Op Bolero - My experience - and did it hurt!!!

[Markheliops]

Hi all.

 

Should have known things weren't going to go to plan when the low loader didn't arrive to take me and the Ward la France up to join in the fun at Op Bolero.

 

For those of you who didn't read my posts earlier, I bent over backwards to attend this event. Managed to get someone to do an exchange duty with me at the fire station, booked a low loader to take me there, phone calls to organisers and everyone else. By Friday morning I was ready to go. Whoopee. :-D

 

I rolled the Ward out of it's hanger and eagerly awaited the low loader I had booked for 1100hrs. 1200hrs, no low loader. 1300hrs still no low loader - you get the message.

 

Now anyone with half a brain would have put the truck back in the hanger and called it a day. Not me. So eager was I to get to Bolero I thought, sod it. I'll drive the Ward up there. Now the truck had performed impeccably the weekend before so I thought, no dramas - I'm happy with the truck. It's not that far. :whistle:

 

So it was I pulled out of the farm in Paddock Wood at 1430hrs and started the drive to Bolero.

 

It was lashing down on route but I made good time and reached the Dartford toll tunnel in just under 40 mins. Believe me when I say in a Ward la France - that's pretty good going.

 

Through the tolls for £1.80 - obviously didn't see my third axle - but who am I to tell tales. :angel:

 

Reached the A12 and turned off the M25.

 

Now the only thing I had noticed on the journey so far was the Ward was running a bit hotter than normal. Anyway, got a couple of miles down the A12 and BANG - HISS - LOTS OF HISSING. :schocked:

 

After the bang, my attention quickly turned to the red light on my dash, informing me my air brake pressure was zero. This was confirmed when I hit the brake pedal and it went straight down to the toe board. :schocked:

 

OK - 14 tonnes at 40 mph - Big problem. Now for those of you who know Wards - going down the gearbox and using the engine to slow down is not an option. You would not be able to select another gear once you came out of fifth.

 

Only thing I could do was handbrake. As luck would have it, I was just approaching a lay-by when the above happened. Aimed for the lay-by and yanked up the handbrake. That was exciting. Clouds of smoke - lots of shuddering - and tight bottom cheeks on my part.

 

I managed to bring the truck to a stop. Once I had er, composed myself, I had a look to see what had happened.

 

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u233/Markheliops/00000013.jpg[/img]

 

First thing I saw was the 2nd to 3rd axle propshaft - or what was left of it.

 

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u233/Markheliops/00000009.jpg[/img]

 

Closer inspection found one of the rear brake chambers - 2nd axle - missing.

 

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u233/Markheliops/00000007.jpg[/img]

 

Also the N/S upper torsion bar had been bent by the impact.

 

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u233/Markheliops/00000011.jpg[/img]

 

The air relay valve and associated air piping had also been muller-ed.

 

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u233/Markheliops/00000010.jpg[/img]

 

Now the the evidence presented to me in the form of what was left of the truck running gear would suggest a seized axle. No - the truck was still freewheeling and I could select gears and drive - odd but true. :?

 

Well not wanting to be beaten, I tried for nearly three hours to do something with the mess. My way of thinking was if I could remove the damaged prop and stop the air leaking out, I could still drive using centre axle only and have brakes on front and rear axles.

 

In the end I had to give up and call recovery - which I had the foresight to organise on Thursday morning. 8-) My day ended at 2320hrs, in the dark with my pride and joy being delivered on the back of a low loader to my starting point.

 

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u233/Markheliops/00000028.jpg[/img]

 

SATURDAY - The morning after.

 

Further investigations took place this morning.

 

Here are some more pics of closer inspections.

 

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u233/Markheliops/00000030.jpg[/img]

 

Notice the straight edge and the torsion bar with should be straight.

 

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u233/Markheliops/00000031-1.jpg[/img]

 

Brake chamber damage.

 

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u233/Markheliops/00000032.jpg[/img]

 

And the bracket

 

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u233/Markheliops/00000033.jpg[/img]

 

Brake relay valve and pipe work - whats left of it.

 

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u233/Markheliops/00000037.jpg[/img]

 

Prop end.

 

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u233/Markheliops/00000035.jpg[/img]

 

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u233/Markheliops/00000015.jpg[/img]

 

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u233/Markheliops/00000016.jpg[/img]

 

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u233/Markheliops/00000039.jpg[/img]

 

Must pass a word of BIG thanks to tootallmike who popped over today - to assist in the removal of knackered parts. Thanks mate.

 

Wish I had something good to finish with but it's not looking too good at the mo. On the bright side - both I and the truck could have been worse off - could have gone on the top of QE2 bridge. Scares me even to think about it.

 

What caused all this mayhem - not sure. My friend thinks the prop has just given way but I don't buy it. I feel it may be worse with something going on in the axle casing - further investigation may reveal more.

 

Despite the damage, both I and the Ward will be at War and Peace - static display only - unless I can work a miracle - greater feats have been known but only just.

 

Anyway - watch this space for updates and if you are at War and Peace - come and say hello - or bring me a spare Ward bogie.

 

Take care

 

Markheliops

[Mark]

OUCH!!!!! Mark, you was damn lucky there mate, are the bits and pieces easy to get hold of or is it a case of keep looking hard?

[Bodge Deep]

Jeez Mark thats damn shame...

what are WLF spares like to find?

 

As someone else who set off for Bolero

but didn't make it i can feel your pain brother!

 

I blame Jack

 

Dunno why it just makes me feel better

[Markheliops]

Jeez Mark thats damn shame...

what are WLF spares like to find?

 

As someone else who set off for Bolero

but didn't make it i can feel your pain brother!

 

I blame Jack

 

Dunno why it just makes me feel better

 

 

Know what you mean Bodge Deep - Lets blame Jack - makes me feel better. Only joking. :-D

 

Not really sure how I am going to source the parts I need. It all depends on what is damaged. The parts you can see which are damaged shouldn't be a major problem to source - tootallmike could source a camels liver if he needed it.

 

Trouble is - I think I have a major problem somewhere in the running gear. Could be a knackered axle which is running really tight or something else.

 

Until I get the truck mobile again I can't really tell where the problem is. I am going to be on the lookout for a replacement rear bogie complete. Hard to find but if there is an unseen problem - makes sense to just replace the lot.

 

How is your motor Bodge and whats the degree of damage?

 

Markheliops

 

[Great War truck]

What a blow (being polite here as i know it would be mostly edited out by the system). Apart from sailing off the side of the bridge that looks about as bad as it gets.

 

You often hear of Dizzy T's being broken for parts, but i have never heard of a WLF being done so. With all those ex Swiss WLF's in that Belgian yard for sale, you wonder whether they have any stock of spares. Might be an option.

 

What a ******* awful b*****d thing to happen.

 

Tim (too)

[Richard Farrant]

Mark,

 

In my opinion, I would say the U/J had failed, from the initial photos, the spider and cups have dissappeared, so no clues, but that is what it looks like. If the axle had locked up, you would have felt it by wheels locking momentarily before the shaft broke.

 

Try Army Cars in Holland, they should be able to supply the parts.

[Markheliops]

Hi Guys

 

Thanks for your commiserations.

 

I am in touch my David Couch recovery at the moment. He may have a complete bogie assembly which I think may be the way to go.

 

If I replace all the running gear, I should in theory lose all possibility of this kind of thing happening again.

 

I'm ok with the idea that the prop or yoke failed but I still think there's something going on in the middle axle.

 

When in drive, I'm sure there is a feeling of resistance from under the vehicle. It just doesn't feel right when the running gear is in motion.

 

May be easier just to replace the whole assembly - depending on price of course.

 

let ya know what happens.

 

Markheliops

[Richard Farrant]

Mark,

 

Also heard today that a French dealer called Jeepest, may have bought up all WLF spares from Chris Muys recently. Worth checking because when it comes to air valves, it is better to get NOS than something that has been taken off.

[Bodge Deep]

My Bolero weekend was a good one too.... NOT

 

:argh: :argh: :argh: :argh: :banghead: :banghead: :nut: :died:

[Snapper]

Really sad you lads didn't make it. I don't want to make the pain any worse for you at this juncture. But you did miss what I feel is the best event I've ever attended, even though Jack came, too.

[Markheliops]

Further investigations continued today - Sunday.

 

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u233/Markheliops/00000001-1.jpg[/img]

 

I started by jacking the centre axle and spinning the road wheels in gear. What I found was rather alarming movement - both up and down and in and out of the main input and output shaft.

 

I decided to strip down the top of the axle - as far as I could without having to actually remove it.

 

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u233/Markheliops/00000002.jpg[/img]

 

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u233/Markheliops/00000006.jpg[/img]

 

First thing I could see was the large cog has suffered some trauma.

 

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u233/Markheliops/00000005.jpg[/img]

 

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u233/Markheliops/00000009-1.jpg[/img]

 

Not sure whether this is due to wear or when the prop let go. On spinning the road wheels the cog turns freely enough so I am not too worried about the scoring and chipping. :dunno:

 

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u233/Markheliops/00000007-1.jpg[/img]

 

I have found the input bearing has a lot of movement. Now I am undecided on this as I have had two different opinions - both respected - on how much movement is exceptable.

 

One opinion is - as it is a conical bearing any movement should be taken up when the prop spins so not a problem. I'm not sure on this as I would have thought any movement in this bearing will cause a massive vibration resulting in something breaking - ie the weakest component - the propshaft.

 

I would appreciate any input from you technical buffs as I am not sure. One solution I am looking at is to substitute the axle input bearings from the third axle to the 2nd axle. The 3rd axle seems fine but is now no longer driven as it has no prop.

 

I am only considering this as a temp repair so I am Mobile for War and Peace. In time I want to fix the damage and return to double drive but parts are a real issue.

 

I had an offer of a complete rear of a Ward for £1500 - but I don't have £1500 and to be honest I don't need a complete rear end.

 

By the way, if anyone fancies a Ward la France - direct French Army release for £3000 - let me know. It has a plug missing from the engine and no canvas but apart from that it is complete. I have a spare engine if it helps.

 

So, will keep you all updated. You can see the damaged parts from the pics so if anyone knows where I can obtain bits - please let me know.

 

Many thanks

 

Markheliops

 

 

 

 

[Markheliops]

Perhaps the The Management may like to move this thread to members restorations.

 

It's going to be a long haul. :cry:

 

Markheliops

[Marmite!!]

Perhaps the The Management may like to move this thread to members restorations.

 

It's going to be a long haul. :cry:

 

Markheliops

 

 

Done :-D

 

Really sorry you couldn't make it to Bolero.. good luck with the repairs..

[YK55]

Hi Mark, sorry to read about your troubles but at least nobody was hurt! This could be the result of transmission wind-up. Does the Ward La France have an inter-axle differential between the rear axles? If not, how do the rear tyres compare in size? Ideally, all 8 tyres should measure within 1/4 inch diameter (according to google search) otherwise the axles will be fighting each other and something ultimately has to give! Are there any signs of scrubbing around the circumference of the rear tyres? If your tyres don't measure up the same then you need to swap them around so that the diameters match between axles 2 and 3. A difference in tyre diameter between the ends of any axle is unimportant. What about the tyre pressures? Any difference in pressure will affect the effective tyre circumference. Good luck with the repairs :tup:

Andy.

[Jack]

Mark

 

We are all so sorry to see that and we were all dissapoointed for you when we got the news as we know how hard you had to work to get there :oops: and I was looking forward to meeting you. You weren't the only casulty as you know, Bodge had problems too. We had a WC gearbox go bang on Saturday :cry: and my GMC was walking wounded on Saturday as it was firing on about 4 cyclinders - have to get it back from Southampton today :cry:

 

Wish you well Mark.

 

Jack.

[Joris]

Really sorry that you did not make it and I do hope you can get it all sorted out!

[TooTallMike]

Hi Mark, sorry to read about your troubles but at least nobody was hurt! This could be the result of transmission wind-up. Does the Ward La France have an inter-axle differential between the rear axles? If not, how do the rear tyres compare in size? Ideally, all 8 tyres should measure within 1/4 inch diameter (according to google search) otherwise the axles will be fighting each other and something ultimately has to give! Are there any signs of scrubbing around the circumference of the rear tyres? If your tyres don't measure up the same then you need to swap them around so that the diameters match between axles 2 and 3. A difference in tyre diameter between the ends of any axle is unimportant. What about the tyre pressures? Any difference in pressure will affect the effective tyre circumference. Good luck with the repairs :tup:

Andy.

Andy,

Agreed! In the opinion of everyone I've discussed this with so far, it's 99.9% certain to be the result of axle wind-up either due to tyre circumference or pressure differences. There is no inter-axle diff. I noticed cupping on some of the rear tyres and what I would have though was unacceptable play on the middle axle input shaft (approx 5mm axial movement as the prop is rocked, compared to almost nothing for the rear axle). This perhaps combined with a worn prop and the axle wind-up could provide the circumstances for failure.

 

On the bright side parts are available. There are at least 3 people who have parts trucks in this country as well as several European dealers with large stocks of parts (e.g. Jeepest, Army Cars and Ets. Beke in Paris). I would go for new parts wherever possible though, with the exception of the prop and brake chamber bracket which will have to be obtained. A second-hand brake chamber could be re-furbed as the diaphragms are available. I imagine the taper roller bearings are standard components.

 

- Mike

 

 

[ArtistsRifles]

Mark,

 

I think we might have passed you late Friday afternoon - have you got something written down the side of your WLF???

[Markheliops]

Hi all.

 

Once again, thanks for all your input and commiserations.

 

Yes, I was truly gutted to miss out on what would appear to be event of the year.

 

Neil, I have The Rugged Boys on the side tool box of the WLF. I suspect it was me you passed Friday afternoon.

 

Was I crying into my helmet or laying underneath the beast with my spanners. Even when it went bang, I still spent nearly three hours trying to effect a repair. I soooooo much wanted to get there.

 

I am a bit more optimistic today. Hopefully I can source spares from somewhere.

 

I will definitely be at War and Peace. I am arriving on Monday 16th. If not under my own power my bestest friend :-D tootallmike will be hauling me in. I am planning to repair the WLF during the week so I can make the Redball Express convoy on Saturday evening, providing I have the bits.

 

It should be quite entertaining really. I am planning to remove the complete bogie assembly from the WLF to fit new bits and service the remainder. It's going to be the War and Peace project.

 

If anyone fancies getting their hands dirty by all means grab your spanners and head over. Failing that, a cup of tea as I will be far too busy to put the kettle on. :whistle:

 

As for what caused the problem in the first place - still not 100% sure. :dunno: My tyre pressures were bang as I checked them before leaving. Tootallmike has seen my tyres and reckons they are pretty good. That just leaves play in the input shaft or the prop just failed because it was worn. Hey, who knows.

 

All I can do is repair it, check everything is 110% - hence pulling the bogie out - and see what happens.

 

On the subject of War and Peace. Popped in today and would you believe it - someone has pitched tent already. :?

 

Would be great if a day, place and time could be arranged for all HMVF members could meet up at W+P. Any ideas or suggestions.

 

Not putting myself in the frame or anything but I am planning to have a BBQ Saturday evening - what say you all.

 

Many thanks and keep trucking - if you are able. :roll:

 

Markheliops

 

 

 

 

[ArtistsRifles]

Hi all.

 

Once again, thanks for all your input and commiserations.

 

Yes, I was truly gutted to miss out on what would appear to be event of the year.

 

Neil, I have The Rugged Boys on the side tool box of the WLF. I suspect it was me you passed Friday afternoon.

 

Was I crying into my helmet or laying underneath the beast with my spanners. Even when it went bang, I still spent nearly three hours trying to effect a repair. I soooooo much wanted to get there.

 

Thats the one!!! If I'd been running solo I'd have pulled in to see if I could help - had the wife on board and caravan on the back though and we'd likely BOTH have regretted me stopping!! :schocked:

 

I think you were in the cab when we passed?? Would have been circa 19:30 Hrs.

 

I am a bit more optimistic today. Hopefully I can source spares from somewhere.

 

I will definitely be at War and Peace. I am arriving on Monday 16th. If not under my own power my bestest friend :-D tootallmike will be hauling me in. I am planning to repair the WLF during the week so I can make the Redball Express convoy on Saturday evening, providing I have the bits.

 

It should be quite entertaining really. I am planning to remove the complete bogie assembly from the WLF to fit new bits and service the remainder. It's going to be the War and Peace project.

 

If anyone fancies getting their hands dirty by all means grab your spanners and head over. Failing that, a cup of tea as I will be far too busy to put the kettle on. :whistle:

 

As for what caused the problem in the first place - still not 100% sure. :dunno: My tyre pressures were bang as I checked them before leaving. Tootallmike has seen my tyres and reckons they are pretty good. That just leaves play in the input shaft or the prop just failed because it was worn. Hey, who knows.

 

All I can do is repair it, check everything is 110% - hence pulling the bogie out - and see what happens.

 

On the subject of War and Peace. Popped in today and would you believe it - someone has pitched tent already. :?

 

Would be great if a day, place and time could be arranged for all HMVF members could meet up at W+P. Any ideas or suggestions.

 

Not putting myself in the frame or anything but I am planning to have a BBQ Saturday evening - what say you all.

 

Many thanks and keep trucking - if you are able. :roll:

 

Markheliops

 

Probably Lee with the tent - he always was an early starter!!!! :evil:

[Markheliops]

Hi Neil

 

About the right time - was waiting for the low loader to arrive. I had finished crying into my helmet and had kicked my tool box into the bushes by then.

 

Markheliops

[Bodge Deep]

Hi Neil

 

About the right time - was waiting for the low loader to arrive. I had finished crying into my helmet and had kicked my tool box into the bushes by then.

 

Markheliops

 

 

LMFAO

 

Glad to know I wasn't the only one to have a Basil Fawlty moment :-D

See you @ W&P (godwilling)

[TooTallMike]

See you @ W&P (godwilling)

 

Oh he'll be there, even if he has to be dragged with all his wheels turning the wrong way :evil:. Looks like we have a wartime REME field workshop display to add to our CVRT gearbox install :banana: :nut: Usual W&P then! Better put the kettle on...

[Markheliops]

Hi all

 

After a massive favour.

 

Don't suppose there are any forum members who live in or near Upton-upon-Severn and who are coming to War and Peace?

 

I have located some brake chambers and lines for the Ward repairs.

 

If not I'll have to pop over myself - I live in Kent.

 

Basically the bracket, chambers, air lines, brake relay valve and connectors will have to be removed but the good news it the bogie assembly has been removed from the truck already, so it's a matter of just unbolting them.

 

Sticky buns, tea and something for your trouble if anyone can assist. :-D

 

Thanks

 

Markheliops

[TooTallMike]

Result :tup:

 

It's well worth going up there yourself just to see his trucks. Also, do ask to see his photo collection - he has some great shots of his WLFs buried up to their rear bodies in mud winching excavators and tractors. He's a proper old-school engineer and does all his own work. I met a guy at Kemble who'd been working with him recently and said he really knows his stuff when it comes to heavy winching.