Le Prof Posted November 20, 2022 Share Posted November 20, 2022 (edited) Hi All, I understand that Stuart Bray of Sturat Bray Motorcycles retired recently. He was one of the major sources for BSA Parabke parts in Europe. I have recently bought a 'First Pattern' version of this bicycle which, whilst substantially complete, will need repainting,, and a few small parts. I have found the handlebars, and Tommy bar (missing the arms, but it'll mend), but I have not been able to find another supplier of the BSA grips for thses bicycles, is anyone aware of one? I am also looking for the BSA lamp bracket, if anyone knows of one for sale? Leads to sources of other parts also welcome (-: Finally, I got a little frustrated about the lack of centralised information on these bikes, not so much the history, but the model changes (there were a few!), so a month or so ago I created a change list for them by serial number. I now have more than 250 examples listed, with thanks for the help of Lex (Welboke) in supplying the information he had to help this project. I intend to make the change information available to all soon, but if you'd like your bicycle included, please let me know the serial number to start with. This thread will give you an idea of what I'm doing, and the help it can give. https://hmvf.co.uk/topic/44944-bsa-para-bike-info-needed/ Thanks, Best Regards, Adrian Edited November 20, 2022 by Le Prof Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Posted November 21, 2022 Share Posted November 21, 2022 Adrian, the guy who was making the repro grips and transfers for Parabikes and Pyrene is Jeffrey Wilson. It's A while since I bought stuff from him, but the details I have are:- Tel 01458 251808 Email silentelms@hotmail.co.uk Worth a shout. I'll get my serial number for your register later. Ron 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Le Prof Posted November 21, 2022 Author Share Posted November 21, 2022 Hi Ron, @Ron I have a feeling that's the guy I bought some from a good 25 years ago now. Pre internet days, and I had a very nice phone conversation with him at the time. I remember he posted them in a piece of cut off plastic pipe, which was an interesting and uncrushable method of getting them to me. (-: Thanks for your help, and details when they come. Best Regards, Adrian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Posted November 21, 2022 Share Posted November 21, 2022 Yes I also had a pleasant chat with him when I ordered some Pyrene extiquisher transfers. Here is my Parabike. From memory! What looks like a "P" Lex confirmed as an "R". Ron 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Le Prof Posted November 21, 2022 Author Share Posted November 21, 2022 Hi Ron, @Ron Thanks for the photos. Yes, Lex is correct, that's a poorly struck R. In fact, I have your number from his contribution, but no details other than that, so the photos are helpful. Just as an indication of how the list is going, the two bikes to either side of yours are in the USA. Actually, about half of those listed are in the USA. R49247 is one of mine, repatriated to the UK from India, and now in France. R50823 was in the UK, but exported to the USA a few years ago for a Discovery series Combat Dealers (or somesuch) After a request this week, I'm now going back through the 260 references to try to record the colours of the original decals... Best Regards, Adrian 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Posted November 21, 2022 Share Posted November 21, 2022 (edited) Mine was also repatriated from India, along with my Welbike and Norton Big 4 sidecar body. A few Parabikes, Welbikes and my sidecar were found by Richard Miller who used to visit there regularly. His father Peter, wrote the book "From Welbike to Corgi" Somewhere I must have a snap shot of the Parabike. Ron Edited November 21, 2022 by Ron 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Le Prof Posted November 21, 2022 Author Share Posted November 21, 2022 (edited) Hi Ron, That's interesting that they should be close in serial number.. Mine didn't come from that batch, but from some others brought in by Jez Marren about 20 years ago. The spread of numbers I have is pretty good, at least one or two from every thousand built. However one thing that the listing has is an anomaly, with no serial numbers recorded yet between R62836 and R73380, around 10000 frames. I'd like to find some numbers in this gap. I had wondered if they'd been produced, then sent overseas Empire forces as a block. My searches are mainly USA and Europe, so they might not turn up frames in other countries. The only place I could think of was India. I contacted a BSA parabike owning friend out there, but his bikes weren't in this sequence, and he had no other information. The others I've located in India, or repatriated to the UK are also not from this block. I even considered whether they'd been destroyed in an air raid on the factory, but I have no evidence of raids in mid to late 1943. Being late production, I also wondered if they had gone into War Reserve stock. A problem remaining to be solved. Best Regards, Adrian Edited November 21, 2022 by Le Prof 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 I've just acquired a first pattern Parabike. Restored by it's previous owner "Peter Miller" who passed away last September. I havn't found the frame number yet. It doesn't appear to be in the same place as the later bikes? I've got the cables off to replace the frayed inners and I have a genuine BSA saddle to replace the current saddle. That's a piled arms pump I found many years ago. Did these have the same transfer set as the later bikes? Ron 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 Lex told me that the number is in the same place as the later bikes. So after sanding through 4 or 5 layers of paint ....#3402 Ron Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enigma Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 Nice folding bike! These early ones are difficult to find. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Le Prof Posted March 21 Author Share Posted March 21 (edited) Hi @Ron Very nice (-: Always good to see another turn up. I currently have 44 twin tubes listed by frame number (and have seen a couple of others that I was uable to get a number for). My total list by serial number is now 326. The transfers on the head tube (Broad Arrow, patent number) are the same as for later bikes. The piled rifles transfer isn't used on these. R3402 is the Twin Tube pattern frame. The closest survivors I have listed are R2953 (in East Sussex) and R3493 (in BC, Canada). The closest survivor I have a decent picture of is R3641 from Questmasters, here (scroll down the page): https://www.questmasters.us/Bicycles.html Originally yours would have had a black enamel undercoat with the early war British Green paint. The cast brackets for the wingnuts had only been introduced a short while before, to replace the early ones made from angle iron. Is the tommy bar for the handle bar release welded onto the top of the nut, or does it pass through a hole in the nut? It was probably still being welded at this point. The pedal arm on the photo appears to have a boss on the pedal hole to help support the pedal? This feature wasn't introduced until well into single tube production, so it is probably a replacement. It has the correct 'peaked' front fork. I hope this helps. Best Regards, Adrian Edited March 21 by Le Prof Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Posted March 21 Share Posted March 21 (edited) Thanks Adrian. I've scratched back a bit more on the number lug and sure enough there is a very faint "R" I see what you mean about the pedal boss. Must be a later crank fitted. My Tommy bar is drilled through. What does the peak refer to? I'll best compare it to my single tube bike. (which will be for sale now) Ron PS, I notice those support tubes on the crank housing, not fitted to the later bikes? Edited March 21 by Ron Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Posted March 21 Share Posted March 21 AH! I see a slight hump on the shoulders of the fork legs and an inverted "V" on the side of the lugs! Ron 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Le Prof Posted March 21 Author Share Posted March 21 (edited) Edited to add that we were typing at the same time (-: ) Hi Ron, The forks come in two types, identified as Peaked and Flat for ease. If you look at the shoulders of the fork on your Twin Tube (below), you can see that the top surface of the is peaked, and on the socket, where the legs slot into it, the side has a wide upside-down V (useful for identifying in photos). For your bike R49799 (below) it has the other type of shouders, which are flat on the top surface, and the socket where the legs slot in is straight across. The forks are interchangable. So far as I can tell from observation, all of the Twin Tube, and the start of Single Tube production had the Peaked type. Around R13244 (a single tube), the first Flat ones are seen, to around R22763. After this, there seems to be a random mix of Peaked and Flat to about R31935, after which the forks are Flat again to the end of production. For the pedal boss, there's (at least!) two types. Initially, the pedal arm were used as off the shelf, and I'm told (but can't verify) that these were even threaded for standard pedals. All of the Twin Tube, and start of Single Tube production have these plain arms. The pedal boss occurred around R21622, with an extra piece being welded onto the arm for support. The piece resembles a metal doughnut, with chamfered edges on both external circumferences, presumably so it could be assembled either way, and have good weld penetration. This first type of boss must have been quite work intensive to produce, and a second type appears somewhere before R31935, which is conic, and integrally cast on the arm. This continues to the end of production. So your pedals are WW2, but late pattern. R4154 (below) has the Welded tommy bar, and these continued through to at least R6386, so I suspect yours was originally, but the one fitted looks original, just later. It is evident on the drawing of a Twin Tube below, but I don't know the origin or date of the drawing. Best Regards, Adrian Edited March 21 by Le Prof Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enigma Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 Mine has this release thinghy (Tommy bar). Is that a early one? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 That is exactly like mine. Drilled through the bolt head and slightly tipped up. Adrian says the early ones were welded on. Is yours a first pattern with the twin saddles tubes? Ron Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Le Prof Posted March 22 Author Share Posted March 22 (edited) Hi @Ron @Enigma Since it's a detachable part, some early twin tubes do have the later tommy bars. Also, as the welded style ran out, there may be some mixing of new and old style. Below is R1228. With some variations in the welding quality, these are seen up to at least R6386, although the Standard type is fitted to R5381 and R6342, so these are either replacements, or the start of the Standard type filtering in. With Ron's frame being well before these at R3402, it seems likely that it was a welded bar. Incidentally, my Twin Tube is R6599, which has the Standard tommy bar. Best Regards, Adrian Edited March 22 by Le Prof Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enigma Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 (edited) 3 hours ago, Ron said: That is exactly like mine. Drilled through the bolt head and slightly tipped up. Adrian says the early ones were welded on. Is yours a first pattern with the twin saddles tubes? Ron No, mine is a later one, single tube. I have some pics of mine in this thread; Edited March 22 by Enigma Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 Ah right. It looks like my pedals and Tommy bar are later additions. Cheers Ron Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.