Humber PIG Pictures

[Rover8FFR]

OMG No! :mad::wow:

 

It will be DBG or perhaps Desert ???? My son loves the 'Sand' colour better than green and as mine is believed not to be NI, but BAOR. :-D

 

 

It will most definitely not be the RIOT CONTROL vehicle with its number 4179 on the air intake plate I uncovered the other day. :shocked:

 

 

It has definitely been in something on TV or film, no doubts to look like a SWAT truck, but I won't be carrying that on I'm afraid. :yawn:

 

I hope you are not disappointed with that? :nono::nono::clap::clap::clap:

[Rover8FFR]

Clive

 

I have noticed a mixture or side mirror details between the Pigs on many forums and many WWW. imagery suggest many versions etc.

 

Can you tell me the correct location and type of mirror for my type 2.

 

I had one rectangular WINGUARD mirror on the drivers door, but that has now become brittle and snapped off!

 

It was around 6" x 4" in size.

 

 

 

Thanks

[fv1609]

Wayne your mirror is not original & yes they are prone to split. But I think it is a perfectly reasonable substitute, not only is it cheaper but gives a better field of vision. Yet it is rectangular & doesn't look out of place.

 

The correct is a metal cased item Mirror, driving, oblong, convex These are outrageously expensive & not easy to find.

[Rover8FFR]

Wayne. The correct is a metal cased item Mirror, driving, oblong, convex These are outrageously expensive & not easy to find.

 

I see and thanks! Is there a maker for this type of correct mirror Clive, as you never know when One is out and about at Auto Jumbles and the like, rooting for that elusive item

 

Also do you happen to know the dimensions for said correct mirror, or is the 6x4" about right.

 

Thanks as always

[Rover8FFR]

These look identical to the one that broke off. Very inexpensive and same size

 

http://www.johnrichardssurplus.co.uk/product/wing-1-winguard-post-office-van-mirror-no5

 

Alternatively and slightly larger / more expensive is the old Series Landrover metal backed ones

 

http://www.johnrichardssurplus.co.uk/product/w-s-gwa939-mirror-head-7-x-5-standard

 

I suspect this is the one to find a copy or original for in the attached image link from internet.

 

http://fineartamerica.com/featured/british-army-humber-pig-landrover-ruc-landrover-northern-ireland-joe-fox.html

 

Cheers

Edited April 1, 2014 by Rover8FFR
added link

[fv1609]

The original is a design going back to WW2 made by Lucas as a complete assembly 160A/75, the head under VAOS as LV6/MT3/44106

 

Glass 2 15/16 x 5 5/16 x 1/8 inches

[Rover8FFR]

The original is a design going back to WW2 made by Lucas as a complete assembly 160A/75, the head under VAOS as LV6/MT3/44106

 

Glass 2 15/16 x 5 5/16 x 1/8 inches

 

Got it thank you v much. Are the ones in the PIG in service image links the Pukka item then, so I have a visual note too

[fv1609]

Should be except for NI when anything available might have been fitted.

[Rover8FFR]

Should be except for NI when anything available might have been fitted.

 

Having now viewed and researched what a Lucas type 160 mirror is I am in agreement that the Winguard sized oblong mirror I had was a sensible alternative in terms of size and proportion.

 

The images I have seen of NI vehicles as you do suggest have a bigger mirror, but these are on the markers/ arms attached to the front locker corners, which is where they would go on an Uparmoured Mk II.

 

Thanks for the information and detail.

[fv1609]

The rear floor locker issue was solved with ready made trays & got the storage of the larger items sorted.

 

 

 

No ready made options for the smaller footwell lockers. Skilled metal workers should look away now!

 

These are just posted to encourage other Pig owners to make use of the holes & bracket supports that must surely exist in their own Pig.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I decided not to make a drain hole as I didn't want the locker contents to get damp whenever I puddled or power washed the chassis.

[Rover8FFR]

Clive

 

I think you have done a good job of those my friend.

 

Pretty good metal bashing if you ask me :cool2:

 

Given me some ideas about fabrication

[fv1609]

Wayne I imagine you'll have to remake your footwell lockers or are they fairly intact?

 

There was no way I could bend it all in one piece, so decided on two sections. The first one I made for the other side was a symmetry between the two sections. This was a mistake not only was bending more difficult but there was a vertical join in a pair of facing walls. The second method was much better. The sheet in the grip of the "bending machine" was just bashed flat with a wooden block to try to get it at right angles.

 

When you get the floor up, I would be interested to see how the tops of the small lockers are formed. I had imagined I might have had to weld a small strip around the perimeter, but it seems fairly rigid as it is. I suspect in the original the edge was just folded back on itself.

 

I would start soaking oil into your floor fixings now, as the cup washers trap moisture & it ensures the thread is pretty rusty. The Urwin set will be handy but will snap them if you are not careful. Although you must have got the top off the rear locker ok. Being able to get the floor up easily does make life easier. Not least as it is the only way to get to the infamous upper stud on the torque reaction bracket.

[Rover8FFR]

Clive

 

The front foot lockers do appear to be in reasonable order. On first impressions. Albeit only viewed from underneath :undecided:

 

Thanks for the advice on the floor plate fixings. Perhaps some gentle heat and a blast of penetrating oil would be wise from what you are describing. That has worked wonders for me in the past with stubborn seized fixings.

 

I will give it a go and tell you how I get on

 

The rear locker cover had already been undone and was just sat in-situ.

 

It would be really nice if the front lockers contained some hidden treasures like the rear one did. I suspect not, but will have to wait and see.

[Luke131]

Hello I wondered if any of you Humber Vehicle aficionados would be able to help with a stowage issue for a model project. The attached photo is of the inside offside wall of the Humber Hornet Malkara launcher vehicle. My questions are;

1) The small yellow tubes on the top right corner. I think they are probably for smoke canisters/cylinders for the exterior launchers. But does any one have a picture of what the canister looks like from a 1960s vehicle?

 

2) Below the five canister holders are three racks. I think the two smaller ones on the right are for GPMG ammunition cans. But what would the larger one on the left for?

 

3) To the left and on the end of the launching guide system ( big silver box with dial) are clips. What are these for FN rifle or bren gun ammunition clips?

 

Thanks

 

Luke131

[Rover8FFR]

[ATTACH=CONFIG]90538[/ATTACH]Hello I wondered if any of you Humber Vehicle aficionados would be able to help with a stowage issue for a model project. The attached photo is of the inside offside wall of the Humber Hornet Malkara launcher vehicle. My questions are;

1) The small yellow tubes on the top right corner. I think they are probably for smoke canisters/cylinders for the exterior launchers. But does any one have a picture of what the canister looks like from a 1960s vehicle?

 

2) Below the five canister holders are three racks. I think the two smaller ones on the right are for GPMG ammunition cans. But what would the larger one on the left for?

 

3) To the left and on the end of the launching guide system ( big silver box with dial) are clips. What are these for FN rifle or bren gun ammunition clips?

 

Thanks

 

Luke131

 

Luke I would imagine Mr Elliott is very excited by this image and if he does not reply. I. For One, will be GOBSMACKED!

 

It will take his eye of lecturing me about getting my brakes fixed.... LoL :-D;) :cool2:

[fv1609]

1) The small yellow tubes on the top right corner. I think they are probably for smoke canisters/cylinders for the exterior launchers. But does any one have a picture of what the canister looks like from a 1960s vehicle?

Luke they are indeed. If that is 05BK02 there should be drill rounds in the launchers under the canvas covers. Well they were there when I returned it to the Museum a few years ago.

 

 

 

2) Below the five canister holders are three racks. I think the two smaller ones on the right are for GPMG ammunition cans. But what would the larger one on the left for?

3) To the left and on the end of the launching guide system ( big silver box with dial) are clips. What are these for FN rifle or bren gun ammunition clips?

Apart from the GPMG the crew were provided with two SMGs there being a mount on each side of the cab behind the front seats. There was also a Pistol, signal, No.1 Mk 5 I expect you have seen the storage box for that.

 

You also of course have storage boxes for ammo beneath the driver's step. The other side was used for the brew equipment. I'm afraid have no particular knowledge (or interest) in guns so can't provide detail of the racks.

 

The definitive reference should be a User Handbook but there wasn't one. There was a pamphlet RAC Training Armour Part 5 The Parachute Squadron RAC published 1965 but that was more of a tactics document focussing on the GW role.

 

The nearest thing to a User Handbook was EMER GUIDED WEAPONS U022 Part 1 1962-3. Unfortunately that describes the pre-production/very early Hornet. Originally the racks you show in the photo were not there & neither was the extractor fan. That space was occupied by a rather larger box containing Stabilised Power Unit No.2. It was only when that was replaced by the transistorised power unit was that space available.

 

A word of advice if you are making a model. Be wary of official photos as they are predominantly of prototypes not the in service vehicle. I have seen a model that one side is from a prototype & the other from an in service launcher. So it ended up with a jerrycan on both sides at the top! But the modeller seemed unconvinced as he had official photographs.

 

The position changed with the change of power units & the addition of the extractor fan. Also bear in mind the length increased with the addition of the smoke launchers & IR headlights, so official documents understate the length as indeed does the Para Sqn RAC website (& a few other details).

[Luke131]

Thanks for your prompt replies . The Tank Museum have two in their collection, one being the prototype on display, the other a production version in storage. The Museum staff think the production version was brought down from the camp when the rest of them were retired.

 

Still wondering what goes in that larger shelf/rack though

 

Thanks

 

Luke

[fv1609]

The Tank Museum have two in their collection, one being the prototype on display, the other a production version in storage. The Museum staff think the production version was brought down from the camp when the rest of them were retired.

 

Luke I'm not sure that the information you have been given is correct. There were two main batches of production Hornets being completed in July 1962 & January 1963. Both of the those Hornets were part of the second batch.

 

The prototypes were built in mid 1961-early 1962. The wooden bodied mock up in 1958.

 

The display Hornet 06 BK 66 was struck off to the RAC Museum on 23/10/70.

 

The reserve Hornet 05 BK 02 was struck off to the Airborne Forces Museum on 23/7/70 & was with at least two other museums before it appeared at Bovington.

 

But I'm afraid I'm no nearer to answering you query about the racks. You could consider making a model of a prototype. Then you need not have those large racks & I could provide a photo of the power unit & no need to make the fan cowl, smoke dischargers, IR headlights, separation kit on the wing, nullometer etc :-D

[Luke131]

Clive thanks but I am concentrating on the reserve hornet with all its kit in 1/35th scale .The model is going to be a master for Accurate Armour. The attached photo is the model hull. The model is a bit more advanced now than this photo.

 

Regards

Luke

 

[fv1609]

That's a super job Luke & I look forward to seeing it evolve.

 

Given that you are clearly doing a precision job there are few points I should mention how the storage Hornet differs from the display one. Apart from not having that cage(!) I imagine you can get freer access without visitors wanting to climb in as well!

 

IR Lamp boxes - I made these they are closish copies but the actual construction may differ from original

 

Main arm latches - These steady the arm when driving & are designed to fall downwards once the arm is raised. I push fitted two wooden blocks so that the latches were held open once the arm was lowered again.This avoided someone standing underneath holding the latches open.

 

Exhaust system - As you have realised the front exhaust system differs from the rear exit on prototypes & Pigs. For this there is a distended belly plate. A replacement exhaust was impossible to find. The silencer I fitted was used on a Bedford Midivan & the tail pipe from a Citroen car. You will note that the original has more of a sweep to it.

 

Main ram canvas - The original had rotted through I had a saddler make up a copy but the eyelet arrangements may not be accurate.

 

Tilt ram - This was seized & the seals etc no longer available. I had a new metric ram made, few would know but it does differ a little.

 

Repaired locker - People would tell me that it was crude, but that was an in service repair

 

NATO socket - I fitted that as I used to tow a trailer to shows. Although there is a NATO hitch (still missing on the display one?) that was for recovery, towing etc rather than for normal use with a trailer.

 

Fin & wing storage - I think some of the slide rails in the rear are missing. Best to check with the display one.

 

Battery tray - This was missing. I made a sliding tray I think quite unlike the original. Based on the materials I had & ease of use.

 

Transfers - The large coloured 2 RTR crest although authentic is wrong for the Hornet, but it was all I could get at the time. I was able to get one transfer that is correct being the small silver crest on a black square.

 

Mud flaps - Not sure if those are original I think I may have made those from the floor of a Fiat Panda. The original has several broad vertical ribs.

 

Other points.

 

The separation firing kit on the wing is of course is detachable. One quite famous book dismisses it as "may not be original".

 

The anti slip tracks under the upper jerrycan although now pointless are original as it goes back to the time before the extractor fan when the jerrycan was mounted on the off-side.

 

Leave the bridge plate blank. The display vehicle for some reason shows '7' when it should be class '6' but the bridge class was never marked up in service.

 

I don't know whether you have decided to have Mk1 or Mk1A missiles but the venturi differ as does the wing illumination flares/lights. I have seen these mixed up before. But of course it will depend as with the markings what time period you want to represent or whether there will be an option for different markings.

 

Anyway good luck with the project.

[Rover8FFR]

With all this knowledge it is likely to be a 'Very' accurate model indeed.

 

Clive - Please tell me you have not scribed all that data from memory! :readbook::bow:

[fv1609]

Clive - Please tell me you have not scribed all that data from memory!

Um well yes. It was a 14-year relationship that cost me many thousands, one doesn't forget these things.

[Rover8FFR]

Um well yes. It was a 14-year relationship that cost me many thousands, one doesn't forget these things.

 

Wow! I have so much to learn from you my friend. It took me 14 months to find the TRB :cool2:

[fv1609]

At least the TRB on that Hornet was always pretty tight. Although not always so with the torsion bar securing bolts which needed constant checking.

[Luke131]

Thanks Clive I might come back to you later with some more questions.

The attached picture has my last model in it, the Comet.

Luke

Edited May 16, 2014 by Luke131