Trench art....

[Jack]

Hi folks - does anyone have any trench art in their collections?

 

I have a shell that is dated Aug 1918 with art work...

[Tony B]

Trench art is a very difficult subject. The shell may be dated but, there is no real way to date when any engraving was done. A lot of this was done as 'tourist' tat, similar to what the antique world calls 'Fairings'. As early as 1919 there were organised trips to the Western Front, a lot of souvenirs were manufactured localy for sale. There is still a man at Ipers will cast model soldiers from lead shrapnel balls found in the area. Little note: If you find shrapnel, NOT shell fragments, proper Shrapnel balls, they are almost certainly British. Reason British used lead balls, German's used steel. The only authentic German Shrapnel I've seen was one that had ben retained by a soldier and has come down to a relation. The ball was nearly spent and hit a tin box the man had in his pocket. All three survived.

[N.O.S.]

Here's one Jack - a 3" (or 76.2mm) shell case brought back by my mother's uncle from the war.

 

Dated 1917, decorated with a basket of flowers - probably a typical subject.

 

Photos taken through opaque paper to reduce glare from a long-overdue polish (thanks for the timely kick up the rear!).

[Richard Farrant]

Hi folks - does anyone have any trench art in their collections?

 

I have a shell that is dated Aug 1918 with art work...

 

 

Jack,

 

I have a plain 18 pounder shell case manufactured in 1917 and it is engraved "1917-8-9" and with the crest of the Womens Auxiliary Army Corps, below that "A.M.T.D." and "FRANCE". It has been handed down through the family and I recollect my grandparents using it to hold the fire irons!

 

I reckon AMTD is Army Motor Transport Depot (or Mechanical ? ).

[Snapper]

I haven't got any, more's the pity. A friend had a bell made from a 18 pdr case which was lovely - just plain, no detail - he chucked it out.

 

I've got some shrapnel balls. We got them from an 18pdr we found at Auchonvillers. They're loose now,because we didn't realise they were inside until we cleaned the shell a bit. Treasure.

 

Grimmer (John) is in Ypres at the moment. He met Harry Patch on Saturday and will have a good report to add soon - when I make him do it.

 

M

[AlienFTM]

Jack,

 

I have a plain 18 pounder shell case manufactured in 1917 and it is engraved "1917-8-9" and with the crest of the Womens Auxiliary Army Corps, below that "A.M.T.D." and "FRANCE". It has been handed down through the family and I recollect my grandparents using it to hold the fire irons!

 

I reckon AMTD is Army Motor Transport Depot (or Mechanical ? ).

 

Google search for "army mechanical transport depot" gives a single hit.

 

Ask a squaddie what MT stands for and he'll tell you that it refers to Land Rovers, lorries and stuff. I have never heard a squaddy define MT.

 

However, if you read the works of Anthony Armstrong from the 1920s, you'll find that he defines MT as Mechanical Transport (from a time when most transport was, not surprisingly, the horse).

 

Works for me.

 

Searching for "army motor transport depot" gives but two hits, one for the US Army, one for the Japanese.

[Rlangham]

Jack,

 

I have a plain 18 pounder shell case manufactured in 1917 and it is engraved "1917-8-9" and with the crest of the Womens Auxiliary Army Corps, below that "A.M.T.D." and "FRANCE". It has been handed down through the family and I recollect my grandparents using it to hold the fire irons!

 

I reckon AMTD is Army Motor Transport Depot (or Mechanical ? ).

 

Richard, do you happen to have a photo of it, showing the WAAC crest? My best friend portrays a worker of the WAAC at living history event, i'm sure she'd be very interested to see a photo of it

[Richard Farrant]

Richard, do you happen to have a photo of it, showing the WAAC crest? My best friend portrays a worker of the WAAC at living history event, i'm sure she'd be very interested to see a photo of it

 

My camera is not picking up detail on a close up, the engraving has been polished so much over the years, will have another go and if it works, will post image on here.

[Tony B]

N.O.S., do you know where and what your shell case from? The 67%cu mark sems to indicate it is German casing, the mark being a brass quality mark. I've been trying to find out the head marks but no luck on an SL mark yet.

[N.O.S.]

Sorry Tony, no idea. It is 3" dia. x 8" long. But note the date is JUNI 1917, what country uses JUNI for JUNE?

[ford 369]

recently picked up a 1918 dated case with an engraved pattern for a fiver at the local tip and came very close to buying a german m36 helmet painted with a cartoon in the style of a Guernsey newspaper illustrator whose name escapes me at the moment depicting a british tommy freeing Guernsey from the shackles of the occupying forces.

I know this helmet is now in Jersey so it has more or less gone home

[M.Rimmer]

Juni is German.

[Jack]

I will get a picture of my one up to...

[lynx42 Rick Cove]

I started my interest in all things military at the ripe old age of 10. I found an old WW1 ashtray and my interest has blossomed from that find. Attached is a photo of some of my trench art. I have approximately 100 items. These are fom the Boar War up to the recent Afganistan Conflict.

I don't go out of my way to collect it as it's getting a bit expensive, but the ccollection continues to grow slowly.

 

The story behind each item is as important as the actual piece itself.

 

Regards Rick

[Tony B]

recently picked up a 1918 dated case with an engraved pattern for a fiver at the local tip and came very close to buying a german m36 helmet painted with a cartoon in the style of a Guernsey newspaper illustrator whose name escapes me at the moment depicting a british tommy freeing Guernsey from the shackles of the occupying forces.

I know this helmet is now in Jersey so it has more or less gone home

As far as the donkey's (Guernerseymen) are concerned it has gone to the Enemy!:-D I was shown a small casting of a Belgian helmet, very heavy looked as if it had been cast from gunmetal. This was bought at a boot fare for £6.

Re posting: Anyone any idea what might have fired this? The RL is the headstamp of Royal Laboratory Woolwich, which is where it was saved from.

Edited September 30, 2008 by Tony B

[Richard Farrant]

Re posting: Anyone any idea what might have fired this?

 

 

It says 3 pounder on it, could be for a Vickers gun which was mainly used by Navy I think and was prewar, phased out before the end of the war.

[Tony B]

Thanks Richard. The final use to which they were put was as specimin (Flowers!) vases by the gardening society.The stuff that went for scrap/rubbish when the Arsenal closed was heart breaking.

[Enigma]

This one is a favourite piece in my collection.

The watch has a aluminium band, probably theater made because the cotton straps rotted away quickly.

 

The engraving inside is hard to photograph but says;

 

love

New Glenn Guinnea

1943

 

On the outside a "F" and a "J".