreen as they were on post war subjects. I did a lot of campaigning & things have now changed enormously & at the last tally I had written over 300 pages for the mag. So pressure by traditional means does work.)

 

I think it would be difficult for a club official to come on the forum & be target for flak & be expected to be answerable for every aspect of club policy or administration.

 

Before I retired I belonged to a job related forum, from time to time there would be criticism of our professional body. One paid official of the body did take the trouble to come on in his own time & answer criticisms. The trouble was that this individual then became the target for a whole range criticisms & grumbles. He was expected to give comprehensive answers whilst being subjected to personal abuse & ever increasing niggles about this & that. Most of the points could have been sorted out with a phone call to people who dealt with particular areas of responsibility. This one person found every evening was totally consumed in going on to the forum. It consumed vast amounts of energy, adrenalin & time. Because every response was countered by another criticism & if that is not responded to effectively it could be seen as a sign of weakness & so it would go on with each party feeling they had to have the last word.

 

So I have now done what I thought I wasn’t going to do & that is spend an hour & half waffling. I should explain it takes me longer to write things than normal people as I am fairly dyslexic & everything has to be checked rewritten over & over again otherwise it ends up like a Borat posting! I think I must get out more & perhaps do something to a vehicle whilst it isn’t raining!