R Cubed Posted October 26, 2011 Share Posted October 26, 2011 Maybe this should be in the I am stupid section !!! but here goes. Can you put L plates on an artic and learn to drive on public roads with a qualified artic driver in the passenger seat like you can do with cars ?? Of course having an old style driving licence but with out the C1+E ? Idea of this is to gain experience of how the trailers and the size of the unit performs at junctions, bends and reversing it ect. First things first though this would only be done after some hours in a private car park to get use to it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony B Posted October 26, 2011 Share Posted October 26, 2011 Has Rosie been battering you again? :-D Yees, you can put L plates on an artic, you can even drive on a motorway. You must be accompanied by someone who has held a full licence for the clas for three years and is over twenty one. YOU must also have a provisional licence for the LGV, your ordinary licence will not cover you . In order to get the provisional you have had to had a medical. There is a special section of the DVLA to cover commercial licences, they are actually prity good. The application forms for the licence can be downloaded on line. You will also need to take the theory and hazard perception test. These must be passed before you take the practical test and are valid for two years. Reversing is a specific excercise. You start with the vehicle bettween two cones. You then back out performing an S manouvere without hitting a cone on the right hand side. You then back into a a gagarge of cones stopping with the rear of the vehicle over a strip , one metre wide. You may shunt, but you must not touch any cone. The excersise concludes when you apply the hand brake. There is also the controlled stopping excersise. The vehicle is taken up to 20 mph and must be stopped in a controlled manner in a straigh line , normally in about 2/3 of the vehicle lenght. You will during the practical test be told to start the evhicle from a standstill, move up through the gears to a specified gear, then go down the box into first,without stopping or stalling and then move off through the box. Here endeth the lesson! :drive: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Johns Posted October 26, 2011 Share Posted October 26, 2011 Maybe this should be in the I am stupid section !!! but here goes. Can you put L plates on an artic and learn to drive on public roads with a qualified artic driver in the passenger seat like you can do with cars ?? Of course having an old style driving licence but with out the C1+E . To get a provisional licence to drive an artic you must already hold an LGV licence to drive rigids Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andym Posted October 26, 2011 Share Posted October 26, 2011 To get a provisional licence to drive an artic you must already hold an LGV licence to drive rigids I thought that too - you can't go straight to an artic test these days without experience on a rigid? Andy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony B Posted October 27, 2011 Share Posted October 27, 2011 (edited) There is no equivalent of the old Class 1 anymore. You now have test for the vehicle class, in this case C, then you have a seperate test for 'Trailer Entitilment' trailers over 750kg mass. the + E. That is now 'Artics'. When the Class 3 came in years ago, following the change from 'over 3 ton unladen ' to 7.5t GVW you could , if you showed you'd driven vehicles of that size get up to 16 ton for free, like a Bl**dy idiot I didn't apply! Edited October 27, 2011 by Tony B Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R Cubed Posted October 27, 2011 Author Share Posted October 27, 2011 So what is the process of going from an old style car license to being able to drive artics do you have to do the ridged first then the artic ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N.O.S. Posted October 27, 2011 Share Posted October 27, 2011 Looks like you need a valid C licence plus Provisional C+E licence in order to drive artics on L plates - different from the 'good old days' of going straight from car to class 1 hgv. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diamond-t-steve Posted October 27, 2011 Share Posted October 27, 2011 When I took my HGV 1 you didn't even have to have a car licence, you just had to display standard "L" plates as well as HGV L plates. Then if you passed you automaticly got your car licence. But yes, nowdays you have to start at the bottom and work your way up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Topdog Posted October 27, 2011 Share Posted October 27, 2011 Yep, rigid or category C must be done first, then the C+E, E being the trailer. Sorry Tony a great explanation but it has changed since you did it and the gear change exercise is no longer included. There is however a part where you have to find your own way along the route without directions. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brooky Posted October 27, 2011 Share Posted October 27, 2011 (edited) Yep, rigid or category C must be done first, then the C+E, E being the trailer. Sorry Tony a great explanation but it has changed since you did it and the gear change exercise is no longer included. There is however a part where you have to find your own way along the route without directions.Dave[/quote Absolutely correct Provisional LGV(medical and so on) first then CAT C (rigid) then C+E (trailer entitlement) No gear change exercise any more (unless you are going for the DSA LGV instructor register) and the route finding is called free driving Oh and if you have no vocational licence (Cat C1 passed test after 1997) and you want to use the licence professionally then don't forget driver CPC If you are interested I can let you have the dimensions and lay out for the reverse excercise A really good book if you are serious the the DSA Guide To Driving Goods Vehicles is worth having (WH Smith stock them) Edited October 27, 2011 by Brooky Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony B Posted October 28, 2011 Share Posted October 28, 2011 Yep, rigid or category C must be done first, then the C+E, E being the trailer. Sorry Tony a great explanation but it has changed since you did it and the gear change exercise is no longer included. There is however a part where you have to find your own way along the route without directions.Dave Find your OWN way! :nut: That's me out then! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david56 Posted October 28, 2011 Share Posted October 28, 2011 The emergency stop test is carried out at the test centre before you go on the road. There is also a test for moving off on an uphill and downhill slope the technique is different. the last exercise is the uncoupling and coupling test which is carried out at the test centre in full view. when coupling don,t forget to release the trailer brake (like I did) however it was winter and cold and the tester didn't notice but it made driving off afterwards difficult. I would recommend that you approach a HGV driving school for an assessment lesson as with all driving tests it is all about following the rules. I found the lessons exhausting with the concentration needed 2 hours was enough. Also they follow fixed routes and there are some bends and junctions on these routes that need careful driving. You will need to check with the DVLA if they will test you in your vehicle there are loads of rules about that as well. There are new regs coming in that mean that HGV drivers will need to take a Driver CPC this is a very expensive classroom based test that comes in 5 Modules. I assume that you will be able to take and pass the this test without passing this before these regs come in but you will need to take it almost straight away after. There are some exemptions. HGV driving is a very expensive to finance and the test is aimed at certification of professional drivers so the regulations and the test are much more complicated, and with a constant flow of EU directives destined to be more even controlled (expensive). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brooky Posted October 28, 2011 Share Posted October 28, 2011 Sorry to be pedantic but it is not an emergency stop it is a controlled stop, you are correct however in saying that you will need to complete a downhill start As for DCPC (Driver CPC) then if you have no vocational qualification on your licence you will need to undertake the Initial DCPC and then immediately move into periodic training (35 hours in 5 years) If you already have a vocational category on your licence then you have until September 11th 2014 to gain 35hours approved training If you dont intend to use the vocational then you dont need DCPC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david56 Posted October 28, 2011 Share Posted October 28, 2011 Controlled it certainly was out the back of the test centre between two concrete walls and I think it was 20mph and 4th gear. What is Vocational because I don't intend to do the CPC but plan to drive my truck on the road using the exemption that it is construction plant and not used for general haulage of goods. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoggyDriver Posted October 28, 2011 Share Posted October 28, 2011 (edited) This is the procedure you will need to follow to get your C+E (Class One) licence. I have only just done my Cat D last Friday so I know the process at the test centre. Some things have changed, one of which no one has mentioned. 1) You will need to get a Medical before you can apply for a Provisional Vocational Licence. 2) Send off you licence with the D4 Medical forms to DVLA to get your Provisional Licence. 3) Your licence will come back to you with Provisional Cat C (Rigid) entitlement. 4) You will then need to book your Theory and Hazard perception tests at your local DSA test centre. This can be done online through the Direct Gov website. http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Motoring/LearnerAndNewDrivers/TheoryTest/DG_196007 5) Once you have your pass certificate from the DSA you will then be able to do your practical training. The best way to do this is book a weeks course with the test at the end at a local HGV/PSV training centre. You will be looking at roughly £1,400 for this. The test fee is £125. I really can't stress enough how important it is to train at a recognised, professional training school. They will teach you the DSA way of driving a large vehicle, what the procedure is for observation before pulling away etc. The test has changed. You are no longer required to do the gear changing exersise AND you are no longer required to do the controlled (emergency) stop. This is because all vehicles submitted for test MUST be fitted with ABS brakes. It was recognised that a controlled stop would no longer be required with ABS vehicles and it was done away with last year. 6) At the test centre you will be asked to show your licence and your Theory and Hazard Perception pass certificate. You will then be asked some "Show Me/Tell Me" questions. This is stuff like location of fire extinguishers, vehicle height indicators etc. Then you will do the reversing exersise. After that you do an hours drive on the road. You are allowed 15 minor faults, NO Serious and NO Dangerous faults. Once you pass your test the examiner will ask if you would like him to deal with your licence, say yes!! You will then get a copy of your Driving Test Report and a Practical Driving Test Pass Certificate. The examiner will take both parts of your licence and shred them. He goes onto a computer system and updates your record. All you do is wait for your new licence to arrive in the post. 7) If you are driving commercially you will need to do the Drivers CPC. This is two tests. A Case Study element that is taken at the local DSA test centre where you did your Hazard Perception and Theory tests which is 1.5hrs long. The second test is the Driver CPC Practical Test. This is 30 mins long and requires a category C vehicle to be booked in at the DSA Test Centre where you do your practical test. Download the New Drivers information leaflet from the following site for all you need to know about the CPC. http://www.drivercpc.org/en/what-is-driver-cpc/ 8) If you are driving commercially you will also be required to aquire a Digital Tachograph Driver Card. You can drive commercially without it if you are driving vehicles with an analogue tachograph HOWEVER once you apply and receive the driver card you MUST carry it with you at all times, even though you might be driving a vehicle with an anologue tachograph. 9) Once you have your Cat C licence you will then need to take lessons in a C+E vehicle. This is usually a Tractor/Trailer combination. The test is the same as for the Rigid vehicle except when you get back to the test centre you will need to drop the trailer and then hook it back up. Again the cost is similar to getting your Cat C. You don't need to do the CPC if you are using the vehicle for Personal use. So you will need to budget about £3,000 to get your C+E licence if using a training school. Private vehicles can be used for training, but they must meet certain criteria such as ABS etc. You really don't want to go there with that one, stick to a recognised training school. Your chances of passing will be much higher. I'm lucky as I passed my Class One back in 1993, so I went straight from a Car to an Artic. I also passed my Motorcycle test before all this new stuff came out. I have only just done my Cat D training and test last week. I now have the licence (when it comes through the post) however I'm still not allowed to drive commercially as I am still waiting for the company to book my Case Study and Driver CPC Practical Test. I am going to be put on a CPC course of one day before we do the practical test as apparently the failure rate is pretty high. Hope this helps. Edited October 28, 2011 by LoggyDriver spelling Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brooky Posted October 28, 2011 Share Posted October 28, 2011 Didnt know controlled stop has been removed Learn something every day Good advice about a reputable trainer, make sure the trainer is on the DSA register of LGV instructors Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
private mw Posted October 28, 2011 Share Posted October 28, 2011 im glad i passed my hgv / lgv class 1 test and motorbike test before all this came out too , yet it was in 1990 . :red: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R Cubed Posted October 28, 2011 Author Share Posted October 28, 2011 This is the procedure you will need to follow to get your C+E (Class One) licence. I have only just done my Cat D last Friday so I know the process at the test centre. Some things have changed, one of which no one has mentioned. What sort of vehicle is in Cat D ? What sort of size/weight is a vehicle in Cat C ? 4) You will then need to book your Theory and Hazard perception tests at your local DSA test centre. This can be done online through the Direct Gov website. http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Motoring/LearnerAndNewDrivers/TheoryTest/DG_196007 What does this bit cost ? 5) Once you have your pass certificate from the DSA you will then be able to do your practical training. The best way to do this is book a weeks course with the test at the end at a local HGV/PSV training centre. You will be looking at roughly £1,400 for this. The test fee is £125. I know its a very good idea to have training at professional training school, but do you have to !!! could you just take the test :nut: !!!!!! How many times can you retake the test ? I really can't stress enough how important it is to train at a recognised, professional training school. They will teach you the DSA way of driving a large vehicle, what the procedure is for observation before pulling away etc. The test has changed. You are no longer required to do the gear changing exercise AND you are no longer required to do the controlled (emergency) stop. This is because all vehicles submitted for test MUST be fitted with ABS brakes. It was recognised that a controlled stop would no longer be required with ABS vehicles and it was done away with last year. 6) At the test centre you will be asked to show your licence and your Theory and Hazard Perception pass certificate. You will then be asked some "Show Me/Tell Me" questions. This is stuff like location of fire extinguishers, vehicle height indicators etc. Then you will do the reversing exercise. After that you do an hours drive on the road. You are allowed 15 minor faults, NO Serious and NO Dangerous faults. Once you pass your test the examiner will ask if you would like him to deal with your licence, say yes!! You will then get a copy of your Driving Test Report and a Practical Driving Test Pass Certificate. The examiner will take both parts of your licence and shred them. He goes onto a computer system and updates your record. All you do is wait for your new licence to arrive in the post. What are the sorts of minor, Serious or Dangerous faults can you give me an idea ? 7) If you are driving commercially you will need to do the Drivers CPC. This is two tests. A Case Study element that is taken at the local DSA test centre where you did your Hazard Perception and Theory tests which is 1.5hrs long. The second test is the Driver CPC Practical Test. This is 30 mins long and requires a category C vehicle to be booked in at the DSA Test Centre where you do your practical test. Download the New Drivers information leaflet from the following site for all you need to know about the CPC. http://www.drivercpc.org/en/what-is-driver-cpc/ 8) If you are driving commercially you will also be required to acquire a Digital Tachograph Driver Card. You can drive commercially without it if you are driving vehicles with an analogue tachograph HOWEVER once you apply and receive the driver card you MUST carry it with you at all times, even though you might be driving a vehicle with an analogue tachograph. When you say driving commercially you mean for hire and reward / working as a driver for a company ? If you want to just use it to move your own equipment about, do you need to have the tacho card ? Is there a year before which the truck is exempt from having a Tacho ? 9) Once you have your Cat C licence you will then need to take lessons in a C+E vehicle. This is usually a Tractor/Trailer combination. The test is the same as for the Rigid vehicle except when you get back to the test centre you will need to drop the trailer and then hook it back up. Again the cost is similar to getting your Cat C. You don't need to do the CPC if you are using the vehicle for Personal use. So you will need to budget about £3,000 to get your C+E licence if using a training school. Private vehicles can be used for training, but they must meet certain criteria such as ABS etc. You really don't want to go there with that one, stick to a recognised training school. Your chances of passing will be much higher. Hope this helps. So have car licence, get medical, do and pass the Cat C then go on and do the Cat C+E ? Is there a time period between the cat C and taking the cat C+E ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony B Posted October 28, 2011 Share Posted October 28, 2011 Cat D, is bus and coach, they keep altering how many seats the vehicle can have before you need a D. Minor faults can be indicator on to long, or short. Not likley to cause a problem. Serious means could be a saftey concern, dangerous is when the examiner starts screaming and dives out. There was when I took it no limit to the number of tests, but you had to wait three days bettween tests. The taco can't help you with, stage fare bus on routes under 50km don't use them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bran D Posted October 28, 2011 Share Posted October 28, 2011 CPC is not required if you are driving for private use reasons,i.e. taking your own vehicles to shows etc. It is also not required for business use if it is not your primary job. Tacho requirements are needed for any HGV vehicle less than 25 years old. Even if its private use! There are some exemptions, but non I see that are relavent to normal use. I would also say its best to get at least some training through a recognised HGV trainig school as they know all the basics plus a lot of other facts that are usefull. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoggyDriver Posted October 29, 2011 Share Posted October 29, 2011 What sort of vehicle is in Cat D ? What sort of size/weight is a vehicle in Cat C ? What does this bit cost ? I know its a very good idea to have training at professional training school, but do you have to !!! could you just take the test :nut: !!!!!! How many times can you retake the test ? What are the sorts of minor, Serious or Dangerous faults can you give me an idea ? When you say driving commercially you mean for hire and reward / working as a driver for a company ? If you want to just use it to move your own equipment about, do you need to have the tacho card ? Is there a year before which the truck is exempt from having a Tacho ? So have car licence, get medical, do and pass the Cat C then go on and do the Cat C+E ? Is there a time period between the cat C and taking the cat C+E ? If you have an old licence (pre 1997 I think) you will have Cat C1 which is a 7.5 tonner. Anything over 7.5 tonnes is Cat C. This Category is a Rigid Vehicle Category. You can drive 32 ton 4 axle tippers on a Cat C licence, so for example, all you need to drive a DROPS is a Cat C licence. The costing for the Hazard Perception and Theory are on the link I gave you!! You just need to look for Test Fees. There is nothing stopping you getting trained by someone who already has a licence. The only requirment is that they have held the licence for more than 3 years. The DSA have certain test requirments the Examiner will be looking for. If Joe Bloggs doesn't teach you those then you will more than likey fail. Observation, observation, observation.... As far as I'm aware you can take the test as many times as you like, however the cost of failing several times will soon add up. A minor fault is a missed gearchange or wrong gear for the speed you are doing, also not doing something like checking your mirrors before you alter your speed (including accelerating from a 30 to a 40 for example) things like that. You are only allowed 15 minors and you can get them before you even go out on the road during your reversing exersise. A serious fault would be, for example, clipping the kerb on a tight left hand turn. You only have to clip it and that is a FAIL. A dangerous fault is just that. If you pulled out in front of a cyclist and he fell off trying to avoid you, that would be game over. As mentioned every truck needs to have a tacho fitted unless its 25 years old or older. I think you can still have anologue units fitted, not sure. As far as the CPC goes, again if you look on the link I gave you there is a list of exemptions. It's all explained in the download from the link, you just need to read it. Car licence - Medical - Driver Theory and Hazard Perception Tests at the DSA - Practical Training - Test = Cat C Licence. If CPC required - Case Study Test at DSA - Practical CPC Test at DSA Driving Test Centre = CPC Qualification. Then Cat C - Practical Training on C+E - Test = C+E There is no time limit between tests, but as you will need to do another weeks training it would be a minimum of a week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bran D Posted October 29, 2011 Share Posted October 29, 2011 There was some debate about having an analogue tacho fitted to an older ex mv vehicle, but after some discussions, including vosa, they agreed an analogue tacho was ok on my Drops (1992). just to add another point, although I still need to comply with the working hours regs, I dont need to carry any documents in the cab to prove this when using the vehicle for non profit use! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cosrec Posted October 29, 2011 Share Posted October 29, 2011 Small piont if you happened to take your test in a drops vehichle you would only be allowed to drive an automatic not a manual Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArtistsRifles Posted October 30, 2011 Share Posted October 30, 2011 When did they drop the slalom manoeuvre at the test centre?? When I took all three of miy test the fopramt was more or less as Tony described. - viz: 1) Pull forwards into a garage of cones then reverse back in a "S" into another rage of cones without touching said cones.. You were allowed to have the drivers door open during this manouevre. 2) You pulled forwards into another cone garage then on the command from the tester drove - slowly - forwards through a slalom of 5 cones and into another cone garage - again without touching a single cone. 3) You accelerated up to 20 mph+ and at the testers signal stopped the vehicle as fast as possible in a controlled manner. 4) The tester then entered the vehicle and you proceeded onto the public highway for approx 45 minutes for the assessment part of the test. This was all back in the early to mid Seventies of course!! :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andym Posted October 30, 2011 Share Posted October 30, 2011 This was all back in the early to mid Seventies of course!! :-) Sounds very similar to my HGV3 back in the mid-eighties, too. Andy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.