fv1609 Posted December 24, 2009 Share Posted December 24, 2009 So as that that looks like your garden Clive, is it Lee's new project? My garden? Didn't know you been in my garden, when was that then? Yes for someone so eagle-eyed, he seems a bit slow on the uptake at the moment. Perhaps its something to do with the oriental cuisine? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul connor Posted December 24, 2009 Share Posted December 24, 2009 Its the same config fv1612 mk1 (or 2,depending how you look at it) as mine was.. but the prefix MS I can not place? other than the barracade remover looking "new" I can see nothing odd? enlighten us Uncle Cliv:) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul connor Posted December 24, 2009 Share Posted December 24, 2009 Sorry, my post was on the last page, I never saw the pictures! That is indeed Uncle Clivs garden, I have been there:) That Pig is a mk1 pig that was sold to a certain Forum member, It is the same spec as my old one, wits rare because of the same reason mine was... something to do with interior in the rear.. am I correct? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fv1609 Posted December 24, 2009 Share Posted December 24, 2009 Oh dear all these people who claim to have been in my garden! Well it's a brother of your ex Paul. I removed the ram so that I could service it more easily, I wanted to put it into very early NI & I got fed up with people thinking because it has a ram then it is a Mk2. Even when I bought it from Bovington they thought it was a Mk 2! I think the slow response is that there have been two military & two civilian registrations for this vehicle But this one had things yours didn't have Paul. Both were external features. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul connor Posted December 24, 2009 Share Posted December 24, 2009 I know it had the door mods on the rear.. But I cant think what external other mods.. I know you have told me.. I fail you! I will never be a Jedi Now! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul connor Posted December 24, 2009 Share Posted December 24, 2009 Other than the two front antenna bases on the cab, and the tie down on the offside of the barracade remover I cant see anything new? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marmite!! Posted December 24, 2009 Share Posted December 24, 2009 Perhaps its something to do with the oriental cuisine? Hmmm... yes been somewhat distracted :cool2: Anyway would of thrown me because you said belonging to someone famous & not infamous:coffee: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fv1609 Posted December 24, 2009 Share Posted December 24, 2009 The rear doors had fold-down top flaps like yours, but welded up. But this had turn buckles fitted around the rear door frame to attach tentage in connection with trials of Radio Station Type 'H'. But there was something else that I have never ever seen on another Pig. I'll find a pic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fv1609 Posted December 24, 2009 Share Posted December 24, 2009 Hmmm... yes been somewhat distracted :cool2: Oh yes, well novelty will soon wear off. Anyway would of thrown me because you said belonging to someone famous & not infamous:coffee: Ah I wondered when the penny would click, as they say! I was tempted to add rude words & hurl abuse at the mods to get the post noticed! I think it was £2,500 when it was at MacGregors. I'll find a pic of this special device. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fv1609 Posted December 24, 2009 Share Posted December 24, 2009 Have a look Lee you can see where the fasteners were welded each side & under the front. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roy kinsella Posted February 16, 2010 Share Posted February 16, 2010 Hi Guys I'm new here but have been studying this thread intensly! Brilliant information on the Pig Thanks Quick question, below are pictures of later Flying Pigs. Can anyone tell me did all these vehicles have roof hatches at the rear for dismounts and is there any good photos of the layout that anyone might have to post??? Any help is very much appreicated! Roy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fv1609 Posted February 16, 2010 Share Posted February 16, 2010 Roy, welcome to the pigsty. From records I have identified only 40 Flying Pigs. I have no figures for rear roof hatch but these were relatively few in number. When you ask about layout, what are you after? The roof hatch, flyers or the general internal layout? Have you got a Pig, looking for one or modelling one or just a general Pig well wisher? BTW there is model kit of a Mk 2 coming out soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roy kinsella Posted February 16, 2010 Share Posted February 16, 2010 (edited) Ta Clive! I'm modelling a 1/35th scale flying pig for a build-thread over on Armorama.com, I've been studying this vehicle for weeks now and I'm confident I've figured out the general layout of most pigs, inside and out, however the roof area on the flying Pig is still causing me trouble. This is going to be a Pig Trivia for some experts here but what I'm looking for really is the following: * The shape and Size of the rear roof hatch/hatches? (were they the same as the Kremlin version or a different layout and size?) * was the hatch or hatches centred on the roof or could someone explain the layout? (in the 1st photo below I have a red arrow and pointer. In the circle appears to be a round hatch in the ceiling, is this correct, is this the only hatch or was there another further back that cant be seen??) * Did they ever mount the perspex glass on top of the flying pigs, in similiar cases to the Kremlin models? * In the 2nd photo below there seems to be a cage or mesh, would this be correct?? Any help would be great help guys! Thanks Roy :nut: Edited February 16, 2010 by roy kinsella missed reply name Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fv1609 Posted February 16, 2010 Share Posted February 16, 2010 * The shape and Size of the rear roof hatch/hatches? (were they the same as the Kremlin version or a different layout and size?) Same probably, I've got some top shots somewhere. * was the hatch or hatches centred on the roof or could someone explain the layout?(in the 1st photo below I have a red arrow and pointer. In the circle appears to be a round hatch in the ceiling, is this correct, is this the only hatch or was there another further back that cant be seen??) I don't know how the inside fittings went around the hatch, but it was a rectangular hatch set towards the rear. * Did they ever mount the perspex glass on top of the flying pigs, in similiar cases to the Kremlin models? Macralon was the strong transparent stuff & was on hinges to raise it up on four sides when the hatch was open. There were some Flying Pigs & some Kremlins that had these & I think they were probably identical. But neither type necessarily had these hatches. There is one pig I saw with a mesh rectangular box instead of Macralon sides & hatch. There was a Holy Pig with a Macralon box permanently fitted on some Mk 1s. Some people assume these were Mk as some had a barricade ram which was also on some Mk 1s. * In the 2nd photo below there seems to be a cage or mesh, would this be correct?? What you can see most of is the top of the other wing. But there was also a mesh shield about the full width of the pig that was elevated when the wings were open it was mounted just behind the level of the wings. This is folded down in this shot. Wouldn't it bit easier to do one without a hatch?:-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roy kinsella Posted February 16, 2010 Share Posted February 16, 2010 this is great stuff Clive,very informative, thanks a million!! I wasnt aware there flying pigs without top hatches, this might come in handy if all else fails! I was laughing when you pointed out that what i had highlighted in the photo earlier was the other side wing, doh! ..sorry about this but as I have your ear could you shed some light on this area of the Flying Pig thats bewildering me (see highlighted photos below), was the flying pig widened or was this protruding armour just an extension of the wings? ..its definitly a solid panel of some description or purpose.. thanks for your patience with this mate! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillS Posted February 16, 2010 Share Posted February 16, 2010 It's a flat metal plate attached to the brackets (and by the looks of it, the body sides) on which the wings are hung. There are some clear pictures in Joachen Vollert's excellent 1996 book The Humber 1600 Series. None of the flying pigs illustrated in the book appear to have roof hatches, though that doesn't mean that they were absent on all vehicles - one of the Kremlin Pigs illustrated has a roof hatch while another doesn't. Some of earlier flying pigs with mesh screens did, however, have a hinged mesh panel attached to the roof that could be raised to a vertical position. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fv1609 Posted February 16, 2010 Share Posted February 16, 2010 definitly a solid panel of some description or purpose.. ! Not there on most Flying Pigs but you can see this "mud wing" forward of the wing hinges, just to block this gap where missiles & "mud" might pass. Jochens book is well worth getting, but out of print for many years. I have lifted a picture from the book showing this piece (the photo used in the book is my copyright) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roy kinsella Posted February 17, 2010 Share Posted February 17, 2010 Clive & BillS, thanks ever so much, this has cleared the last bits up and I can stop banging my head (& yours!). Thanks too for the amazing pics and drawings! I'm really looking forward to getting Jochens book, I paid a pretty price for it I might add but it came highly recommended and you guys just backed that up I knew very little about this vehicle before I started my project but I think I'm getting a little hooked on these Pigs now Thats it for now, I cant promiss I wont be back but I'll post a link when the model is complete and I'll let you Jedi's give it the once over! I'll defo be mentioning the help you gave me here and I'll throw up a link to your site on my build thread (My next project is a 1980's BA Piglet from NI again and I've no doubt I'll be back to HMVF for whatever info I can get) :-D:-D:-D:-D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fv1609 Posted February 17, 2010 Share Posted February 17, 2010 Roy. If you get really hooked on a roof hatch I have a series of pics that Jochen took that just didn't have enough room in the book for. Await with interest to see the finished thing it would be welcome I'm sure on this site: http://www.warwheels.net/whatsnew.html If you follow the link from there to my Shorland site you might get some ideas. What about a model of my RUC Shorland? There will also be plans & pics from a Dutch modelling magazine for a Dutch anti-hijack airport Police Shorland, now that would be unusual as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roy kinsella Posted February 17, 2010 Share Posted February 17, 2010 Clive its a small world, Pat Keenan is a good Pal of mine over on Warwheels, drop my name in next time your chatting. If you look at the "whats new" section on warwheels, just two or so boxes up from your link, you'll see my name and my last model the Saxon Patrol featured. I had seen the Shorland site link last week and saved it to my favourites! some fantastic photos and its layed out very well. I wasnt aware until now that it was the same Clive Elliot, great work man, keep it up!! In regard to the shorland, it is definitly in the post for me to build very soon, I even have a donor kit ready for it, its such an interesting subject and I have plenty of material after buying David Dunnes RUC 1922-2001 book (which is just fantastic by the way!) BTW I'll take any photos you can get that couldnt make it into Jochens book (it was actually Pat who put me onto this book!) ..I'm presuming you had some input into this book in one way or another and now I'm starting to see why :-D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fv1609 Posted February 17, 2010 Share Posted February 17, 2010 Roy ok fine. Yes Pat has been a great help & set up the Shorland site for me. Actually I was admiring the Saxon Patrol quite recently. I'm not a modeller myself but respect those who are as they have a very good eye for detail & spot things others take for granted or not aware of e.g. the query you raised on the Pig with the extra protection in the gap by the wing. Nobody has ever raised that before with me. I can always spot a modeller at a show. They will take many pictures from all angles, not just a single view of the front & they will write down the answer you give in a notebook. A person did this very thing when he viewed RUC Pigs in 1969, which is why I know I have it correctly painted inside with white not aluminium & he took some rear shots & the inside. So I'm ever grateful for the modellers insight into how things were! Yes the RUC book is excellent I get a very generous acknowlegement. There are some pictures I contributed & there are three of my vehicles in it (Pig & 2 Shorlands). When you get Jochens book inside you wll see I am credited as the co-author. There is so much more information come to light over the last 14 years it really needs another. Jochen tells me it is my turn now! But it took a good year for him to do & in that year I did virtually no restoration work. He is always asked to do a reprint, but he can't do that as the picture royalties would be crippling. Because it was quite a low run museums allowed him to use the photos with minimal outlay. I have to say Jochens drawings are extremely good the most accurate I had ever seen for Humbers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roy kinsella Posted February 18, 2010 Share Posted February 18, 2010 Well Clive I'm very impressed! next time I have my nose in the RUC book I'm going to look up your toys Jochens book is going to arrive any day now, I cant wait, I'll get back to you soon and let you know my thoughts thanks for all your help again and no doubt I'll be back for some teasing bits with the piglet when the time comes! chat soon Roy :thanx: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fv1609 Posted February 18, 2010 Share Posted February 18, 2010 Roy well the Piglet will be interesting when you show it on WW. If you go into their forum you will see a link to a very large & comprehensive view of how the British Army is structured. All good stuff but there are a couple of side swipes taken at MV enthusiasts. One is about the colour of Pink Panthers & the other is denying that Piglet is a term ever used in service. I have corresponed with the gentleman, but I could see we were getting nowhere because he doesn't understand the difference between VPK & HV VPK ie Piglet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Elsdon Posted February 21, 2010 Share Posted February 21, 2010 What constitutes as a CES for a MK1 Humber Pig? i know it would be getting to the level of a Ferret owner to be collecting every single widget :-D but some half useful stuff onboard could be handy! So far my collection amounts to a 4 ton bottle jack, a vehicle interstart cable, periscopes, vehicle first aid kit and a full collection of convoy flags! I have been offered an original issue type recovery cable wth chains and shackles, which could be useful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fv1609 Posted February 21, 2010 Share Posted February 21, 2010 What constitutes as a CES for a MK1 Humber Pig? ...........................I have been offered an original issue type recovery cable wth chains and shackles, which could be useful. Might be Adam but it's not in the CES. Have you got Item 58 yet? Block, hardwood, 7 in x 7 in x 4 in :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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