Sam Posted September 20, 2009 Share Posted September 20, 2009 hello all, i'm looking to find a pre '60 english truck suitable for towing a 36ft 9 ton showman's wagon. previously i've owned and fixed up all sorts of trucks, but nothing this old, so any thoughts as to what type to aim for - ie is a commer Q4 / bedford RL man enough for the job, or should i be thinking scammell? i'm interested in mack and reo, but the parts availability is something i'd be concerned about. and budget? looking for something that runs n rolls but likely to be pretty in need of attention, with a view to full restoration over a number of years. your views would be welcome, sam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulob1 Posted September 20, 2009 Share Posted September 20, 2009 hmm towing 9 tons...i presume you mean on a fairly regular basis...if that is the case then i think your options are fairly limited and i would realisitically go for an ex commercial truck rather than a military one to be honest. military trucks carry a lot of additional weight with the all wheel drive and are not really that practical for moving things heavy at commercial pace and regularity..., great in the mud but i guess you will on road most of the time.. But not as much fun i am sure...what sort of journeys are yopu doing and what time pressures do you have etc on getting to locations etc and how many miles do you plan to do.... I assume you have your HGV or C1+E Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam Posted September 20, 2009 Author Share Posted September 20, 2009 towing not too often - from event to event and field to field, short runs. and yes, the appeal of it is not just about being practical! i'd be happy to have something that could maintain 25 / 30mph on the flat, but also need it for a little off road towing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ian2b Posted September 22, 2009 Share Posted September 22, 2009 hello all, i'm looking to find a pre '60 english truck suitable for towing a 36ft 9 ton showman's wagon. previously i've owned and fixed up all sorts of trucks, but nothing this old, so any thoughts as to what type to aim for - ie is a commer Q4 / bedford RL man enough for the job, or should i be thinking scammell? sam I would say the Bedford RL is a bit to small for towing 9 tons, how about something like a Militant or Matador Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antarmike Posted September 22, 2009 Share Posted September 22, 2009 The Matador handbook gives a towed load of 8 tons, though I have had 24 tons behind one, and that is painfully slow. My gut feeling is you will need something bigger than the 7.7. The 11.3 AEC in Milly would cope much better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam Posted September 22, 2009 Author Share Posted September 22, 2009 hello again, thanks for the pointers. so something in the region of this scammell http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/SCAMMELL-PIONE...d=p3286.c0.m14 would be more the weight to be considering? i won't be in a hurry, but equally don't want to be shunted off the road or cook the engine / axles with work. have looked at bedford RL and commer Q4 - i know people who have towed showman's with both. apparently it will do it, but just not the right machine. there's a Reo on ebay that i considered, though by the time i'd made it diesel the cost would be getting high for a tatty vehicle, plus the rating on those is pretty low really. just wait n see what comes along.... a friend had a 6x6 1942 or 4 mack, did the job beautifully. bearings, seals etc i'm guessing are sourcable using the measurments. what about when it comes to new axle or gearbox time? are there some types that are more easily soucable than others? thanks again for the pointers, really helps, sam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daz76 Posted September 22, 2009 Share Posted September 22, 2009 i'd be happy to have something that could maintain 25 / 30mph on the flat. I believe the Pioneer might struggle with this :sweat:-maybe an Explorer/Constructor or as Mike says the Milli. Good luck with the search anyway. Daz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radiomike7 Posted September 22, 2009 Share Posted September 22, 2009 I believe the Pioneer might struggle with this :sweat:-maybe an Explorer/Constructor or as Mike says the Milli. Good luck with the search anyway. Daz The Pioneer is a TRMU30 tank transporter and will do an absolute max of 18mph. Go wlth the Milly as Mike suggested, the only drawback being the heavy steering. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gritineye Posted September 22, 2009 Share Posted September 22, 2009 should i be thinking scammell? I think so, well I would wouldn't I. so something in the region of this scammell http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/SCAMMELL-PIONE...d=p3286.c0.m14 would be more the weight to be considering? a friend had a 6x6 1942 or 4 mack, did the job beautifully. You can't go far wrong with an Explorer, it does the job well and you will always be finding new ways to play with it. With a good Diesel in one you can maintain a good road speed, and they come up for sale often. The Mack NO types are as you say very good too, A friend of mine has one and tows 12.5 tons reliably and regularly. there are a few resto projects lying around if you start asking you may find one quite easily. They also have the kudos of being wartime. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antar Posted September 23, 2009 Share Posted September 23, 2009 hello again, thanks for the pointers. so something in the region of this scammell http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/SCAMMELL-PIONE...d=p3286.c0.m14 would be more the weight to be considering? i won't be in a hurry, but equally don't want to be shunted off the road or cook the engine / axles with work. have looked at bedford RL and commer Q4 - i know people who have towed showman's with both. apparently it will do it, but just not the right machine. there's a Reo on ebay that i considered, though by the time i'd made it diesel the cost would be getting high for a tatty vehicle, plus the rating on those is pretty low really. just wait n see what comes along.... a friend had a 6x6 1942 or 4 mack, did the job beautifully. bearings, seals etc i'm guessing are sourcable using the measurments. what about when it comes to new axle or gearbox time? are there some types that are more easily soucable than others? thanks again for the pointers, really helps, sam Just picking up on your comment about putting a diesel in a Reo, it already is diesel (multifuels will run on anything between petrol and diesel). DOES YOUR LIVING VAN HAVE AIR BRAKES ? YOU HAVE ALSO GOT TO CONCIDER STOPPING AS WELL AS GOING ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulob1 Posted September 24, 2009 Share Posted September 24, 2009 if you are considering a US truck then why not a russian one equally interesting, and usually with a bit of individuality thrown in too...a ural 375 d early 70's model, or a zil 131, I know where there is a part converted (diesel engine is in just the plumbing and other type of work to be done...that will tow 9 tons easily..., it has air brakes, can work your truck and they are not bad off road 6 x 6 or 6 x 4 which makes them not bad on road too...especially if you get the tyres changed to michelins or goodyears.. you could then fit a box body on the back of the zil and use that for storage of a generator or as more living space...or an office or workshop etc..pm if you want mroe detail.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam Posted September 24, 2009 Author Share Posted September 24, 2009 hi there this is helping - thank you all! the living van - air brakes - no. as i have not yet bought it! there's a few possibles, this is "the next project" - don't let this make you think "it'll not happen"! it'll be likely to be a pre 60's wagon also, so likely to have vac brakes not air. no doubt will need a fair bit of work itself, so if it came to retro fitting air it would not be the end of the world. are the bigger vehicles, pre 1960, vac brakes, or did they make use of air? as to fuel, the reo in question was an early one, had a petrol fitted, not multi fuel. i'm definately a diesel fan, as i understand it and trust it. thanks guys, sam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam Posted September 24, 2009 Author Share Posted September 24, 2009 if you are considering a US truck then why not a russian one equally interesting, and usually with a bit of individuality thrown in too...a ural 375 d early 70's model, or a zil 131, I know where there is a part converted (diesel engine is in just the plumbing and other type of work to be done...that will tow 9 tons easily..., it has air brakes, can work your truck and they are not bad off road 6 x 6 or 6 x 4 which makes them not bad on road too...especially if you get the tyres changed to michelins or goodyears.. you could then fit a box body on the back of the zil and use that for storage of a generator or as more living space...or an office or workshop etc..pm if you want mroe detail.... i would be interested in all vehicles that are out out there, but it needs to be pre 1960 - license issues (i have class 2 but not class 1), and also because i'd like something worth keeping for 30 years, fingers crossed! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antarmike Posted September 24, 2009 Share Posted September 24, 2009 AEC Matadors 99% of the survivors have air brakes, Mk1/2 Militant Air braked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulob1 Posted September 24, 2009 Share Posted September 24, 2009 i would be interested in all vehicles that are out out there, but it needs to be pre 1960 - license issues (i have class 2 but not class 1), and also because i'd like something worth keeping for 30 years, fingers crossed! ah okay so you can only drive a combination of 12 tons...hmm the zil will be around 4-6 tons depending upon specs and kit fitted...if your van is 9 tons fully laden you would have only 3 tons to be playing with...unless of course you go for a pre 60's truck...hmm okay zil 157 isnt strong enough, and the kraz and early Maz trucks too rare... I have to say I think the matadors are cracking machines but do any of the pre 60's units have power steering... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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