Rubberduck Posted April 8, 2016 Author Share Posted April 8, 2016 Thank you. I'll put some heat on it and bodge a puller of some sort to do the job. I imagine the official one would apply a more equal pressure closer to the centre. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njjeeper Posted April 8, 2016 Share Posted April 8, 2016 Perhaps I missed something but the pic you posted looks like the engine is still installed. Since you cant pull the crank without bottom access I am assuming you are pulling the engine. If that's all true, you may want to wait on trying to get pulley off. Once the engine is out and upside down, you can just remove the connecting rod caps and use a drift on the bottom of the pistons to push them up and free them off. I have done this with a wood drift and an air hammer in the past. This way you don't risk buggering up the crank pulley before you really know if you need to pull the crank. If your gutting the block out anyway for a full rebuild, I suppose it doesn't matter. For me, I always assume the factory assembled it better than I can piece together from the manuals and available parts so I try to leave as much in tact as possible. Pulling a crank over here in the states with out available parts/knowledge of this engine would terrify me TJ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rubberduck Posted April 8, 2016 Author Share Posted April 8, 2016 I've been pondering all those very same thoughts myself. Engine is out and its stripped down on its side. Had some wood on the pistons from the underside but no movement yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony B Posted April 8, 2016 Share Posted April 8, 2016 If the engine is out and stripped, try standing in a bath of disiel for a week or so. Nothing to loose. The other old trick is to warm up old oil till it shows rainbows and starts to smoke then pour into bore . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njjeeper Posted April 8, 2016 Share Posted April 8, 2016 If you have air tools, the air hammer is really all you should need. Wood onto the underside of the piston and the air hammer with a flat bit on the other end. The extreme vibrations it creates are what does the work of making the rings move again....if its easier you can cut a round section of 2x4 and drop it in from the top and hammer that way. Single blows with a hammer has never been very effective for me. http://www.harborfreight.com/medium-barrel-air-impact-hammer-61244.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rubberduck Posted April 8, 2016 Author Share Posted April 8, 2016 2 pistons out then I got hungry. Sprayed a load of oil into the other bores so ill get them after breakfast. Been meaning to pick up a air hammer they look very handy. I usually just start with trusty hammer then, blue handled hammer then ye old Faithfull hammer (that's in size order) I suspect a couple will not come out so easily so ill take a sandwich. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njjeeper Posted April 8, 2016 Share Posted April 8, 2016 Congrats! Sounds like things are looking up! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DFC1943Fl.Lt. Posted April 8, 2016 Share Posted April 8, 2016 I had the same problem with mine, ended up just taking the head off. Head gasket is cheap enough. I had 2 valves stuck closed so just overhauled the head with rebeding all the valves. The bores were fine but full of old diesel and penetrating fluid. So glad I did remove the head. It ended up being g quicker plus it gives you a chance to have a look at the state of the head and at least the inlet valves. Regards Steve. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rubberduck Posted April 8, 2016 Author Share Posted April 8, 2016 The main problem with mine is the engine looks like it hasnt done many miles. From the inside not the outside. All the shims, followers etc etc have only a slight bit of wear so it wouldn't of helped if left and not looked after. I was told it a gate guardian for a short while. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joeferret Posted April 9, 2016 Share Posted April 9, 2016 2 pistons out then I got hungry. Sprayed a load of oil into the other bores so ill get them after breakfast. Been meaning to pick up a air hammer they look very handy. I usually just start with trusty hammer then, blue handled hammer then ye old Faithfull hammer (that's in size order) I suspect a couple will not come out so easily so ill take a sandwich. Why not use the latest and best penetrating lubricant instead of oil or diesel fuel... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rubberduck Posted April 9, 2016 Author Share Posted April 9, 2016 Suppose I should really, but I've always got a bucket load of some oil combo mix that needs a new use. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony B Posted April 9, 2016 Share Posted April 9, 2016 I also had a odd mix of disiel and burnt gear oil in a container ready for reccyling . I had a stuck trailer hitch and soacked a rag in the stuff then wrapped it around the hitch with a plastic bag over the top. Couple of days later the hitch was moving freely. Best pentrating mixture I've ever used. Now have to ruin another gear box to get some more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rubberduck Posted April 9, 2016 Author Share Posted April 9, 2016 5 pistons later and a whole pile of splinted wood. Gear box oil and diesel works very well as I find it does not dry out so easily. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rubberduck Posted April 10, 2016 Author Share Posted April 10, 2016 6 out!! Working the pistons from the bottom with the crank shaft still in place works very well thanks for the tip. It's going to annoy me not getting the timing cover of but hey ho. Time to clean up the bores and put it all back together again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon_M Posted April 10, 2016 Share Posted April 10, 2016 That's good. Does it turn over freely now those pesky pistons are on the bench? Obviously you will give it a damn good clean and put it back together, but just wondering if any other owners could suggest other things to check first. What goes west on Ferrets? Worth checking the fluid flywheel seal before reassembly? You'd be gutted if you put it back together and it ran well, but then you had flywheel seal problems. That seal has been sitting in one position for as long as it took the engine to stick like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Farrant Posted April 10, 2016 Share Posted April 10, 2016 While you are at this point, it is worth at least checking the exhaust valve clearances as they are a bugger to do in situ. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njjeeper Posted April 11, 2016 Share Posted April 11, 2016 I agree with Richard. Have the whole head checked before you put it back on. Unleaded gas in lead only heads could have taken its toll at a bare minimum. May as well have that sorted and converted to unleaded before you put it all back together. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Farrant Posted April 11, 2016 Share Posted April 11, 2016 I agree with Richard. Have the whole head checked before you put it back on. Unleaded gas in lead only heads could have taken its toll at a bare minimum. May as well have that sorted and converted to unleaded before you put it all back together. No need to have it converted to unleaded as B Range engines have Stellite tipped exhaust valves and hardened seat inserts already. I am currently overhauling a B61. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njjeeper Posted April 11, 2016 Share Posted April 11, 2016 That's great news Richard! So I don't need to deal with lead additive anymore! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rubberduck Posted June 1, 2016 Author Share Posted June 1, 2016 She turns over just nicely now. Pulled out the gearbox/transfer box which is a right arse with an engine crane. Just about makes it. I'll be checking the fluid fly wheel seal. Lots of crud in the bottom and loads of nuts and washers. The gearbox looks fun anyone get any top tips to check for. I'd hate to put it all back together and find its bugged. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
datadawg Posted June 2, 2016 Share Posted June 2, 2016 No need to have it converted to unleaded as B Range engines have Stellite tipped exhaust valves and hardened seat inserts already. I am currently overhauling a B61. Maybe I dreamed this up, but I thought hardened stuff was only on B81 and regular engines (B80 and B60) lacked this. I have been reading up on the unleaded conundrum and decided not to use lead additives, adopting the logic that I won't drive the Saracen enough to make a difference. However, I am conflicted what fuel to put in (regular or premium, which in USA is 87 to 93 octane respectively). I decided to use premium, not sure if this is good, but my logic was that more expensive gas (petrol) should be better. The other issue is that here, almost all fuel contains 10% ethanol, and who knows what this adds to the equation. I have read on the landscapers' forums that all their small equipment (trimmers, lawnmowers, etc) has fuel problems due to ethanol additive and I'm wondering whether military engines might suffer as well. Not sure if you Brits have same ethanol additive as we do... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Farrant Posted June 2, 2016 Share Posted June 2, 2016 Maybe I dreamed this up, but I thought hardened stuff was only on B81 and regular engines (B80 and B60) lacked this. ... It depends where you get your information from, but from experience I know that hardened exhaust seats were fitted. The one I am rebuilding has them as the machine shop remarked on them when I got him to recut the seats. You refer to B81 and regular engines. Basically there is little difference except that the B61 and B81 are 0.25" larger bores to give increased capacity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony B Posted June 2, 2016 Share Posted June 2, 2016 (edited) I had a similar condrum on the 101 with the V8. However military engines were low compression compared to civillian engines, so never had any problem on unleaded. When you think of it , the quality of fuel can't be garunteed so the engine has to run on most things. I ran it on British , Belgium and French petrol over the time I had it , no problems. Edited June 2, 2016 by Tony B Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MiketheBike Posted June 2, 2016 Share Posted June 2, 2016 (edited) Clive Elliot posted info on this back in 2006, here is the relevant info...hope Clive does not mind me pinching the image 😁 Edited June 2, 2016 by MiketheBike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Degsy Posted June 2, 2016 Share Posted June 2, 2016 The other issue is that here, almost all fuel contains 10% ethanol, and who knows what this adds to the equation. I have read on the landscapers' forums that all their small equipment (trimmers, lawnmowers, etc) has fuel problems due to ethanol additive and I'm wondering whether military engines might suffer as well. Not sure if you Brits have same ethanol additive as we do... Ethanol is added to petrol over here and it does cause problems on older vehicles, some manufacturer's are also not happy about Ethanol but the Government have allowed its use. I use a lead substitute additive which also contains an additive to combat ethanol because it damages seals in the carb/fuel system with potentially disastrous results. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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