NGY registration series

[ruxy]

12 hours ago, scimart said:

That first suggestion is  a promising possibility - I don't suppose you've any recollection of how it was mounted?  Would these hole positions correspond with any memories?

(Rear of tub at top of picture)

 

[ruxy]

It was  1973 - shortly after I started with Black & Decker at their Spennymoor plant.  ISTR some frame/bedplate inside the tub - something like 2" x 3"  RSC .   The appliance was in lovely condition (then)  - unfortunately they were not prepared to spend £ , so the pump was just dumped in the tub.  By time I left 5 years later - it was still stood , by then on flat cracked tyres outside the boiler house next to main gate-house with the hood roof fallen in - rotten. Not a good sight for visitors to see on entry..    I had pondered asking the facilities manager if I could buy it making a conservative offer, considering his reply would automatically be - that he would have to place it up on the board for other offers for reasons of fairness.  In retrospect - I now think nobody would have been interested in a fire appliance, I was not greatly but at the time considered it too good for me to strip to put back as a basic utility.  It has always been a regret that I never made a strong push to buy it ,,

[scimart]

Rather along the lines of the two early 80" one titled owner Land Rovers which I saw when working on a telephone at a travellers' site in the early 80s - I bought a hand throttle from one of them but wouldn't have had storage space even if I'd had the foresight to make them an offer...but they were just scrap in those days.

[wally dugan]

I have now been through the ledgers again with my wife to double check l have not missed any thing  first there is no record for NGY 998 but  NGY 999 is listed as well there are a number of quarter ton fire tenders registered with RGX numbers which at various  times where at the CHERTSEY fire station. After a long telephone call to my old boss who was based  there for a number of years on this subject he was not surprised that a vehicle was listed for one establishment but appeared at another he said this happened for a number of reasons unfortunately how long it was there would be recorded in the establishment 7227 file a large number of these were lost  or destroyed at closure  of the site l have a collection of them  they represent a very small part of what there was it ran to thousands.  For TED NGY 999 was issued a  EP series number because the NGY number is struck through and the EP number  written in it was SOLD at RUDDINGTON

[ted angus]

Hi Wally I have 998 became 50 EP 40 and 999 became 60 EP 23    regards TED

[Tony B]

The Fort and Chertsey had very close links. It was not unusual for vehicles  being on one set of books, but ending up at the other most of the time. The Fort did have until recently a well equipped fire service. Officially in the 1950' 60 and up to DERA Fort Halstead was The Royal Armorments Research and Development Establishment. The Royal Charter proudly displaye din the entrance to A4 building.  There was also two offshoots of the Fort.  One was Aquila at Bexley , the other Shoreham (Village) which was a magazine. Aquil ais now a housing estate, despite the fact that the original paperwork said if disposed of it would return to a golf course. Shoreham is now a builders yard I belive.

Edited September 22, 2020 by Tony B

[Ex-boy]

3 hours ago, Tony B said:

The Fort and Chertsey had very close links. It was not unusual for vehicles  being on one set of books, but ending up at the other most of the time. The Fort did have until recently a well equipped fire service. Officially in the 1950' 60 and up to DERA Fort Halstead was The Royal Armorments Research and Development Establishment. The Royal Charter proudly displaye din the entrance to A4 building.  There was also two offshoots of the Fort.  One was Aquila at Bexley , the other Shoreham (Village) which was a magazine. Aquil ais now a housing estate, despite the fact that the original paperwork said if disposed of it would return to a golf course. Shoreham is now a builders yard I belive.

One minor correction Tony. Aquila was in Bromley, not Bexley.

Steve

[scimart]

On 9/22/2020 at 1:10 PM, wally dugan said:

I have now been through the ledgers again with my wife to double check l have not missed any thing  first there is no record for NGY 998 but  NGY 999 is listed as well there are a number of quarter ton fire tenders registered with RGX numbers which at various  times where at the CHERTSEY fire station. After a long telephone call to my old boss who was based  there for a number of years on this subject he was not surprised that a vehicle was listed for one establishment but appeared at another he said this happened for a number of reasons unfortunately how long it was there would be recorded in the establishment 7227 file a large number of these were lost  or destroyed at closure  of the site l have a collection of them  they represent a very small part of what there was it ran to thousands.  For TED NGY 999 was issued a  EP series number because the NGY number is struck through and the EP number  written in it was SOLD at RUDDINGTON

Thanks for taking the time to check again Wally.  Ted's information that his records show NGY 990 as a GP (general purpose?) hard top fits well with how it came to me so on the balance of probability it looks like mine was used by the fire service at Chertsey for some unknown duties - possibly some sort of auxillary pump which might explain why you have it as a fire tender.  I've spent some time looking for images of the site and I'm fairly convinced that the layout of the water trough, marked circle and hill match the location with the red Land Rover fire engine shown on the film I posted on page 1.  Each time I look at the red fire engine I come to a different conclusion over its registration number - the most consistent interpretation is NGY 998 but that shows in Ted's records as being based at Rotherwas which doesn't sound like a site with comprehensive vehicle testing facilities...

I was so happy when I deciphered the scrawled factory despatch record as Fort Halstead - but the plot has only thickened since!

[ted angus]

To me it looks like Fort Halstead Sevenoaks- which of course is its postal town,   I think its a case of accepting these little machines moved around .  I have now found 26 in the NGY and RGX reg block    12 have locations and 13 have re-registration numbers in the Army EP block. Once I have finished digging I will post the list. TED

[Tony B]

On 9/22/2020 at 8:56 PM, Ex-boy said:

One minor correction Tony. Aquila was in Bromley, not Bexley.

Steve

I used to work there, I should have remembered. It's the age you know. Originally the site, right by a major rail junction, was going to be an evacuation hospital for Blitz victims. 

[ted angus]

I have pulled together numerous lists from various sources I have gathered over many years.  This covers the NGY and PGK reg blocks as I know for certain these are series One.  I also have 5 numbers in the RGX block but I have a feeling these may be Series 2 so haven't included them.  I have attached the list as a file but in case anyone cannot open it , I have embedded it into this text.

Series 1 Land Rover L4P fire tenders for Min of Supply

 

NGY 76, 79, 81, 82, 83, 84 Eskmeals became 53 EP 48.  85 Chertsey became 58 EP 75.

 

NGY 712 Shoeburyness became 50 EP 96 .  713, 714,  715  Inchterf became  50 EP 72.  716,

 

NGY 891, 892 Porton Down became 57 EP 23.  893 became 50 EP 11.   894 Longtown became 50 EP 36.

 

NGY 895, 896, 898, 899 became 50 EP 49.   998 Rotherwas became 50 EP 40.

 

NGY 999 Chertsey became 60 EP 23.

 

 

 

PGK 955 Nancekuke became 56 EP 72. 957  Potton Island  became 54 EP 59.  958 Pendine.

 

PGK 959 Ft Halstead became 54 EP 58.  960 Cranfield,  961  Farnborough/Pyestock.  964.  965.

 

 

I am pretty confident that this list is mostly accurate,  However on enthusiast lists NGY 998 and 999 are also listed as PGK ?  With reference to Wally’s Chertsey info  I have gone with NGY.

 All these tenders were ordered by The Ministry Of Supply for their huge number of establishments. The Ministry of Supply was dissolved in 1959 with some establishments moving to other Ministries whilst some passed to the War Office. Those passing to the War Office were given Army registration numbers in the EP series, those to other Ministries and departments retained there original London County Council( reserved for civil ministries) registrations.    

Series 1 L4P.docx

Edited October 20, 2020 by ted angus

[scimart]

Thanks Ted.  If your list is reasonably complete, it looks as though NGY990 was not supplied as a true Land Rover factory built fire engine (which certainly aligns with the physical evidence) but Wally's info that it was recorded as a fire appliance is also very compelling. 

You stated that you had NGY990 recorded in a list as a GP hard top - do you have any more info from or about this listing that might help me?  As I said in an earlier post, my best guess is that it was fitted out for some sort of support function for the fire station at Chertsey.

I don't suppose anyone could cast any light on these (very vague) markings?

Edited October 20, 2020 by scimart

[ted angus]

Afraid not just listed as a "Utility Hardtop "  no location, Ted.

[scimart]

Whilst working on the driver’s door today, I noticed what appeared to be a failed spot weld on the lower part of the door skin. On closer examination and gentle manipulation the hole looked too regular to be a weld.  Viewed from the inside, I can see that there are two formed rivet heads where they pass through the door frame and there’s evidence of a similar rivet shaft disturbing the paint layer a little further along. I can see no similar ones on the passenger door.


My best guess is that there might have been some sort of badge fitted which could have been removed when it was sold on to the civilian market by the ministry - has anyone seen anything similar or can shed any alternative light on their presence?

 

Edited November 21, 2020 by scimart