ploughman Posted September 13, 2014 Share Posted September 13, 2014 Simple use a spanner. In this case no. Currently I am struggling to undo a castellated nut 66mm across the flats. So far it has resisted the use of a spanner. Spanner with as big an extension tube as I can get near it. WD40 in copious amounts. Being heated to cherry red. All combinations of the above. Access to it is very tight and the spanner will only be able to turn the nut one face at a time if ever it gets moving. The problem is that I have maybe 30 of these nuts to get off and I do need to reuse them if at all possible. It may be that we will need to go for an impact wrench 1 inch drive any tips for the most reasonable heavy duty type? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fv1609 Posted September 13, 2014 Share Posted September 13, 2014 Bryan I have some of these: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Irwin-Industrial-Tool-Co-53901-Extractor-1-4-With-3-8-Drive-/331317148934?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4d240a7d06 That single one is an expensive example but it shows how the tool cuts into the nut & grips the more it is turned. There are two main size sets available, I have both kits because they are fantastic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon_M Posted September 13, 2014 Share Posted September 13, 2014 Declare Independence ? ah, perhaps not then .... One genuine thought which might save you a lot of grief - first check it isn't left hand thread. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mash Posted September 13, 2014 Share Posted September 13, 2014 Try soaking it in brake fluid, sometimes an attempt to tighten can free it on the threads. I had a very stubborn ball joint to remove and soaking in plus gas (much better than wd40) heating it to cherry red then soaking in brake fluid, then spanner on and a few big hits either direction then a bit more of the above before just shocking it loose, a deadblow hammer is best for this job. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Ashby Posted September 13, 2014 Share Posted September 13, 2014 Declare Independence ? ah, perhaps not then .... Tut! Tut! Gordon you know you'd miss us :-( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Degsy Posted September 13, 2014 Share Posted September 13, 2014 Bryan I have some of these: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Irwin-Industrial-Tool-Co-53901-Extractor-1-4-With-3-8-Drive-/331317148934?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4d240a7d06 That single one is an expensive example but it shows how the tool cuts into the nut & grips the more it is turned. There are two main size sets available, I have both kits because they are fantastic. Whilst I agree they are a very useful tool I'm pretty sure they don't go up to 66mm Clive;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Ashby Posted September 13, 2014 Share Posted September 13, 2014 If you want to re use the nuts I would go for mild heat followed by diesel and then an impact wrench turned up to max. As Mash suggests tighten first then undo then tighten again back an forth to clear the threads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
single speed Posted September 13, 2014 Share Posted September 13, 2014 Having pulled apart steam engines which have been derelict for 50 years I would suggest getting them cherry red and using a 3/4 drive socket and long bar ( with scaffold pole extension if needed). Eat your weetabix first! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon_M Posted September 13, 2014 Share Posted September 13, 2014 Tut! Tut! Gordon you know you'd miss us :-( Course I would Pete, but they'd probably throw me out anyway since I was born in Cheshire, might have to seek asylum.. Those Irwin things look the business, but according to the ad they only ship in US voltage :cool2: Personally I've found 3/4" or 1" square drives are the key - way too easy to break a 1/2" drive, even a good one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fv1609 Posted September 13, 2014 Share Posted September 13, 2014 Whilst I agree they are a very useful tool I'm pretty sure they don't go up to 66mm Clive;) Silly me! Yes I think you are right Derek. In the excitement I missed the metric bit :blush: such is my enthusiasm for Irwins! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ploughman Posted September 14, 2014 Author Share Posted September 14, 2014 Having pulled apart steam engines which have been derelict for 50 years I would suggest getting them cherry red and using a 3/4 drive socket and long bar ( with scaffold pole extension if needed). Eat your weetabix first! I have 3 extensions. No 1 a 3 ft tube No 2 a 6 ft tube and No 3 a Bus Stop In this case with space available I can't even get No 1 in there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
single speed Posted September 14, 2014 Share Posted September 14, 2014 I know this is a daft question but as it is a castellated nut is there still a pin through the thread? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
79x100 Posted September 14, 2014 Share Posted September 14, 2014 Can you get a hydraulic torque wrench head in there ? http://www.hytorc.co.uk/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radiomike7 Posted September 14, 2014 Share Posted September 14, 2014 You haven't stated the application but to cover all bases have you checked they are not left hand thread? 65mm AF is big and definitely in to 1" square drive territory. Have you got access for a flogging wrench? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rustexpert Posted September 14, 2014 Share Posted September 14, 2014 Life is short, restoration time is precious. I am assuming the male threaded part is not sacrificable; burn the nut carefully away or if you aren't confident enough grind the nut away until it is thin enough to split away with a cold chisel (will only take a few minutes!) The time saved will mean you can get on with something else; if there's 60 off then if you waste half an hour on each one that's more than a day of your life. I'm assuming you ain't getting paid by the hour. On the stuff I work on a nut which puts up a struggle will usually bring the thread on the male part off with it anyway. Nuts can be replaced easily even if you have to have a batch made up specially. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eddy8men Posted September 14, 2014 Share Posted September 14, 2014 like most guys I'd also try to get it white hot and spanner it off, failing that if you can get it in a 4" grinder with 1mm cutting blade to split the nut and relieve the tension. good luck with it, it sounds like a lot of hard work ahead rick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruxy Posted September 14, 2014 Share Posted September 14, 2014 (edited) 66mm AF in a railway shop would be just starting to get big , so we would use the gas axe & bottles , we had piped propane - big stuff we would go to oxy /propane to get the heat in quick to the nut & not the bolt. If you wished to save the nut , then if heat alone + spanner (also we used a Fairey liquid bottle to squirt graphited penetrating oil when hot) , did not loosen , then we would vibrate the nut (& rust on threads) using a rivetting hammer with anvil dolly or just a "buster out" whatever was handy (Fitters were only supposed to pick up the buster LoL ). Rust does not like shock ! Failing that , we would just cut off abt. 1/3 of the hex. nut away (to within 1/4" of threads) & bray away with a 2 lb hammer to spread the nut apart whilst white hot. I have seen some clever trade boilersmith / burner welders frequently blow the nut off without blowing any of the bolt threads away - lots of practice.. Edited September 14, 2014 by ruxy spelin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radiomike7 Posted September 14, 2014 Share Posted September 14, 2014 bray away with a 2 lb hammer That's a new one on me, I had to look it up:red:, Yorkshire slang apparently. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruxy Posted September 14, 2014 Share Posted September 14, 2014 Hadaway mon , next county up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ploughman Posted September 14, 2014 Author Share Posted September 14, 2014 (edited) Had another attempt today. The Nut won again. Re pin through castellation. Pin is out and hole is clear. I think friday will see the demise of the nut, we really need to see if we can reuse it but time is passing and we all have better things to do than spend too much time on this. For the sharp eyed the spanner has been sacrificed to this task, it was 65mm but I ground it out to fit. The bolt with the washers is just holding the back plate in temporarily. I had to burn those 3 off in the end as well. I have also spent about 5 hours needle gunning the crap off, I know it doesn't look it. About an inch deep all over in stone dust. Edited September 14, 2014 by ploughman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Farrant Posted September 14, 2014 Share Posted September 14, 2014 Had another attempt today.The Nut won again. Re pin through castellation. Pin is out and hole is clear. I think friday will see the demise of the nut, we really need to see if we can reuse it but time is passing and we all have better things to do than spend too much time on this. I have had good results in cases like this of shocking the nut on its flanks. This stretches it slightly to break the bond on the thread and the nut can often be reused if of an odd size like this one. I have an old flat chisel with the end ground flat, approx. 3/16", using this and a heavy hammer strike it on the centre of the nut's flat inline with the bolt or stud. Best it you can do it in more than one place but not always able to. I had a similar sized nut to this where it was not practical to use heat and with the blunt chisel treatment, a 3/4" drive socket and long bar it released with no damage to nut or bolt, but had not been touched for 70 years or more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Hall Posted September 14, 2014 Share Posted September 14, 2014 Looking at that nut, I can see nothing wrong with it and it should go so is there something we're not seeing? Have you got a Torque wrench on it? I'm intrigued as to how much Torque you've applied to it. I've removed much, much worse nuts with a lot less effort so there must be something going on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ploughman Posted September 15, 2014 Author Share Posted September 15, 2014 If anyone can supply the torque figure for an 17 stone body bouncing up and down at the end of a 3ft extension tube. We have not had this sort of difficulty in the past either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon_M Posted September 15, 2014 Share Posted September 15, 2014 (edited) Taking a step back and having a look - there's nothing wrong with that, and nothing tricky either as it is an ordinary castellated nut locked with a split pin. It is just going to be a case of applying enough force. Given that you have a pile of these to do, I'd be hiring a small air or electric powered hydraulic pack with a torque multiplier and a socket that fitted as neatly as you can get. Probably not worth the hire cost for a single nut, but if you have dozens of them ... Best source for that gear is a company that makes and breaks pipe equipment flanges for petrochemical or offshore, like Hydratight or Destec. http://www.destec.co.uk/on-site/bolt-tensioning This would involve some expenditure but you'd save it back in time, effort, blood, and probably buying replacement nuts if you have a pile of them to do. Edited September 15, 2014 by Gordon_M Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ploughman Posted September 15, 2014 Author Share Posted September 15, 2014 Thanks for that. Will investigate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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