ArtistsRifles Posted May 12, 2013 Share Posted May 12, 2013 OK experts - I've been asked a question am unsure of the answer to it. Is it possible for/what stops an EU dealer deactivating a weapon to the correct UK specification and sending it direct to either the London or Birmingham proof houses for certification so that the customer can collect from the proof house?? I'm guessing, knowing the absurdity of the UK these days, there will be a reason why - but I've been asked to ask the question so....... :cheesy: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferretfixer Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 OK experts - I've been asked a question am unsure of the answer to it.Is it possible for/what stops an EU dealer deactivating a weapon to the correct UK specification and sending it direct to either the London or Birmingham proof houses for certification so that the customer can collect from the proof house?? I'm guessing, knowing the absurdity of the UK these days, there will be a reason why - but I've been asked to ask the question so....... :cheesy: Neil if the correct importation paperwork is done correctly. there should be no reason why the 'supplier' couldn't send it direct to the Proofhouse. & it Certified, IF. The deact work was done to current specs, & then you collect & pay for the certification. Talk to the London Proofmaster Richard Mabbit. He will clarify things for you, Im sure...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony B Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 Best people to ask is the Proof Houses. The law can be quite sensible. For instance, a house being demolished turned up a gallery rifle inside a wall. The builder was most upset, as he wasn't a favourite of the local Police. So a person phoned his firearms dealear and explained the situation. The Dealer designated the person his agent, who then collected the weapon and took it to the dealer where it was recorded as 'Handed in by person unkown' and legally destroyed. It is often the poloticians who get frothy about 'Showing the public they are acting', the local forces would just rather have illegal or unlicensed weapon off the street! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferretfixer Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 Best people to ask is the Proof Houses. The law can be quite sensible. For instance, a house being demolished turned up a gallery rifle inside a wall. The builder was most upset, as he wasn't a favourite of the local Police. So a person phoned his firearms dealear and explained the situation. The Dealer designated the person his agent, who then collected the weapon and took it to the dealer where it was recorded as 'Handed in by person unkown' and legally destroyed. It is often the poloticians who get frothy about 'Showing the public they are acting', the local forces would just rather have illegal or unlicensed weapon off the street! Or, 'Legaly Deactivated' with a copy of the cert then held with the Dealers records to back up his Forearms register. It is Deleiberately written into the Firearms act for Legally Registered Firearms dealers to hold previously unlicenced weapons on their books. As soon as it is handed in, it can entered into the register. then, a previously unknown about weapon, is traceable from then onwards. It can then be proof tested & marked. & then sold on as a live weapon to the appropriate Licence holder. OR, deactivated & certified as such. & sold without restriction. & struck off the register as a live weapon from then on. I know MANY Firearms Dealers who do this a matter of Legal Routine. If you think about it, it's simple really. A Potentially dangerous, unknown about deadly firearm. That was unlicenced, & therefore unknown about to the authorities. Is then bought into a controlled system, where full traceability is available for the rest of it's legal life. Otherwise, MIGHT eventually find it's way into the hands of a person who is of a Criminal nature. & possibly end up taking some poor souls life in a Criminal act. Kind of makes sense, dosent it? Even Deactivation, saves the weapon for a collector in a way. rather then handed in to the Police for destruction & possibly a rare example of whatever the item might be. lost forever!.......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArtistsRifles Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 Thanks chaps!! I admit to being pleasantly surprised as, given the UK's usual reaction towards deact's I fully expected a resounding No as the answer :-) I will talk to the proof house in London (need to do that anyway as the deac cert for my SLR is missing) and see what they say. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony B Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 Trouble is, if the SLR is an old deac, they will insit on making up, ie welding solid, to new spec. Note: The law says the proof marks on the de-ac are the legal marks, not the certificate, always check the weapon when buying! (The gallery rifle in question was in such a state the safest thing was cut it up! ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArtistsRifles Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 Proof marks are there Tony. I thought that, in such a case the proof house would check the deac and re-issue a deac cert based on the presence of those marks against the observed status for the age of the weapon. i.e. if the weapon was done prior to the change in rules it would be certified against the old rules rather than the new. If they are going to want it butchered to suit the <censored> politicians then I'll stick with the proof marks only. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woa2 Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 OK, idiot question time - What is a 'Gallery Rifle'? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simonm Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 Hi, Sort of on this subject and to do with "barrels" where do we stand with smoke dischargers, the kind that are pretty standard on Ferrets and Saracens and other ex military vehicles? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony B Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 OK, idiot question time - What is a 'Gallery Rifle'? No! Part of the forum is asking questions. A Gallery Rifle is smallish cheap gun , normally shooting .22 Short Rimfire. They are known as Gallery Rifles in that they were used at fairground and funfair type shooting gallerys. There is still one proper UK shooting gallery using them, though most now use air guns. Hope this is clear. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony B Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 Hi, Sort of on this subject and to do with "barrels" where do we stand with smoke dischargers, the kind that are pretty standard on Ferrets and Saracens and other ex military vehicles? As far as a firearms licence goes Section 5, described as 'Prohibited Weapons' though not completly- A section 1 firearms licence is issued by the Police, a Section 5 licence has to be issued by Secratary of State. De-ac as per spec. 2 inch mortars etc would be the same class. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
griff66 Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 Ferret smoke dischargers are not subject to de act i have acpo letter stating such Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony B Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 (edited) Ferret smoke dischargers are not subject to de act i have acpo letter stating such Intresting! What do they say, ACPO are a pressure group, who I know from personal experience, change thier minds like I change my socks! http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1968/27/section/5 Edited May 13, 2013 by Tony B Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
griff66 Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 will scan it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simonm Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 will scan it Thanks, that would be really appreciated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andym Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 Ferret smoke dischargers are not subject to de act i have acpo letter stating such As previously posted in another thread, I have letters from both the Home Office and ACPO saying the same thing. They are considered to be pyrotechnics, not firearms. Of course like all these things, until it eventually ends up in court ... Andy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woa2 Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 No! Part of the forum is asking questions. A Gallery Rifle is smallish cheap gun , normally shooting .22 Short Rimfire. They are known as Gallery Rifles in that they were used at fairground and funfair type shooting gallerys. There is still one proper UK shooting gallery using them, though most now use air guns. Hope this is clear. Ah, thanks. I understand now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony B Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 As previously posted in another thread, I have letters from both the Home Office and ACPO saying the same thing. They are considered to be pyrotechnics, not firearms. Of course like all these things, until it eventually ends up in court ... Andy Always the but. A dummy launcher used for traning gun dogs, and an ideal line thrower, is classed as non firarn because it is a spigot launcher. So if smoke dischargers are Pyrotechnics, where does this bit of section 5 come into it? 'Any weapon of whatever description designed or adapted for the discharge of any noxious liquid, gas or other thing' Chemical smoke is definitly noxious. Vets use blowpipes to anthetis animals. For this a Section 5 is required, as the dart discharged contains a 'Noxious liquid'. ACPO have a nasty habit of interapting things to suit themselves. They do not make legislation, that is Parliment's job, and the Courts interpret. ((That's why 'Reasonable' is the word that makes the lawyers a fortune! ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
griff66 Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Hall Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 Theres nothing to say that the ACPO wont change their opinion in the future but with that letter in my opinion you are bullet proof (So to speak) against having said items fitted to vehicles. I'd like to see the CPS take that to court and think they'd win! Ref. De ac specs, if its an old spec deac and the proof marks are legible and no modifications (Read, tampering) have been found, then the proof house will issue a new cert with the current date but it will be examined to the original spec. So your SLR would be examined and if it still meets the spec of the time with no tampering, it will be passed to old spec. I've had a number of them redone which looks a little odd to see a old spec SMG with a post 95 dated cert. Oh, they also add another deac mark next to the original to show it has been re-examined. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
griff66 Posted May 15, 2013 Share Posted May 15, 2013 good idea for anyone with mv with smoke launchers to scan letter i posted and keep with vehicle:cool2: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArtistsRifles Posted May 15, 2013 Share Posted May 15, 2013 Thanks Chris. Theres nothing to say that the ACPO wont change their opinion in the future but with that letter in my opinion you are bullet proof (So to speak) against having said items fitted to vehicles. I'd like to see the CPS take that to court and think they'd win! Ref. De ac specs, if its an old spec deac and the proof marks are legible and no modifications (Read, tampering) have been found, then the proof house will issue a new cert with the current date but it will be examined to the original spec. So your SLR would be examined and if it still meets the spec of the time with no tampering, it will be passed to old spec. I've had a number of them redone which looks a little odd to see a old spec SMG with a post 95 dated cert. Oh, they also add another deac mark next to the original to show it has been re-examined. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.303fan Posted May 18, 2013 Share Posted May 18, 2013 if a revolver gets de ac in germany, that dealer can sent it to birmingham where i can pick it up after inspection? nice, and cheaper then the 2000pounds plus i got quoted. :nut: i also have welded up rifles in holland that were legal there, but no stamps in them to prove it. i do have the police check them out in a case, and got them back as legal deacts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.