steveo578

you could use it to put the toilet roll on:D

Sorry I've no idea on that one, further to vanishing gateguards does anyone know where is 01 FD 05 a Chieftain formerly outside BD Metals formerly Shepards scrap yard in Newcastle

Further to your post shown below are three stock photos of none Barnbow or Elswick welding manipulators for completeness. Ist is Valentine probably at Metro or a sub-contractor. The next is a Mk7 Churchill which again could be at a sub-contractor. The 3rd is the prise winning Guy motors manipulator. Variations of the above are shown in the following central press photos as mentioned in my previous post in the first two photos rotatry manipulators are visible in the background as are other types. the last photo showing a pit manipulator Manifacture of turrets showing turrets both inverted and upright on various plains and jigs, the final photo shows a welder working on the roof of a turret held in a pit manipulator. The purpose of a manipulator is fairly simple to hold the work piece and to allow gravity welding, which improves the quality of the weld, in addition makes it less hazardous to the welder. It would be perfectly reasonable to start the welding of a hull boat inverted. I am fairly sure that most if not all of the Central Press photos were taken in Barnbow rather than Elswick/Scotswood which was a fairly ancient factory even at that time and to endorse what Simon Dunstan has infered that different manufacturers may have different systems to carry out the same job. David Fletcher mentions in his book Mr Churchills tank that a skilled and knowledgeable welder or industrial historian would be able to differentiate the manufacturer of Mk7/8 tanks by the welding methodolgy. Steve

Some measurements might help:-D

The jigs and manipulators in factoies making Cents such as the ROFs and Vickers were pretty much the same as those developed during WW2. The welding manipulators that did the hulls and turrets on Cents were similar if not the same as those used on Valentines and each factory also had at least one manipulator that was a heavier version of the ingenious portable unit that Adrian made. These can be seen in war time photos jigging Churchill mk7 hulls- but in other factories. As to the turret being built upside down, obviously alot of machining around the turret ring requires the casting to be inverted and the Central Press series of photos do show inverted turrets littering the floor at Leeds- however there are photos in the same series showing turrets in the manipulator having the turret roof welded in from above at a fairly early stage in the manufacture and other actions (see the old Ian Allan Centurion book by Simon Dunstan). Prior to the redevelopment of Vickers Newcastle in the 1970s the turret ring machining jig was the same jig that had cut many naval vessels turret rings dating back at least as far as WW1. There were also deep barbette fabrication pits in the plant capable of swallowing a complete 15inch barbette -but planked over and used in later years for comparatively tiny twin 4.45in barbettes for Whitby calss frigates and probably later class single mounts too.

Totally different hull casting especially the front end. Casting narrows toward the front -where the Ram style muguard will be fitted, note the ventilator bulge half way along the side with a small deflector plate welded to the underside of the sponson - where early Rams had sponson doors, the hull front has a drivers door like an M3 or M7priest or Sexton and a different shape to take it. there is a hole for the auxilary turret and a small piece of casting to match up with the Rams M3 style 3 piece differential. Both these were elliminated on later Rams.

Hi Rob When it was said it was a 20mm I thought it could have been the oerlikon designed Light Flak 28 which had a partial fluted barrel -with it being probably 30mm and the possible jeep style wheels I suppose it could be ex Argentine/Falklands war era. Steve

In the interwar period there was still consideration given to use surplus MkVs as recovery vehicles for the Vickers Mk1 and 2s. Whether the MkVs themselves would be in good enough condition or the engines at 150bhp would have been capable of recovery or whether it was planned to use some form of winch I don't know, but I would think that even considering the weight difference the relatively smooth tracks of the MkV would make recovery difficult.

It could be the British order for Sudan field force, as with early 40mmm Bofors AA guns they were partly perhaps wholy supplied from guns made by the Polish State Arsnel at Strrachowice both weapons would be licenced built to normal Swedish high standards- it is rather bazaar that the Poles trying to rebuild there forces were expected to supply weapons for Swedish orders. Britain also received licenced built MAVAG 40mm Bofors AA guns from Hungary. There is also a rumour that Wz36 guns were supplied to Spanish Republican forces during the Civil war- normally thought to be 40 mm Bofors AA as both types share the same Wz36 designation it is possible that it was the 37mm A/T gun

I don't know of any light AAA weapon in 37mm cal. the nearest is the HS661 30mm canon which was re-marketed by Oerlikon after it absorbed Hispano-Suiza, so we really need the bore confirmed- is it de-miled with a completely blocked barrel?

Its a 20mm Oerlikon Gun has a look of a flak 28 but not quite right so probably a Swiss army or comercial sale- maybe Portugal.

I suppose it's a case of reverse engineering, in the late 1940s the pig industry would have benefited from war surplus- Nissen hut and Anderson shelter components- at a time when increase of food production was even more imperative than in wartime (no more lease lend). The modern plastic pig arcs would be a boon to WW2 repos although those shown in the picture are more the size of Anderson shelters -did Jersey get any Anderson shelters before the invasion? Steve

to be fair it's a bit dificult to critique a programme before it is transmitted. There is always I-Player if your computer is up to it, but BBC2 programmes are often repeated (also on BBC4) in fairly short order. By the way I missed it too, no excuse! Steve

You could always try something like TV. BLINKX.com or other television/film sites.

SLR is L1A1 UK never used a heavy barrel FAL

So your gun is Wz36 re-badged as a QF Mk1 -I wonder how it got out of Poland? The plot thickens. Steve

Hrm:-D I had a thread pulled for being less political than that, however as of yesterday BAE Newcastle was still open and available for business, it was the Defence review of 1991 that outlined the future procurement of British Battle Tanks and it was widely expressed at the time that after completing the requirement for 350 odd Ch2 tanks and about 20 DTT (I can't remember the exact figure off hand) it was unlikely in respect of changing requirements (they called it peace dividend ) there would be no forseeable need for a conventional central German plain Battle Tank. Since then and it has nothing to do with the previous government - the effects of the 1986 privatisation of ROF and the subsequent amalgamation and shrinkage of the existing private sector has caused the the UK tank building industry to shrink to effectively one plant -that owned by BAE which despite its name is a defacto a U.S. orientated business. Chieftain was an evolution of cold war tank design but CR1(Shir2) was with the 289 Khalids (Shir1) a product of a failed order with Iran cancelled after the fall of the Shah. Steve

Hi Jason Only FV 4006 and the earlier Mk1 ARV had a winch the BARV FV4018 didn't have one. The numbers would have been useful on the unidentified tanks. there were many turretless Centurions surviving comparatively late on -The Wedgies, the Cent. drivers training vehicles converted from redunant ARKS and at least 2 weapons establishments Shruburyness and Eskmeals had turretless vehicles for various purposes. Steve

I'm sure quite a few where used for small ferrys and others were used in forestry work in the American North West in particular, but they don't last forever. There was a good programme made around 2004 which included quite a bit of good detail about Higgins, unfortuneatly a 24 minute programme is a bit short, however things not mentioned -the US Navy showed classified photos of a Japanese Daihastsu 14 landing craft to Higgins and the Eureka craft was modified with a ramp to the prototype of LCVP, further the Navy designed the 38ft tank lighter of the 1939 -looked like a smaller version of a LCM 3 and was used in the Flex 5 exercise in which 5 Eurekas were first trialed, it was discontinued as the Marines wanted a craft capable of lifting a M2A3-4 light tank. The Navy then asked Higgins to modify his 45ft inshore craft as a replacement for the Navy 38ft lighter- and in that annoying habit the military have they again changed the requirements -to carry a Sherman and Higgins had to design a 50 craft that became the LCM Of course the first effective ramp landing craft was the British bettle of 1915 -used at Galipoli. Steve

you can always watch it on the I Player, but it was fairly light weight.

In some ways the best (artistic) was the enemy of the good, some of these drawing done by limited number of specialists meant that manuals tended to lag behind the in service use of the vehicles. I take it that's a Humber Scout Car.

For information while looking for something else I came across a note that Italian Gendarmerie -police special sucurity -whatever were still using T16s as late as 1979. I've seen ex Italian Sexton, Fox A/Cs and M8 A/Cs for sale by dealers in the late 1980s early 1990s but can't remember seeing any Italian marked T16s- so Italian scrap yards might still be a possible source- but not for steering assemblies. Steve

Hi Eddy I've never seen even a trace of a Universal -or any other carrier for that matter on a range, the only one that ever popped up was a prototype Cavalry carrier on Porton Down many years ago and it has disappeared. There were some near falingbostel -ex German Border Police but they were scrapped in the 1990s. Universals are to light to survive on ranges and were too easily scrapped an too easy to convert to civilian uses -probably what saved yours it has all the appearance of a forestry skidder. I'm sure there will be steering assemblies knocking around somewhere. Steve

If it's a Universal the tank could always be disguised as Wasp conversion. Also you were correctin saying that T16 were used by the Canadians in Europe, as additions to normal Universal inventory for towing in place of the Loyd carrier and for 3inch mortar and radio carriers, I believe the British used them as Loyd replacements from round the time of the Rhine crossing. Steve

correct the Jersey milita had 2 Buford H/Ts from about 1929-30 -wonder what happened to them- pushed off the cliff at Les Landes perhaps. Officially called Carrier, machine gun, 30cwt Burford Kegresse B11E5 , 7 chassis were armoured - 3 by Woolich and 4 by Vickers at Erith. ML8604 armoured by Woolich- previously in service with the Cheshire Rgt (2 in service) and ML8623 both ended up with Jersey Milita attribution of local licence plate is not known. In the summer manuvers of 1928 2nd King Royal Rifle Corps used these carriers as part as Mechanised Force - the revolutionary Salisbury Plain battle exercises in the late 1920s. Probably the photos on post #24 of ML8605 were taken during the Mechanised Force exercises