War and Peace Show 2007

[TooTallMike]

To get away from the financial debate, how's about an HMVF meet-up one evening after hours in the arena? Anyone interested? Might be a good photo-op!

 

 

[Mrs Hardyferret]

To get away from the financial debate, how's about an HMVF meet-up one evening after hours in the arena? Anyone interested? Might be a good photo-op!

 

:tup: :tup: Now your talking. Great idea. Him indoors can bumble about in his latest toy (what ever that Will be) and I'll have my camera ready. :-D

 

 

 

[FV601 (R.I.P.)]

Sounds like a plan to me :evil:

[M5Clive]

Sorry to harp on about the finanical issues of this show - but it is a case of principle here!

 

What I object to is the two-tear system that is in place at this show, depending on what you own. For example in the past I have known guys from our neck of the woods with Tracked Armoured vehicles who the organisers have been prepared to wave the £25 facility fee issue purely on the strength of what vehicles they can provide for the show. Whether being an IMPS member or not has never even entered into it the issue.

 

Again, the living history groups and re-enactment guys who pack the boot of the car with an M-41 jacket, combat webbing, boots, belts and the like and get free entry and camping to the event under the umbrella of living history. I don't disagree at all with the fact that they don't get charged - Why should they, as they are providing a visual addition to the show. What I firmly disagree with however is the fact that those of us who don't come to the show in our 50mpg Ford Focus, but instead trundle the tarmac with a 7-10 mpg piece of classic war metal - which after all, is what the show is all about if my memory serves me right - gets firmly taken to the cleaners and hung out to dry :-o :-o :-o

 

I quite agree with the previous comments regarding where can you go for 10 days holiday and camp for £25, but the cost isn't the issue, its the principle that the show organisers are willing to charge the vehicle owners in the first place, particularly considering that they don't charge the LHGroups.

 

Imagine if you turned up at any MVT National Show with or without a vehicle and the bloke on the door said "Just sign in there mate and Bert will take your 25 quid...!" :-o

There would be a human outcry.

 

To conclude, yes I go to Beltring every year and have done so for at least the past 12 years. But now, I book into a lovely little quite camp site 2 1/2 miles from the Hop Farm where there is no dust, no mud, no scooters charging around in the dead of night trying to knock you off your feet and no thunder flashes landing in your lap when your trying to grab a bite to eat! I go from Wednesday to Sunday and yes it costs us a little more than £25, which proves my initial point that my gripe is NOT about the money - but about principle of charging vehicle participants.

 

When your feeling dusty and grubby and you have just done three laps of the arena in a tank you can swiftly nip back to the camp site for a hot and easy going shower and then come back later on in comfy clothes, to join in the social with all the good friends you meet at the Hop Farm every year.

 

Its a great show and I would hate it to finish - That why we go every year. When I first got into this MV hobby in 1989 it wasn't unheard of for show organisers to offer limited amounts of fuel money as an inducement to attend an event. Now shows like War & Fleece (a term for which I own the copyright :wink:) charges us for the privilage of attending :-(

 

I wonder what would happen if everyone felt as strong enough about the issue as I do and stated that they would not take there vehicles to the show unless the charges were dropped - I wonder how the organisers would react to that ?

 

But lets face it - Unlike the greatest generation of WWII, this is never going to happen because the world today is full of people who are not prepared to make a stand for what is right - I'm used to sticking my head over the parapit - look at the WW2 - Post War vehicle debate last month!!

 

Incidentally, I also own a piece of tracked armour which (in the eyes of W & F) would qualify me for preferential treatment - In fact in previous years, I have been offered the chance of free transportation for it to the show and associated passes. Just goes to prove, its what you've got that interests them, not whether you've been a long standing member of IMPS. (The fact that I still haven't finished the restoration is nothing to do with it :roll:)

 

I think this subject is enough to get the poets corner out of retirement :-D

 

Cds

[Mark]

OK I propose that we all dont go. THERE I SAID IT :-D

[ArtistsRifles]

To get away from the financial debate, how's about an HMVF meet-up one evening after hours in the arena? Anyone interested? Might be a good photo-op!

 

Sounds good :-)

 

 

OK I propose that we all dont go. THERE I SAID IT :-D

 

Ummm - where DO we then, if not there???? :-)

 

 

[sirhc]

I think it is right that those bringing tracked vehicles get a bit of help when attending W&P. If it weren't for the Cadmans low loader most of the tracked AFVs would never make it. The tracked vehicles are what make W&P special, they are almost all in the arena at least once a day, drinking away vast quantities of fuel for the public enjoyment. This is what the public pay to go and see, this is what they can't see anywhere else. Most vehicles which attend the show are parked up from start to finish, how many of the hundreds of Jeeps or Land Rovers do you see in the arena?

 

I have used the Cadmans low loader to bring some CVRTs from Nottingham to Beltring for the last 2 years, we pay towards fuel, but it is nothing compared to the £2000+ quote I had from a commercial company. Just because we own the vehicles doesn't mean we can afford the transport, and the same is true of most people with tracked armour.

 

Chris

[Enigma]

To get away from the financial debate, how's about an HMVF meet-up one evening after hours in the arena? Anyone interested? Might be a good photo-op!

 

 

 

 

Good plan! :-)

[ArtistsRifles]

<Snipped for brevity>

I have used the Cadmans low loader to bring some CVRTs from Nottingham to Beltring for the last 2 years, we pay towards fuel, but it is nothing compared to the £2000+ quote I had from a commercial company. Just because we own the vehicles doesn't mean we can afford the transport, and the same is true of most people with tracked armour.

 

Chris

 

 

I think it's not just armour with this problem Chris - although it's worse for them as some aren't road legal. Anything heavy is going to have a thirst for fuel and thus be limited in it's range for movement under it's own power. For me the show is borderline attendable on my own wheels as the Stalwart drinks fuel at the rate of 3 mpg on a good day and has an average speed in transit of 25 mph. Not forgetting the fact it's transmission is not a lover of tarmaced roads. If I lived any further away then I'd have to be looking at transport too. Owners of vehicles like the early Militants, any older tank-transporters etc are in much the same situation. :-(

[FV601 (R.I.P.)]

Just an aside Clive

 

I have attended Kemble on several occasions and have been charged every time. Considering I am a fully paid up member of the MVT I was of the understanding that I should be allowed in free.

 

Perhaps it is not just W&P that are selective in their charging policy.

 

As to Odes?

 

There just might be one in the offing :wink:

 

 

I do see your viewpoint though and yes it is somewhat criminal that some pay and others do not, however as you have pointed out whilst some people may make a stand others will not.

 

Even you actually support the show by your attendance be it with or without a vehicle and in doing so help to perpetuate the situation in its present form. Yes there is dust, mud (on the rare occasion it rains), Idiots who spoil it for everyone (although this has become better since the marshalls are quicker to react), but all in all the very atmosphere of the gathering of so many like minded people tends to offset this, unless you are unfortunate enough to have the idiots camp next to you ( that said we as a group have a particular way in dealing with such :evil:).

 

Things like this will unfortunately happen when there is such a large gathering be it MV related or otherwise (take a look at Glastonbury etc.) its the very nature of the human beast, but to cite it as a reason, be it one of many, is a little bit of a cop out.

 

The fact that people get drunk and behave like a**holes is not the sole domain of Beltring, it happens in most cities, towns, villages several times a week and although the more sensible ones amongst us do not behave in such a fashion, there are the few who do. In my opinion it is up to those more sensible amongst us to actively identify those who play up and get the show organisers to ban them from attending. And before anyone says it, I too enjoy a relaxing after show evening cracking a few cans/bottles and jawing about things MV related and otherwise so i am not saying drink should be banned (lets face it if its not drink its some other substance that causes some of the idiots to act as they do).

 

As i've already said, the facilities at W&P have improved over the past 5 years and as of last year so has the after hours marshalling so it looks as though someone is taking notice of what has been said in the past. Perhaps if those MV owners who feel as you do make that opinion better known to those in charge it might achieve something also.

 

As to the assistance offered re getting particular vehicles to the show, I am much in agreement with Chris's viewpoint as even though some people do own armour it does not mean they are financially able to ship their vehicle all over the country.

 

Once again just my thoughts

[Mark]

Trying to ban people from War and Peace is like trying to get Israel and Palestine to get on, does'nt happen, an idiot with a high powered air rifle shooting late at night across the America's field at tents was reported one year, and he still attends because the organisers are worried that the vehicles won't be there next year, whoop weee, there are plenty more vehicles that cannot get in.

[FV601 (R.I.P.)]

Does he still fire his air rifle though Mark?

 

Last year (2005) a group who shall remain nameless thought it would be a good idea to do a bit of nightstalking with Night goggles and airsoft weapons. Result was a visit from the Armed Response team of the local constabulary along with Rex, they ended up having all weapons confiscated (including deac's, blank firers) and a police warning regarding their behaviour in general ( yes they had been a total pain in the ar*se before that with loud music and general idiotic behaviour). After that incident it was extremely quiet and I am glad to say that particular group was not in attendance this year.

 

So perhaps where it didnt work in the past it is more likely to now, who knows.

[ArtistsRifles]

As a thought - did not the Hop Farm change ownership just before last years show??

 

Maybe the new owners will be more inclined to take such comments as have made here thus far onboard and address the issues than the old owners were???

 

I honestly don't know as this year was my first ever time there. Thoroughly enjoyed myself and am really looking forwards to next years but even after just the one show I can see the points being made by the more exerienced attenders as valid.

[rambo1969]

What we must all remember is that war and peace is a commercial venture.

[Mark]

Does he still fire his air rifle though Mark?

 

Last year (2005) a group who shall remain nameless thought it would be a good idea to do a bit of nightstalking with Night goggles and airsoft weapons. Result was a visit from the Armed Response team of the local constabulary along with Rex, they ended up having all weapons confiscated (including deac's, blank firers) and a police warning regarding their behaviour in general ( yes they had been a total pain in the ar*se before that with loud music and general idiotic behaviour). After that incident it was extremely quiet and I am glad to say that particular group was not in attendance this year.

 

So perhaps where it didnt work in the past it is more likely to now, who knows.

 

 

That is the same group and I believe that they were there this year but on the opposite side of the same field, camped directly opposite the old couple whose tent was getting hit the year before, so they might have been quieter but still attended.

[john wheatley (R.I.P.)]

To go back to the suggestion by Enigma about a meeting after hours at the W & P, I go along with that. Last year I sellotaped a copy of the H M V F logo in Bertha's windscreen and invited any members to come say hello, as everyone seems to have witty or weird log-in names I don't know who I was talking to. The only person I know by name is my old friend Richard upon whose doorstep I regularly turn up with my probs. so yes, let's do that, and if it comes to a photo shoot then Bertha would be just as proud to stand next to a modern Landie as a WW2 half track, Failing that we could meet and shake hands over a glass of meths (for Rose or red wine drinkers a drop of Redex should colour it up nicely) :beer:

[Tugger]

Last year I sellotaped a copy of the H M V F logo in Bertha's windscreen

 

That sounds like a good idea, if the HMVF logo has been finalised by then, perhaps Jack could make it available as a printable PDF and we can all get a copy.

 

I'm sure we all spend hours and hours trawling the fields and it would be good to spot a fellow member and introduce ones-self.

 

 

[Enigma]

To go back to the suggestion by Enigma about a meeting after hours at the W & P, I go along with that. Last year I sellotaped a copy of the H M V F logo in Bertha's windscreen and invited any members to come say hello, as everyone seems to have witty or weird log-in names I don't know who I was talking to. The only person I know by name is my old friend Richard upon whose doorstep I regularly turn up with my probs. so yes, let's do that, and if it comes to a photo shoot then Bertha would be just as proud to stand next to a modern Landie as a WW2 half track, Failing that we could meet and shake hands over a glass of meths (for Rose or red wine drinkers a drop of Redex should colour it up nicely) :beer:

 

 

This year's Beltring I drove all around the place on my para scotter to find HMVF vehicles.

Found Mark, Sirhc, Safariswing, Mick Wilson and the Red Ball Express and a Stalward (sorry don't know who you were).

But with so many vehicles I was bound to miss some.

Got a nice cup of tea, was dangerous to drink cause Mick and me were on a moving Sherman... :cofee:

[Jack]

 

Got a nice cup of tea, was dangerous to drink cause Mick and me were on a moving Sherman... :cofee:

 

+( +-

 

 

[Snapper]

Enigma's idea of a meet up for photos is nice. But you should bare in mind that the light is rubbish at that time of the evening. The events snap team had to shoot the Reos, red ball express and convoy of steel and it was bloody difficult. The way the sun sets over the arena and the general loss of light as all the dust settles (again) after 1800 is not great. I'm more than happy to give it a go. But there will be a lot of late afternoon and evening MV events this year. I'm sure we can work out how to have a decent gettogether. I would really like to do some pix of everyone, with their motors, with their beers..whatever (almost). Discuss.

[Enigma]

Oh Guys and Girls., it was actually Tootalmike's idea for the photo.

[Jack]

Talking about Mick...........is still alive - haven't seen on here for yonks??

[Enigma]

Talking about Mick...........is still alive - haven't seen on here for yonks??

 

 

Maybe Aliens took him to conduct horrific tests on him???? $£

[Mark]

I think I saw something http://www.websmileys.com/sm/aliens/spacecraft.gif[/img] cannot be sure though

[Bodge Deep]

the light's pretty good in the beer tent 34