ted angus Posted May 29, 2009 Share Posted May 29, 2009 (edited) Adam I don't see any French in the casualty list ???? I was only twice unlucky enough to be involved face to face with the French Their "don't give a toss about anyone else attitude" nearly cost us an Argosy full of guys . It was only the split second quick thinking opf our loadmaster on another aircraft that saved the day. TED Edited May 29, 2009 by Marmite!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Degsy Posted May 29, 2009 Share Posted May 29, 2009 Adams figures although correct don't tell the whole story. Battle casualties for the period 6th June to 29th August 1944 were British/Canadian/Polish killed 15,995,wounded 57,996, missing 9,054.United States killed 20,838, wounded 94881, missing 10,128. In addition to this the RAF lost 8178 killed and missing and the USAAF 8,536 killed and missing, there were also approx 12,000 Allied air force personnel killed and missing on pre D=Day ops. German forces lost 200,000 killed and wounded and 200,000 POW's. Ted, I have never seen casualty figures for French troops but I assume most would have been included in American casualty returns as most French troops fought as part of American army groups, no doubt a small no of commandos etc would have been included in British 21st Army group figures. There were also very high casualties in the civil population, it is thought up to 6000 alone in the bombing of Caen. They are all mourned irrespective of nationality. RIP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N.O.S. Posted May 29, 2009 Share Posted May 29, 2009 (edited) Hang on folks - didn't our beloved Government originally state that Britain would not be taking any active part in this event, to the extent of not even providing any help for veterans - hence the NVA/HMVF appeal? And wasn't it only much later that Mr. Brown announced that britain would after all attend? And The Palace stance is that the Queen would not attend simply because no invitation had been received? And the French Government said it was up to the British Government who they should invite/send along? In which case, France might at some stage have formed the impression (not unreasonably) that as Britain had no intention of taking any part in the event, they might as well label it as primarily a French/American event? Seems to me it might have been our own government rather than the French who snubbed the Queen, and the vets, and the rest of us..... :n00b: Oh, and thanks to the Forum "management" for allowing a little leeway in the 'No Politics' rule to permit a reasonable discussion on this topic. Edited May 29, 2009 by N.O.S. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FV1604A Posted May 29, 2009 Share Posted May 29, 2009 Well said.NOS. very good point! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest catweazle (Banned Member) Posted May 29, 2009 Share Posted May 29, 2009 Hear,hear.:argh: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Degsy Posted May 29, 2009 Share Posted May 29, 2009 The French Government announced in 2004 that the 60th anniversary commemeration would be the last one which they would officially recognise. It now appears that they have changed tack after they upset Obama and the French President is now desperate to curry favour with the Obama administration. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony B Posted May 30, 2009 Share Posted May 30, 2009 Unfortunatley Degsy, our own home grown ***** are just as guilty of 'band wagon jumping'. Never mind, fortunatley, the Very Distingushed Visitors, the Vetran's, have always been the most honoured by the local people. The Calvados Region has made it very clear that any poloticians of any hue are unimportant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnguppy Posted May 30, 2009 Share Posted May 30, 2009 i am sure our Queen is as unset as i am sure we all are , it seems over the past 65yrs history has been changed though the movie industy and i guess in time no one will remember what it was like but a few , let us all pledge to revisit every 5 years and keep the sprit alive I am camping with IMPS and we have been asked not to fly our Union or St georges flags for fear of offending people well im taking my flag well :saluting: While we are away elections will be taking place lets all prepair to apply for a french visa for the 70th :argh::argh::argh: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N.O.S. Posted May 30, 2009 Share Posted May 30, 2009 we have been asked not to fly our Union or St georges flags for fear of offending people well im taking my flag well :saluting: Yes, under the circumstances perhaps it would be best to pretend not to be British - remember to speak blighty with a strong French accent and chew plenty of garlic :cool2: What is this .......... world coming to? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Posted May 30, 2009 Author Share Posted May 30, 2009 Oh, and thanks to the Forum "management" for allowing a little leeway in the 'No Politics' rule to permit a reasonable discussion on this topic. Thanks N.O.S. - it is to profound not to be discussed and one that I think we are all agreed on. However you made some fine points in your earlier post with regards to Brown (Britain) not planning to attend in the first place........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Posted May 30, 2009 Author Share Posted May 30, 2009 Thanks N.O.S. - it is to profound not to be discussed and one that I think we are all agreed on. However you made some fine points in your earlier post with regards to Brown (Britain) not planning to attend in the first place........ So the question has to be - what do we as a hobby do next? As governments are saying or are non committal about how important the continuing commemoration of D-Day is from an official point of view - what do we, as a hobby need to do to make sure this is never forgotten? Is it up to us to make sure that we always commemorate the anniversary for generations to come? Is it something we, as a hobby can do and insure a lasting legacy from us all?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferretfixer Posted May 30, 2009 Share Posted May 30, 2009 Thanks N.O.S. - it is to profound not to be discussed and one that I think we are all agreed on. However you made some fine points in your earlier post with regards to Brown (Britain) not planning to attend in the first place........ He would probably put an expense claim in for it anyway..........:whistle: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Posted May 30, 2009 Author Share Posted May 30, 2009 I am camping with IMPS and we have been asked not to fly our Union or St georges flags for fear of offending people well im taking my flag well :saluting: :argh::argh::argh: Thats just nuts John - who would you be offending?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Willyslancs Posted May 30, 2009 Share Posted May 30, 2009 if they are going to be offended , they should nt be bloody there !!!............. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stephanedu14 Posted May 30, 2009 Share Posted May 30, 2009 good evening all normandie.il have is damage qu' it is a boob for l' there; invitation of your reine.pour me, c' is an obviousness that all the governments of the countries having intervened for the release of France but also of l' Europe are invited has to commemorate a date which marked the monde.car l' let us not forget, if this release n' had not taken place the 3rd reicht would have continued its invasion, and that seriont us of this moment.nous seriont cannot be same step spirit to communicate ensemble.pour the release of Paris, it is necessary can be to replace d' a little; history, the de Gaulle General advanced the troop of the 2nd dB whereas l' American staff outward journey to pass to the north of Paris to go towards Berlin.la continuation which I do not know too much can be there is t' he have an English and Canadian reinforcement for liberation.mais on the declaration Paris to release c' stays I pence to say one have to release Paris but not with the US ones which came nevertheless with dollars français.je pence that c' for that qu' is; he has after asking US to leave the teritoirs.je pence qu' one does not need any more terop préocuper of what the politicians did and in these days which arrive have great steps to celebrate our veterans and them souvenirs.dans our grounds Normandes it nor does not have that remainders of bombs, there are 15 days 5 more German soldiers have were put has days, they had been put out of ground certainly by English soldiers in the sector of Dribble has l' West of Ranville.com me I l' have say in another post, French people and Européen will never thank adzes the combatant for all the countries which came released our large parents.vous will always as well be accomodated on our sol.cordialement. Stephan of Normandy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Degsy Posted May 30, 2009 Share Posted May 30, 2009 So the question has to be - what do we as a hobby do next? As governments are saying or are non committal about how important the continuing commemoration of D-Day is from an official point of view - what do we, as a hobby need to do to make sure this is never forgotten? Is it up to us to make sure that we always commemorate the anniversary for generations to come? Is it something we, as a hobby can do and insure a lasting legacy from us all?? The people of Normandy have always said that they will commemorate the landing anniversary irrespective of anything the French government may say or do. Any visitors going to Normandy can be sure of a warm welcome which I am fairly sure is what Stephane is saying. Please be assured Stephane that we are not blaming the people of Normandy, it's the cynical behaviour of the politicians when in truth it should be all about the veterans and I sincerely hope that the vets treat the politicians with the contempt they deserve. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stephanedu14 Posted May 30, 2009 Share Posted May 30, 2009 thank you to you all your comprehension has, even if in spite of my knowledge of your l' angue, m' oblige has to pass through a translator ligne.mais Normandy and l' of it; England by every century d' history one of very strong fasteners, and blood Miss by the conquettes of territories that l' one finds in our blazon and tapestry of BAYEUX with Guyaume Conquerant.et can be the same thing of your with dimensions. c' is always a pleasure of being able to inform you when during your displacement to seek you your way in our area and I am happy of being able to meet you at the time of your come on our grounds and to be able to admire your vehicles, you will recognize me because I would carry a badge of the forum.encore thank you have all these combatants and have their family and you will be welcome in Normandy. Stephan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Great War truck Posted May 30, 2009 Share Posted May 30, 2009 Thanks Stephan. Tim (too) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArtistsRifles Posted May 30, 2009 Share Posted May 30, 2009 Thanks Stephan. Tim (too) Same here Stephan. Always good to hear it from the people involved on "the other side" as it were. (I could be a bit biased here as my ancestors were on the same fleet that "Guyaume Conquerant" floated over on. Our surname originally was De Plugenet which got Anglicized to Plucknett somehow) It is a shame and a pity that the politico's are so self-bloated they only ever see what benefits them now - hence the sudden about face of Brown when he found out Obama was attending the 65th. Personally I feel the politicians should be banned unless they are also the head of state. The veterans going from the UK swore the oath of allegiance to our current sovereigns father HM King George VI - most of those going from here who have served swore the same oath to HM Queen Elizabeth II thus really it is the sovereign who should be there for the veterans. Not some jumped up jack in the office too busy fiddling expense reports to take the efforts of 65 years ago seriously. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morris c8 fat Posted May 31, 2009 Share Posted May 31, 2009 Brown just said live on the Andrew Marr show this morning"If The Queen wished to go he would make sure it would happen". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stefano Posted May 31, 2009 Share Posted May 31, 2009 This is what the Express has to say, could be that Sarko is not so much to blame perhaps.. http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/104462/EXCLUSIVE-Brown-to-be-grilled-over-D-Day-fiasco- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest catweazle (Banned Member) Posted May 31, 2009 Share Posted May 31, 2009 Brown the enemy within.beggers belief really. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony B Posted May 31, 2009 Share Posted May 31, 2009 The Queen to visit Normandy at Brown's whim? I think I'll go and ******* being a Jerseyman, our alligence is to the Her Majsty through her title Duchess of Normandy, as that title dates to before 1066, english poloticians can go and , well I bet he ainm't payingg his own ferry fare. :argh: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Elsdon Posted May 31, 2009 Share Posted May 31, 2009 Brown the enemy within.beggers belief really. Or does it.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferretfixer Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 Thats just nuts John - who would you be offending?? The former Vichy Government perhaps?.............:rofl: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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