Jack Posted October 8, 2007 Share Posted October 8, 2007 Ok then - so here is a question as Degsy pointed out that the first helmets were front seamed and Major has pointed out that they went over to rear seam. What difference does a front or rear seam make??? :? :? :? :dunno: Wolfie - was it common for medics to have unmarked helmets? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAJ G. Miskovsky Posted October 8, 2007 Share Posted October 8, 2007 I knew a Combat Medic when I was stationed at Ft. Benning that had been awarded the Combat Medics Badge (CMB) three times (WWII, Korea and Vietnam). He said that he never wore the "Bullseye" markings during WWII or Korea. Interesting that now our field hospital soldiers now qualify for the CMB. I was in civvies at Ft Sam Houston about a year ago and a Major was selling wolf tickets about getting one with the 82nd in A-stan. I asked him what Regiment he was with (as mine was the 505th) and was he active in the 82nd Association.....Er....well.....he said red faced, I was the pediatrician with the CASH (field hospital)! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whistlinwolf Posted October 8, 2007 Share Posted October 8, 2007 Yes Jack, Medics often worked un badged as it made them a target when carrying a red cross. Should make you untouchable according to the Geneva convention but unfortunately it doesn't. A GI hitting the floor with the front of his helmet could often cause the shell to split upwards from the seam when at the front.Rear seam made for a stronger unit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAJ G. Miskovsky Posted October 8, 2007 Share Posted October 8, 2007 Ok then - so here is a question as Degsy pointed out that the first helmets were front seamed and Major has pointed out that they went over to rear seam. What difference does a front or rear seam make??? :? :? :? :dunno: Wolfie - was it common for medics to have unmarked helmets? I believe that it had to do with---- as the helmet aged and the rims as we have all seen begin to separate, a rear seam would "hook" foliage. The helmet would then be "DXed" (direct exchanged) as soon as possible Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whistlinwolf Posted October 8, 2007 Share Posted October 8, 2007 A compact M1 history, M1 adopted in June 1941. Anti magnetic steel rim introduced December 1942. From 44 on it was optional for manufacturers to put seam at the rear. Gets even more complicated still when you start looking at bales and liners :roll: But great for us anoraks !!! :-D Sorry Steve, we appear to have hijacked your thread ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jessie The Jeep Posted October 8, 2007 Author Share Posted October 8, 2007 That's fine, I'm reading with interest! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Posted October 8, 2007 Share Posted October 8, 2007 Apologies for that Steve - Tim started it! Tim I have started another thread in kit chatter with a Q for you :-D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whistlinwolf Posted October 8, 2007 Share Posted October 8, 2007 Roger. Inbound in 1. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abn deuce Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 Thank you for the details on the helmet construction I had not heard about before. To continue on the medic issue Didn't the German Medics also wear a white smock or what ever you call it with a red cross on it front and back ? and didn't they carry side arms as well ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whistlinwolf Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 They did have as an option the white 'bib' which was great to see.but of course it works both ways, all depends on the viewpoint of the man looking down his sights. I read a book recently with actual accounts of WW2 combatants and in one statement a guy said that ,as a machine gunner, it was rare to see more than 1 man fall with a burst of fire unless it was a litter bearer party !?!? The Geneva convention does allow a medic to carry a side arm but its solely to protect themselves/ their patient with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
General Mayhem Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 A British helmet would be easier because the shape is given to an easier release. That is a fantastic reprodution you have done there, I feel almost impertinent suggesting another way to make the Brit-lid. But, deep breath, here goes: As previously demonstated, strip the helmet down to just the shell, clean and repair any flaws, polish it to a smooth finish. Coat it heavily in release wax and leave to dry. While that's drying, mix up a quantity of modeller's plaster of paris. You will also have bought yourself a cycle tyre valve and bicycle pump. Tape the valve in an upright position on the helmet, then build up in stages layers of the plaster of paris, until it's about half an inch thick. Leave to dry until it's rock hard, do not try to speed the drying process with heat or the plaster could crack. To release the helmet from the plaster mould attach the bicycle pump and slowly inject air once the bond is freed it will come apart easily. You now have the 'female' mould. re-wax the mould and tape over the valve, taking care not to let the tape stick to tight to the end of the valve. Line the mould with gelcoat, it comes in many colours, choose whichever you want. A word of warning, the gelcoat goes off after it has been mixed with the catalyst, the secret to getting a good finish is to use the catalyst sparingly. The reason for this being the chemical reaction. The more catalyst you use the quicker it goes off and you then get the risk of shrinking. Or ripples in the finished product. Once the gelcoat has dried, line it completely with strips of fibreglass. You then brush the glass with GRP resin. This again is mixed with a catalyst. Use a stiff bristled brush and make stabbing stencil like brushes to remove any air bubbles. Leave to dry thoroughly. Time for the bicycle pump. If the pump doesn't work you can smash the plaster off. You now have the finished helmet. Make good any marks left by the valve, clean and finish the edges, then de-wax it thoroughly before spraying it. If you want to make a run of them, repeat the proces for making the 'female' mould only this time, do it in GRP. You can use this method of reproduction on almost anything that's hard to source. I hope you find this useful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jessie The Jeep Posted October 9, 2007 Author Share Posted October 9, 2007 That follows along the lines that I would normally use for making multiple objects, except that I usually make a GRP female mould. I've been this route many times, with plaster or GRP, and both are fine. If the shape is more complex, or you plan making many copies, GRP is better for the mould as it is more hard wearing and will last longer. The mould for a helmet should be about 1/4 inch thick to maintain strength and shape. I've also used the bike valve method before. You can mould quite complex shapes by making the mould in more than one part, each section bolting together for laying up the mould, then taking apart to make releasing the shape easier. For the helmet I just made, I wasn't planning on more than one, so I dispensed with the mould stage, and went straight for laying up the GRP on the helmet and finishing the outside. This method is quicker and cheaper for one off's. Has anyone else made themselves any accessories because originals were hard to find for example, or for weight like the helmet? Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlienFTM Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 I knew a Combat Medic when I was stationed at Ft. Benning that had been awarded the Combat Medics Badge (CMB) three times (WWII, Korea and Vietnam). He said that he never wore the "Bullseye" markings during WWII or Korea. If you read The Third World War by General Sir John Hackett (of Arnhem fame, later very senior in BAOR or NATO I forget which), the second volume relates a pair of young soviet officers wandering through a vehicle park full of captured Allied kit. They stop at an armoured ambulance. "Look Ivan, some of them have even painted targets on the front of their vehicles: they make perfect aiming marks for our tank gunners." Funnily enough, shortly after this we were issued Samaritan Ambulances which came with roll-down green blinds to obscure the red crosses when parked tactically. It was all very well displaying a red cross, but the message is sends is "Who else is there?" It draws the enemy's eyes where you don't want them to look. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony B Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 Funny enough I was talking to guys from the first gulf about ambulances. My 101 was there with 4th Armoured. They were saying the roof cross was always covered, the British knew what it was and the Yanks used them for targets. Medical personnel can carry arms for self defence, but cannot initiate a fire fight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlienFTM Posted October 10, 2007 Share Posted October 10, 2007 Funny enough I was talking to guys from the first gulf about ambulances. My 101 was there with 4th Armoured. They were saying the roof cross was always covered, the British knew what it was and the Yanks used them for targets. Medical personnel can carry arms for self defence, but cannot initiate a fire fight. On the day "A white flag is flying over Stanley" I was commanding the Squadron ambulance (Samaritan) simply because it needed a commander and I was experienced. We went on a task somewhere - I forget where. On the way back, we pulled out onto a road behind a Scorpion (of IIRC 9th/12th Lancers, our enemy for the week) who had apparently managed to break through our recce screen and was in danger of causing us real embarrassment. They were blissfully unaware of us. I sent a contact report and followed him. I was all for staying with them and when they stopped I was going to capture them and take their codes - always a BIG prize in Recce. Unfortunately the driver, who was Squadron Medic, reminded me of the giant red crosses on the side of the vehicle and flatly refused, quoting the Geneva Convention, though we did remain in contact until a sabre troop relieved us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony B Posted October 10, 2007 Share Posted October 10, 2007 :-D :-D One thing though, never knock'em to much, you might need them one day :shake: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jessie The Jeep Posted October 10, 2007 Author Share Posted October 10, 2007 Finished!!!!!!! Got the straps added today. A bit tough to sew through, but got there in the end. Anyone at Pickering this weekend will get a chance to see it. Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bodge Deep Posted October 10, 2007 Share Posted October 10, 2007 Just 2 words Steve... Flak Helmet :whistle: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jessie The Jeep Posted October 10, 2007 Author Share Posted October 10, 2007 I could reply with two words, and mine begins with F too!!!!!! ;-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony B Posted October 10, 2007 Share Posted October 10, 2007 :clap: Very very impressive. What else can you mould. How about a beginners guide to glassfibre? I can think of a lot I'd like to make but lack the absolute basic knowledge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jessie The Jeep Posted October 10, 2007 Author Share Posted October 10, 2007 I can feel another article for Jack coming on here!!!!!! :shake: Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
General Mayhem Posted October 10, 2007 Share Posted October 10, 2007 I could reply with two words, and mine begins with F too!!!!!! ;-) One of my clients tends to use the four letter word beginning with 'F' quite regularly, as in: "Any chance you could it for FREE?" A great helmet, a really good job, praise to you sir. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony B Posted October 10, 2007 Share Posted October 10, 2007 I can feel another article for Jack coming on here!!!!!! :shake: Steve Just when you thought it was safe to go back to the bar...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N.O.S. Posted October 10, 2007 Share Posted October 10, 2007 This "tale of two helmets" has inspired me to have a go at moulding. I've just ordered a shed load of chemicals and mat, all I need now is for someone to lend me a Sherman tank......... :whistle: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whistlinwolf Posted October 10, 2007 Share Posted October 10, 2007 SHOW US THE LINER !!!!! :-D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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