Guest matt Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 Hi, I'm trying to find out what licence is required to legally own a live firing 25 pound artillery gun in the UK,can anyone help? is it a section 1 or 5 firearm? Any helps greatfully received. Thanks, Matt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marmite!! Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 Hi, I'm trying to find out what licence is required to legally own a live firing 25 pound artillery gun in the UK,can anyone help? is it a section 1 or 5 firearm? Any helps greatfully received. Thanks, Matt. Matt, Section 1, if it was a section 5 weapon you would not be able to own one unless you were an armourer, Section 5 weapons are prohibited. Lee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghasp! Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 I understand that it used to be looked upon as a section 1 FAC as it was effectively a single shot breech loading rifle. However I had a discussion with a few people at Bovington during the tankfest (so this is just hearsay evidence), but they said that attitudes have now changed. I was told that under new guidelines any weapon that could potentially be used to fire depleted uranium rounds was being moved further up the FAC scale. It doesn't matter that the 25 pounder never used such ammo, if something modern is close enough to be converted then the alarm bells start ringing in the Home Office. Again I have to stress that this is only what I was told by a couple of HMV owners, but they did own similar artillery pieces / tank main guns. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marmite!! Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 I understand that it used to be looked upon as a section 1 FAC as it was effectively a single shot breech loading rifle. However I had a discussion with a few people at Bovington during the tankfest (so this is just hearsay evidence), but they said that attitudes have now changed. I was told that under new guidelines any weapon that could potentially be used to fire depleted uranium rounds was being moved further up the FAC scale. It doesn't matter that the 25 pounder never used such ammo, if something modern is close enough to be converted then the alarm bells start ringing in the Home Office. Again I have to stress that this is only what I was told by a couple of HMV owners, but they did own similar artillery pieces / tank main guns. The info you were given was a Load of Rubbish... that being said each Police authority have different views when it comes to Firearms & some try to implement their own rules when it comes to Firearms.. No amendments can be made yo the Firearms act without going before Parliament, no such bill is before Parliament at present Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whistlinwolf Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 Guy called Jim Smith near us has an Abbott on a FAC. 8-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morris c8 fat Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 It is a section 1 You need a good reason for ownership and the gun must be secured the firing pin must be removed when not in use and kept in a locked container Essex were very understanding about ours but I do know off at least one case where the inspecting officer got out his pram because the 25pdr was not in the loft in a gun cabbinet :roll: 8-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R Cubed Posted March 26, 2010 Share Posted March 26, 2010 (edited) There is also the issue of when you take it out somewhere, you ( the FAC holder ) must be with it ( the live gun ) at all times and not be left unattended this goes for transportation as well, if it was on a transporter you would need to be with it as well, this is what put me off getting a live 105mm Howitzer. Edited March 26, 2010 by R Cubed spelling Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony B Posted March 26, 2010 Share Posted March 26, 2010 They are FAC section One. Depends as said where you live what the attitude is. the main concern that I've come across is the firing pin. That must be removed and kept in a lock box. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stone Posted March 26, 2010 Share Posted March 26, 2010 Since the original question seems to have been answered, how about missile launchers? Most of them are fired electrically, but the phrase 'from which any shot, bullet or other missile can be discharged' springs to mind... So, is it a firearm or not a firearm, and if so what FAC would it have to be held on, or instead how would you deactivate one? Stone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marmite!! Posted March 27, 2010 Share Posted March 27, 2010 Since the original question seems to have been answered, how about missile launchers? Most of them are fired electrically, but the phrase 'from which any shot, bullet or other missile can be discharged' springs to mind... So, is it a firearm or not a firearm, and if so what FAC would it have to be held on, or instead how would you deactivate one? Stone Section 5 or buy one already deactivated Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony B Posted March 27, 2010 Share Posted March 27, 2010 Section 5 of the Firearms Act is the , anything we don't like or don't want section. You can get a Section 5 licence. But you have to convince the Secratary of State at the Home Office you need one. It also covers such things as Pepper Spray and Blowguns. My Vet has limited section five licence. He uses a blow gun to anthtise animals. The drug in the dart is a 'noxious liquid' - read '99% fatal if it gets on human skin, 100% if it gets under the skin- so that comes under Section 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferretfixer Posted March 27, 2010 Share Posted March 27, 2010 The info you were given was a Load of Rubbish... that being said each Police authority have different views when it comes to Firearms & some try to implement their own rules when it comes to Firearms.. No amendments can be made yo the Firearms act without going before Parliament, no such bill is before Parliament at present With regards to the above qoute. It is More & more Apparant that SOME F/Arms Dept Officials attempt to enforce what they call 'Force Policy'. IE: 'It is Force Policy to reduce to the minimum, the amount of F/Arms in circulation'. I have heard this rubbish time & time again. You must Politely but FIRMLY point out that 'Force Policy' is NOT Law. & attempting to implement thier own ideas is UNLAWFULL! If you have a requirement & no Record, there is NOTHING stopping you from appyling for an FAC with NO Ammo for a 25Pdr. Mike. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alan turner (RIP) Posted March 27, 2010 Share Posted March 27, 2010 I know that down at Firepower none of their guns are deacctivated but the 2 (25 pdr & 2 pdr) that they use for kids to pull the firing hadles on (.22 blanks) do have their firing pins locked securely away when not in use in secure gun cabinets. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony B Posted March 27, 2010 Share Posted March 27, 2010 Depends what their licence says. The musuem itself may qualify as secure storage. Also are they on a civvy licence? There are also showmans licences. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alan turner (RIP) Posted March 27, 2010 Share Posted March 27, 2010 did hear talk many years ago about all on shotgun license but things may have changed, Jason may know. Curator is MOD museum is a private Ltd company wholly owned by the RA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony B Posted March 27, 2010 Share Posted March 27, 2010 Shotgun, is a smooth bore . That would be Section 2. Now there is no way that either a twenty five pounder or a two pounder or a six pounder can be called smooth bore! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adrian Barrell Posted March 27, 2010 Share Posted March 27, 2010 Shotgun, is a smooth bore . That would be Section 2. Now there is no way that either a twenty five pounder or a two pounder or a six pounder can be called smooth bore! If you fire them often enough they are! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferretfixer Posted March 28, 2010 Share Posted March 28, 2010 I know that down at Firepower none of their guns are deacctivated but the 2 (25 pdr & 2 pdr) that they use for kids to pull the firing hadles on (.22 blanks) do have their firing pins locked securely away when not in use in secure gun cabinets. I belive Bona Fide Museums are exempt a lot of things under the F/Arms Act! They get a Licence almost automaticaly as large ordanance peieces cannot be concealed under coats Etc....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferretfixer Posted March 28, 2010 Share Posted March 28, 2010 did hear talk many years ago about all on shotgun license but things may have changed, Jason may know.Curator is MOD museum is a private Ltd company wholly owned by the RA. If it'single shot with a smooth bored barrel. It is Sec2 (Shotgun) HOWEVER, the BLANK ammo may be something quite different! Any Blank round over 1" Diameter is Sec.1 F/Arm Licence Required. I had a German 35/36 37mm PAK. I smoothbored the Barrel & got it re-proofed. It is the only one in the world Legaly done to do so. I sold the gun many years later & it is with a collector now on Jersey. I did four (Smoothbored) for A.F Budge when they were at the hight of thier career. And got Certificates of unprovability for them. Which meant they could be legaly sold on S/Gun Cert but NOT fired (LEGALY!) You COULD get it smoothbored, BUT some people would want the originality, which I can understand. These days, the security conditions for Sec.2 & Sec.1 are pretty much the same so it wouldnt make a lot of difference! Getting a 'Ticket' for a Large ordanance peice would be a lot easier than getting one for a small arm. Because of it's very nature of being 'Large', you cant hide it easliy! It is Overt & VERY noticable! Mike. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ford 369 Posted March 28, 2010 Share Posted March 28, 2010 If it'single shot with a smooth bored barrel. It is Sec2 (Shotgun) HOWEVER, the BLANK ammo may be something quite different! Any Blank round over 1" Diameter is Sec.1 F/Arm Licence Required. I had a German 35/36 37mm PAK. I smoothbored the Barrel & got it re-proofed. It is the only one in the world Legaly done to do so. I sold the gun many years later & it is with a collector now on Jersey. I did four (Smoothbored) for A.F Budge when they were at the hight of thier career. And got Certificates of unprovability for them. Which meant they could be legaly sold on S/Gun Cert but NOT fired (LEGALY!) You COULD get it smoothbored, BUT some people would want the originality, which I can understand. These days, the security conditions for Sec.2 & Sec.1 are pretty much the same so it wouldnt make a lot of difference! Getting a 'Ticket' for a Large ordanance peice would be a lot easier than getting one for a small arm. Because of it's very nature of being 'Large', you cant hide it easliy! It is Overt & VERY noticable! Mike. as has been written elsewhere getting a fac or adding some items is very much a postcode lottery I remember talking to a reenactor from the midlands who had tried getting a small German field piece put on his licence but was categorically refused but his mate in the next county managed it no problem at all Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony B Posted March 28, 2010 Share Posted March 28, 2010 If it'single shot with a smooth bored barrel. It is Sec2 (Shotgun) HOWEVER, the BLANK ammo may be something quite different! Any Blank round over 1" Diameter is Sec.1 F/Arm Licence Required. I had a German 35/36 37mm PAK. I smoothbored the Barrel & got it re-proofed. It is the only one in the world Legaly done to do so. I sold the gun many years later & it is with a collector now on Jersey. I did four (Smoothbored) for A.F Budge when they were at the hight of thier career. And got Certificates of unprovability for them. Which meant they could be legaly sold on S/Gun Cert but NOT fired (LEGALY!) You COULD get it smoothbored, BUT some people would want the originality, which I can understand. These days, the security conditions for Sec.2 & Sec.1 are pretty much the same so it wouldnt make a lot of difference! Getting a 'Ticket' for a Large ordanance peice would be a lot easier than getting one for a small arm. Because of it's very nature of being 'Large', you cant hide it easliy! It is Overt & VERY noticable! Mike. Yes I know the gun you sent to Jersey, actually have vidio of it in a one to one duel with a 25 pounder. :-D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marmite!! Posted March 28, 2010 Share Posted March 28, 2010 I've just posted up some Firearms documents here if anyone is interested http://hmvf.co.uk/forumvb/showthread.php?17851-Firearms-Law-amp-Storage-Security&p=197058 one of them is the book Chief Inspectors use (supposed to use) in deciding whether you meet the criteria to hold a FAC... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferretfixer Posted March 28, 2010 Share Posted March 28, 2010 as has been written elsewhere getting a fac or adding some items is very much a postcode lottery I remember talking to a reenactor from the midlands who had tried getting a small German field piece put on his licence but was categorically refused but his mate in the next county managed it no problem at all Nice to know we have 'Continuity' within our lovely Police Forces! Well, we are bowing down to Brussels acording to Mr. (Charlie) Brown, and putting our legislation on an even footing. IE: The proposed Impending legislation we are all concerned about over our MOT exempt vehicles being one such subject. BUT ILL'BET A PINCH TO A BULLS FOOT WE WONT BE ALLOWED HANDGUNS AGAIN, UNLIKE ANY OF THE EU 'BROTHER' COUNTRIES!!!! :mad: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marmite!! Posted March 28, 2010 Share Posted March 28, 2010 Lets keep on topic chaps & not make this political... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferretfixer Posted March 28, 2010 Share Posted March 28, 2010 Lets keep on topic chaps & not make this political... Sorry Lee...You know how frustrating these Laws are!....:nut: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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