Tanks owner - Advise me on tanks....

[Jack]

Dear all.

 

In a 'hypothetical' sense what are the good points and the bad of owning at track laying vehicle?

 

Your advise would be very very much appreciated.

 

Jack.

 

[Richard Farrant]

Jack,

 

I can give you three big considerations first;

1. Running costs

2. Transport...low loader hire, and again, cost of.

3. Maintenance

 

Not a project to be taken on lightly, most owners are competant mechanics and you will need good tools and equipment. Before going too far, you should visit a few tank owners to see what is involved, you will then get more of a picture of what it is all about.

 

Richard

[Enigma]

H e jack.

Buying a tank??

[Jack]

Jack,

 

I can give you three big considerations first;

1. Running costs

2. Transport...low loader hire, and again, cost of.

3. Maintenance

 

Not a project to be taken on lightly, most owners are competant mechanics and you will need good tools and equipment. Before going too far, you should visit a few tank owners to see what is involved, you will then get more of a picture of what it is all about.

 

Richard

 

 

Thank you very much Richard.........I don't like the sound of that but I am listening to wisdom and your thoughts have gone into the mix. :computerterror2:

[Karoshi]

In a very real sense what are the good points and the bad of owning at track laying vehicle?

 

I had a brief (very brief) love affair with a Sherm and a Radial once. The good point was the sound of the engine. The bad points were;

 

The costs.

 

....The costs, and

 

....................The costs.

[Jack]

Ok ok folks ..........putting the £££ TO ONE SIDE - what are the problems....?

[Karoshi]

1/. Commitment

 

2/. Commitment, and

 

3/. Commitment.

[Jack]

1/. Commitment

 

2/. Commitment, and

 

3/. Commitment.

 

 

Ok ok.....putting that to ONE SIDE - what are the problems?

[Richard Farrant]

Ok ok.....putting that to ONE SIDE - what are the problems?

 

 

 

Well for a start, it depends a lot on what tank you are thinking of, its state, whether it is in good order, or needs a lot of work done to it. And that is just for starters..........

 

Give us a clue to what tank is in your dreams :-)

[M5Clive]

I think the members on this thread have been spending too long with Private Frazer from Dads Army :-o

 

"These tracked vehicles are doomed, I tell ye........doomed" :roll:

 

Yes, they are a bugger to move if they are not under there own power - I speak from experience, having given my M5A1 the guided tour of the country during its on-going restoration, partly due to moving house in the middle of the restoration and partly due to fabrication work being undertaken on it. The following list shows the locations it has been stored at/worked on since purchase by me in 1999......

 

1) Burbage, Wiltshire

2) Calne, Wiltshire

3) Bedfield, Suffolk

4) Mickfield, Suffolk

5) Great Finborough, Suffolk

 

I wouldn't say the restoration process has been significantly more costly than my previous GMC project. Of course if you a talking a tracked vehicle that needs significant fabrication or extensive mechanical overhaul you are always under the constraint of the rarity of spares and the cost implications that go with scarcity.

 

OK - so it would cost me probably just shy of £2000 to put new old stock tracks on my Stuart, but how much are 11 bar-treads for a Jimmy these days? Got to be a £100 per tyre for a decent set of rubber and they will wear out far quicker than metal tracks!

 

But what does it cost to totally re-canvas a 6x6 truck? Don't have that problem with a tank!

 

Yes - they drink fuel, but so did my Dukw and all the Jimmy's I've had also. A tank isn't something that you will take out every weekend throughout the Summer, unlike a Dodge or Jimmy. It really is Horses for courses.

 

Just attempting to paint a slightly less darker picture for the would-be tank enthusiast ;-)

 

Cds

[sirhc]

Jack,

I agree with Clive, tracked vehicles are not as scary or expensive as they sound, but it is all relative. If you want to buy a complete restored Sherman and then take it to as many events as possible it is going to cost a fortune. If you buy something which needs work doing, spread the cost of doing it and all the work over a few years then it becomes much more affordable.

 

I know it's not your era, but you could buy any of a number of post war tracked vehicles, which are up and running, for the price of one jeep. I'm not putting jeeps down, each to thier own, but you get much more metal for your money with a CVRT or 432! If you need convincing come up and have a ride in our Spartan.

 

When it comes to moving them around, I do not expect to take any of our tracked vehicles to more than one large show and a few very local shows every year. It might seem a bit of a waste, having vehicles which don't go very far, but nothing beats owning a tank!

 

Chris

[sirhc]

I didn't really answer your question..!

 

Problems :

 

1) You need to lift big heavy things (engines, hull deck plates, turrets etc etc)

2) You need a big shed, or somewhere to store it where it won't sink into the mud

3) You need some way of moving it to shows, other than driving it

4) You need some way of moving it when it packs up on a roundabout half way to a show!

 

Chris

[Jack]

I didn't really answer your question..!

 

Problems :

 

1) You need to lift big heavy things (engines, hull deck plates, turrets etc etc)

2) You need a big shed, or somewhere to store it where it won't sink into the mud

3) You need some way of moving it to shows, other than driving it

4) You need some way of moving it when it packs up on a roundabout half way to a show!

 

Chris

 

 

Thanks Chris - that sounds like some good advice!

 

point 4 sounds the most painful one.....

[sirhc]

Jack,

Always be prepared for the worst case. If I broke down I'm sure my friends would come and rescue me, and I would do the same for them. I have a A frame in the garage which fits the front of the CVRT and a tow bar for the back so I can tow with it if required.

 

I don't know if you have seen Dougs Heavy Metal Gallery before, but there are some excellent articles on there. You may find the Scorpion restoration story interesting and it will give you a feel of what to be prepared for!

 

http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/lsm/dhmg/scorp-00.html'>http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/lsm/dhmg/scorp-00.html'>http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/lsm/dhmg/scorp-00.html

 

&

 

http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/lsm/dhmg/ for the main site.

 

Chris

[John Pearson]

This thread cuts right to the quick so far as I am concerned. I can't see any problems, only jobs!

Yes the covers are heavy, yes you need a handbook and the ability to read it, tools from a tool merchant not a market stall and probably a couple of mates to help but so what?

To let people into a secret: quite often tank owners do not pay all of their own transport costs, sometimes they dont pay any of them. You see, show organisers know that customers will travel and pay to see a tank in a way that they won't travel to pay to see another ten jeeps. As a result, show owners chase you to come (no refused entries!) and even pay towards your costs. You sometimes even get fuel as well!

You dont go down the shops in it and you get one hell of a lot of fun for your jerrycan full.You dont get many miles to the gallon but one hell of a lot of fun per pound.

One other thing: it is unbelievable for your ego! Do jeep/gmc/dodge owners have problems getting round the stalls because people stop you and ask incessant questions so that you can't get away from the exhibit lines? Don't think so!

If you are thinking about a tank and can afford one then get it! If you cant afford it then get some form of wheeled armour as most of the above still applies.

Good clanking!!!!

[TooTallMike]

We're on our 4th CVRT now, having done up and sold a Sultan, done up and decided to keep a Spartan MCT and having another Spartan and a Scorpion under restoration. For us the most important things have been:

 

- crane for decks, turrets, engines and gearboxes.

- manpower because most jobs require at least 2 people.

- 'A' frame towbar carried on board (a rope or straight bar is no good as a dead engine means no gearbox oil pressure which means no steering...)

- transporter because a 40-mile round trip is about the most we could face.

 

I wouldn't go out without a firm recovery option available but it's handy to know that at only 7.5t, at a pinch a Landy or my pickup could pull a CVRT.

[sirhc]

This thread cuts right to the quick so far as I am concerned. I can't see any problems, only jobs!

 

 

Problems are only opportunities for solutions!

 

Chris

[Marmite!!]

but it's handy to know that at only 7.5t, at a pinch a Landy or my pickup could pull a CVRT.

 

 

But what about stopping

[Richard Farrant]

But what about stopping

 

 

The driveshafts should be disconnected if towing more than a short distance, but main brakes are still operational with out engine running.

[whistlinwolf]

Ahhh thats all nonsense really Jack, they are cheap to run and easy to work on and the AA will recover it if it stops , honest!! :-D

[John Pearson]

Problems are only opportunities for solutions!

 

Chris

 

 

Sorry, was not trying to be philosophical! Just meant that there is nothing fundamentally difficult about any of the tasks needed to keep military (or indeed any pre 1990) vehicles on the road. The only thing that varies is the time taken and the physical effort. If you can put air in tyres or dip the oil on your car, you can maintain a tank because how you do all of them is the same: you look it up in the handbook! No one is born with the knowledge of where the dipstick is, what the tyre pressures are on a Vectra or how to seprate and rejoin tracks but it is all in a book somewhere!

[andyroo]

Jack,

Always be prepared for the worst case. If I broke down I'm sure my friends would come and rescue me, and I would do the same for them

 

Chris

 

 

If...........

I seem to remember coming out to a Fox not so many months ago ;-)

[MilitantGraham]

I don't own a tank myself, but I tow a friend's CVRT Samson to shows behind my Militant.

 

This is a good arrangement because;

I haven't got parking space, he has. So the Militant, trailer and Samson all live in his yard.

We share costs. I use more fuel with an extra 8 tons on the back, but I only pay for half of it.

The Militant has got a crane. No problem lifting the engine out.

If he drives it to a local show, I am available for recovery if needed.

We park together on the show field, not in the low loader park.

 

Transport is probably the biggest problem with a tracked vehicle.

Even with a CVRT, which is one of the lightest tanks available, you are going to need a 10 ton recovery trailer and something that can tow it or an 18t beaver tail recovery truck.

Teaming up with someone who has already got one or the other will make a tank a lot more affordable.

 

[sirhc]

If...........

I seem to remember coming out to a Fox not so many months ago ;-)

 

 

Andy,

Yes, I remember... :whistle: I also remember your Striker being stranded outside my house and only able to turn left!

 

Chris

[Jack]

Sorry, was not trying to be philosophical! Just meant that there is nothing fundamentally difficult about any of the tasks needed to keep military (or indeed any pre 1990) vehicles on the road. The only thing that varies is the time taken and the physical effort. If you can put air in tyres or dip the oil on your car, you can maintain a tank because how you do all of them is the same: you look it up in the handbook! No one is born with the knowledge of where the dipstick is, what the tyre pressures are on a Vectra or how to seprate and rejoin tracks but it is all in a book somewhere!

 

 

John - it is great to see someone else who has the 'can do' attitude.