Aussie_Drifter Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 (edited) Looks like a Meadowbank Edited February 7, 2018 by Aussie_Drifter I need to learn to stop feeding the trolls Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andypugh Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 An ironically vertical video for a horizontal engine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgrev Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 Ha, another perfectionist! Mobile phone cameras held vertically drive me up the wall too. That and the fact so many people appear incapable of keeping the subject of the video in frame, but instead wave the phone/camera around, point it at their feet, the sky etc. I do note, that in the videos I have seen from the Goslings, none of those bad habits appear.. Regards Doug Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IAN_B Posted February 9, 2018 Share Posted February 9, 2018 On 08/02/2018 at 7:50 AM, Old Bill said: That's pretty Ian. What is it and what is its history? Steve Yes, It is a Meadowbank. For some history go to: https://cobahcastiron.weebly.com/meadowbank-horizontal-engine.html. BTW, the comments about a video - are they directed at the photo of this engine? It is neither a video, nor was it taken on a mobile phone! Ian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Herbert Posted February 9, 2018 Share Posted February 9, 2018 Ian, I can't see a video either, think it must have been scared away by the comments. (but I do agree with them). David Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Bill Posted February 11, 2018 Share Posted February 11, 2018 On 09/02/2018 at 12:26 AM, IAN_B said: Yes, It is a Meadowbank. For some history go to: https://cobahcastiron.weebly.com/meadowbank-horizontal-engine.html. Thanks Ian. Most interesting. Thanks for the video, Drifter, even if it has disappeared again! Every input is appreciated. Visible progress is slow sometimes. Father has continued with the endless painting and I have been doing some bodywork this week. In the meantime, here are the propshaft ends. Thanks to Barry's printed pattern we have two super castings. These were set up in the Colchester, faced and bored, Father faced the backs of the bosses as well and scribed a line to locate the bolt holes. A slice of the propshaft tube was used as a gauge. Reversed in the chuck, Dad used a hardwood bung to give some support before facing and boring the ring. Bored out until the flexible couplings fitted. Next job was the bolt holes. As this is a relatively high-speed component it was crucial that they be concentric with the tube and also correct for the previously drilled leathers. How to get them spot on was a bit of a puzzle until I remembered the laser cut drilling jig I used for the leathers. I hacked someslots out so that it would clear the legs of the spider and it could be placed on the back of the casting. The next task was to locate the hole centres. Now Dad has an optical centre punch which consists of a perspex rod with cross-hairs and a centre punch of the same diameter. With a brass bush turned to fit the hole in the plate and bored for the optic, the previously scribed line could be observed. Remove the optic and replace with the punch and the dot could be placed spot-on. This was repeated for the other two holes withought moving the plate. The only way to get a hole where you want it is to use a small pilot drill first! I started with 1/16" dia. Follow up with successively larger drills and job is done! No ready for brazing to the tube. We can't do the brazing yet as the tube length will be fixed by the differential spider which is going to be the next priority. There is no sliding component to the prop shaft so the length must be spot-on first time although I might make it a whisker short so that I have room for some shims. Just going back in the shed! Steve 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minesweeper Posted February 12, 2018 Share Posted February 12, 2018 (edited) The DVLA has confirmed today that all of their formalities have been completed satisfactorily and as far as they are concerned, "CC1720" is road legal. We must think of and thank the late Mike Jones who saved the lorry originally and completed all of the legal requirements with the North Wales Police back in 1983 to save the Caernarvon Registration number for it. Tony Edited February 12, 2018 by Minesweeper Grammar 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asciidv Posted February 12, 2018 Share Posted February 12, 2018 Lovely to have the original registration for it. CC1720 has a nice 'ring' to it. It puts it apart and makes it stand out from all the 'SV' registrations! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Bill Posted February 12, 2018 Share Posted February 12, 2018 Another step in the right direction. The Dennis was brinkmanship but this is getting silly! Anyway, we press on. Dad has painted as much of the body as he can in flat-pack form and it really needs to go together. Like the Dennis, The hood frames are part of the structure but far too tal for the shed so I have have decided to break them by lapping a piece of steel angle inside and bolting the top parts on. It is a deviation from the original construction but needs must. This is the lower piece of the corner post, 3" x 2", the joining angle and the base which was folded up before Christmas. After grinding the back of the angle to fit snugly into the main piece, lts of 5/16" rivet holes were drilled along with holes for the bolts which attach the planks. The lap angles were too wide on one edge so they were trimmed along their lengths with the disc cutter. Holes spotted through and temporarily bolted up. Then the excitement of riveting. These weren't too bad as the snap could be held in the middle of the vice with the bottom end resting on the jaw so it couldn't slide through. A few thumps with a ball pein hammer and they were down. Then dressed off with a flap wheel. There is a gap between the braces and the angle where it will be very difficult to get any paint so I decided to prime both parts before final riveting. Again, they were knocked over with the snap in the vice but this time, I had to rely on the grip of the jaws to hold the snap. Of course, it knocked through and it proved very difficult to get a really tight joint. A lot of messing saw success but it was frustrating. Once I have my anvil here, I shall make up a snap holder to sit on the top. It won't go anywhere then! Four corner posts all complete and ready for the next body building installment. Cab brackets next! Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtskull Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 (edited) 23 hours ago, Minesweeper said: The DVLA has confirmed today that all of their formalities have been completed satisfactorily and as far as they are concerned, "CC1720" is road legal. We must think of and thank the late Mike Jones who saved the lorry originally and completed all of the legal requirements with the North Wales Police back in 1983 to save the Caernarvon Registration number for it. Tony That is good news! This has been such a fascinating thread to follow that I will almost be sorry when the Thornycroft is completed. The restoration of your Peerless is eagerly awaited! Edited February 13, 2018 by mtskull Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lynx42 Rick Cove Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 Could you not have placed a bit of metal under the snap in the vice for it to rest on and take the shock? That is what I have had to do more than once with great success. BTW this is a fantastic thread. I am pleased that I had a little easier job on my Albion, and that I did it 30+ years ago. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8_10 Brass Cleaner Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 On 12/02/2018 at 9:57 AM, Minesweeper said: The DVLA has confirmed today that all of their formalities have been completed satisfactorily and as far as they are concerned, "CC1720" is road legal. We must think of and thank the late Mike Jones who saved the lorry originally and completed all of the legal requirements with the North Wales Police back in 1983 to save the Caernarvon Registration number for it. Tony Dad would be delighted. I can't wait to see it run. Out of interest, the war dept wagons will have been required to be registered when new in the heavy motor index. Were they registered by the maker in Hampshire?. Were they HO xxxx? Or perhaps OT xxxx? I understood the Caernarfon number was in the post 1921 series? From memory dad got the copies of the registration documents from the record office. Do you have them?. The wagon had been bought by the quarry immediatley post war. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barney Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, 8_10 Brass Cleaner said: Dad would be delighted. I can't wait to see it run. Out of interest, the war dept wagons will have been required to be registered when new in the heavy motor index. Were they registered by the maker in Hampshire?. Were they HO xxxx? Or perhaps OT xxxx? I understood the Caernarfon number was in the post 1921 series? From memory dad got the copies of the registration documents from the record office. Do you have them?. The wagon had been bought by the quarry immediatley post war. According to the Chiltern Vehicle Preservation Group website the origin of the CC registration is CC - Bangor (Caernarvonshire) and ran with a prefix letter to 1974) The Old Classic Car website says the CC reg ran from Jan 1904 to Mar 1934 John Edited February 13, 2018 by Barney Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Bill Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 I must admit that I know little of early registrations. Tim is the expert in that sort of thing. I am just pleased to have the original number. I took the day off yesterday in order to get on with the HT lead tube. Fortunately, Dad has already made the support brackets so only the tube remained. Adrian very kindly bent a piece up for us and cut it to length by guesswork. Fortunately, he is a very good judge and it was over-length by 1/2"! As you can see in the photo, the ends of the tubes are all bell-mouthed to avoid chafing the cables. My first job, therefore, was to make up a block into which I could expand the tube. After annealing an off-cut of tube, I gently tapped it out and it was fine. Then I had to do the real one! There were several holes in the tube for the cables. The piece I had obtained was very thin and a challenge to cut neatly. In the end, I chain drilled the holes and then dressed them out with the Dremel. Now, the bent piece joins the straight piece via a silver-soldered joint in the middle. I had to flare the bent piece out by eye until I achieved a neat fit. This was a challenge so once again, I started with my test piece. Three annealings later and I was quite pleased with the result. Now I had to do it all again with the real one! A satisfactory result was achieved and I propped it up for silver soldering. This went well and I was pleased with the result. As the ends of the straight tube are also flared, I had to remember to fit Father's brackets before stretching them! Same method again. There should be two locking screws in the brackets so I turned them up from a bit of brass. Another piece ready to fit! Actually, it should probably be painted but I shall leave that decision to the paint shop. Steve 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8_10 Brass Cleaner Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 22 minutes ago, Barney said: According to the Chiltern Vehicle Preservation Group website the origin of the CC registration is CC - Bangor (Caernarvonshire) and ran with a prefix letter to 1974) The Old Classic Car website says the CC reg ran from Jan 1904 to Mar 1934 John 22 minutes ago, Barney said: According to the Chiltern Vehicle Preservation Group website the origin of the CC registration is CC - Bangor (Caernarvonshire) and ran with a prefix letter to 1974) The Old Classic Car website says the CC reg ran from Jan 1904 to Mar 1934 John All vehicles did not need to be registered until 1921. Only certain vehicles from 1904. Of which a lorry would be one. Though I do not know what exemptions (if any) there was for the WD It was common (probably the norm for steam makers) for their makers to register them in the local Heavy Motor index on completion. And I notice the Carlton Colville Thornycroft is HO (Hants) registered. All WD Fodens were M (Cheshire). WD Claytons FE (Lincs). Suggesting no exemptions for the WD What I'm getting at is that being CC registered is probably because it was re registered locally in 1921. I guess it will have been its 2nd reg number, not its original!. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomo.T Posted February 14, 2018 Share Posted February 14, 2018 9 hours ago, 8_10 Brass Cleaner said: All vehicles did not need to be registered until 1921. Only certain vehicles from 1904. Of which a lorry would be one. Though I do not know what exemptions (if any) there was for the WD It was common (probably the norm for steam makers) for their makers to register them in the local Heavy Motor index on completion. And I notice the Carlton Colville Thornycroft is HO (Hants) registered. All WD Fodens were M (Cheshire). WD Claytons FE (Lincs). Suggesting no exemptions for the WD What I'm getting at is that being CC registered is probably because it was re registered locally in 1921. I guess it will have been its 2nd reg number, not its original!. This is an interesting point, from early 1915 all military foreign service vehicles were issued with W /I\ D 'bonnet' No's. These took precedence for vehicle identity and all other registration No's including civilian reg. and the earlier ASC No's were removed. I am not sure if Home Service vehicles still had to carry civilian reg. but anything returning from a Theater of War would have needed re-registering as a civilian vehicle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8_10 Brass Cleaner Posted February 14, 2018 Share Posted February 14, 2018 1 hour ago, Tomo.T said: This is an interesting point, from early 1915 all military foreign service vehicles were issued with W /I\ D 'bonnet' No's. These took precedence for vehicle identity and all other registration No's including civilian reg. and the earlier ASC No's were removed. I am not sure if Home Service vehicles still had to carry civilian reg. but anything returning from a Theater of War would have needed re-registering as a civilian vehicle. Tomo, yes. My own steam tractor was registered for civilian use when new in 1915 in the BE series. It was comandeered in 1916, though I do not know for what use. It returned to its pre war owner at some point before August 1919 (when he sold it to a dealer), and I have a photo of it carrying both the BE registration number, an military markings on the belly tank. Its next owner (a showman from Derby) re registered it, in 1920 in the CH series. The registration it carries today. I had assumed this was because of the new rules coming into force in 1921. As I note WD fodens were allocated blocks of Cheshire registrations, and there are photos of them lined up ready for delivery. Were the petrol Subsidy wagons similarly allocated when new? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Ashby Posted February 14, 2018 Share Posted February 14, 2018 Excellent work really enjoying this thread, the explanations on how you tackled the various tasks are very informative thanks Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Bill Posted February 15, 2018 Share Posted February 15, 2018 On 13/02/2018 at 9:42 AM, lynx42 Rick Cove said: Could you not have placed a bit of metal under the snap in the vice for it to rest on and take the shock? That is what I have had to do more than once with great success Hi Rick. Yes, I put a piece of steel under the snap when it was in the middle of the vice but the corner posts are shaped such that they have to overhang the edge and the snap had to be held in thin air. I could have made a bar and propped it against the floor but I have only a suspended wooden floor and I don't think it would have helped much. I got there eventually but I think that mounting it on the anvil will be the best solution for the future. Just to show that we are not slacking, here are a few more bits. We didn't have the timber for the rear cross-member when we laid the planks so they have been unsupported up until now. Mark produced the last bits of body timber a little while ago so I have added the chamfers and Father has been painting. The front and rear crossmembers are now ready to fit. The tailboard hinges were done as a single casting of which we took delivery a lttle while ago. Father cleaned up the casting, cut it into three and then faced and bored the seperate pieces. They have a stud in the back to mount them so he drilled and tapped the ends. Before finishing off by breaking the edges and priming ready for the next stage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Bill Posted February 15, 2018 Share Posted February 15, 2018 (edited) Meanwhile, I have made up the cab frame mounting brackets. These are bent steel fabrications although one of the originals might have been a casting. The steel we have is bright so it is slightly work-hardened. I found this to my cost when I put the first piece in my press-brake attachment and promptly snapped it! I tried heat-treating the second by getting it red-hot and allowing it to air-cool. This was successful, thank goodness! I then cut all of the remaining pieces for bending and heat-treated them as well. One has a joggle in it to lean the hood frame backwards by 1/4" at the top. I think this is to negate the spring in the wood when the leather securing straps are tightened. All bent and ready for welding. This was done with my usual style and ability kneeling on the floor and using a vice to hold the bits. Nothing a bit of angle grinding won't cure! A few dollops of filler to hide the gaps in the weld. A polish and a coat of primer and ready for the paint shop. Another tick! Steve Edited February 15, 2018 by Old Bill 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.303fan Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 Looking like a top job sir! Can't wait to see the final result at a show. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Bill Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 On 16/02/2018 at 12:13 AM, .303fan said: Looking like a top job sir! Can't wait to see the final result at a show. Thanks! It is proving a bit of a challenge though. We are still on target but losing, slowly! We are thinking of the things we don't really need, like petrol tin carriers and toolboxes and perhaps we will borrow the lamps off the Dennis. We shall See! In the mean time, I have had a long weekend in Devon with the aim of delivering the last two patterns and finishing the body ready for painting. Painting is definitely on the critical path and cannot be rushed so the sooner Dad can be doing that, the better. We had previously fitted the crossmembers and the floor which had all been painted previously. Now, we wanted to fit the headboard. Dad had painted the planks so they could be fitted facing the seat without worrying about access. We started off by jointing the side rails to allow the front crossmember to be fitted along with the corner posts. I had allowed too much length on the front kerb rail so that was trimmed using the trusty chop-saw, a Christmas present from Dad a couple of years ago. This is a fearsome tool but wonderful to use. Dropped into the rebate to check the fit. The front plank was then screwed to it. Slot-headed screws of course. No Pozidrives here! Once that had been done the headboard was built up using the planks so beautifully prepared by Mark with grooves and seperate tongues. I then had a puzzle as to why I had ordered the uprights so tall. When I looked at my drawing, I realised that they were jointed into the cross pieces. The end pieces were screwed on from the back. After cutting halving joints in the ends, the top rail was trial fitted. Mark had cut it to length and it was perfect first time. I chiselled out the mortices. Final assembly, ready to fit. It is some weight and took some putting up but we did it. It was secured with the steel corner posts bolted through. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
10FM68 Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 This is an outstanding project. It has been fascinating from the very start and worthy of a book of its own. I have been really enjoying following your skills and talent across the whole restoration spectrum. Fantastic - let's hope you make Brighton - you deserve to. 10 68 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Bill Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 The next job before putting up the sides was to fit the rear crossmember. Dad has painted this already but the difficulty waas access to the rear of the chassis.At the moment, there is 2 1/2" behing the lorry and 1 1/2" in front and that is without the 2 1/4" thick tailboard! The only way to get in there was to push the lorry out for the very first time. After a bit of fiddling, the beam went into place. We then had to work out how to drill a 9" deep bolt hole with a 5" long bit so that both ends were in the right place and they met in the middle. A challenge! We put the corner posts up. Fortunately, I had judged the headroom available about right. The centre angle brackets were fitted. These were a bit of a pain as the holes are too close to the floor and I couldn't get the pistol drill in. I could only get sufficient clearance with the good old fashioned hand drill. Six holes through 2 1/2" timber proved very hard on the hands but success was achieved eventually. Then we could start putting the planks up, grooved again with seperate tongues. As I think I have mentioned before, the chassis is slightly hump-backed by about 1/4". We used sash clamps to spring the boards down to match whilst we drilled the holes through. Mark couldn't quite get the planks to full width with the result that each was 1/4" narrow. We made up the loss with a strip glued to the top edge. The top rail was fitted, hiding the strip, followed by the uprights. They were drilled but only some bolts fitted as we ran out of time. It is looking nice but we had to call it a day as I had to return to Leicester. I really wanted to finish the job but it all took much longer than expected. Dad has spent the week finishing this side off by cutting bolts to length and fitting them. He has also been to the foundry to deliver the patterns and ordered more wood and steel for the footstep and wing brackets not to mention extra screws and arranging the manufacture of the leather straps for the cab. Sadly, I have been at work. Oh well. We can only press on and see if we can do it. We have not given up but making Brighton is going to be a very close run thing. I have a week's holiday booked in March and we have set an engine test run date for the Easter weekend. Back to it! Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minesweeper Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 Just heard that we have been accepted for the "Brighton" and that there are nine WW1 Lorries entered. Tony Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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