Salisbury Plain Camouflage Scheme

[david052]

Hi

 

Does anyone know what the colour code is for the yellow paint in the Salisbury Plain camouflage scheme? I don't think it is desert Limestone - too orange looking. I have pictures but for some reason they won't upload.

 

Thanks

[fesm_ndt]

There are several types. For example I know the Pinzgauers had a roll on waterbased one splashed on before GW2 then they started delivery of them in a RAL colour code (not a BS code).

 

RAL 1002 is one I know of and "from memory" the BS light Stone is 381C 361

 

I got a few more RAL numbers but are on my home computer and I'm in China tonight

[david052]

It isn't the Light Stone, certainly. However the RAL1002 could be a contender, though looking on the Net for examples there seems to be a wide variety. Time to order a sample and see how it comes out.

[sirhc]

I can't see why they would use any colour other than light stone. Maybe the lighting, camera settings or weathering make it look different?

[ted angus]

I can't see why they would use any colour other than light stone. Maybe the lighting, camera settings or weathering make it look different?

 

My paintshops applied hundreds of gallons of BS 361 Lt Stone and BS 285 matt Green and that is what that is, remember every pc monitor laptop , graphics programme changes the colour each person sees. Also there are 7 levels of paint sheen used by the MoD from matt to high gloss - matt Lt Stone looks different to semi matt to eggshell to satin etc etc. Just before GW2 we started to use a B & C agent proof desert cam color BS 380, but that has a pink tinge in certain light. For interest a new green known as "Land Green" is in use especially on RE PFI vehicles & plant and certain RAF equipments ; Also a new desert colour is about to happen - possibly already being used . ?? its possible these will have a Pantone range number

TED

[fv1609]

It might be the shade that is a bit darker than Light Stone, which is Camouflage Desert Sand BSC381C 380.

 

This is current & in use. Together with Light Stone, NATO Green & Black are the only colours quoted in "IRR Requirements for Painting Military Equipment" Def Stan 00-23 Issue 5 October 2011.

 

Looking at on-line colour charts is pretty misleading as it looks rather brown, but then you look at Light Stone that is a lighter brown & looks nothing like the Light Stone I have in my garage!

[ted angus]

It might be the shade that is a bit darker than Light Stone, which is Camouflage Desert Sand BSC381C 380.

 

This is current & in use. Together with Light Stone, NATO Green & Black are the only colours quoted in "IRR Requirements for Painting Military Equipment" Def Stan 00-23 Issue 5 October 2011.

 

Looking at on-line colour charts is pretty misleading as it looks rather brown, but then you look at Light Stone that is a lighter brown & looks nothing like the Light Stone I have in my garage!

 

 

Hi Clive, I mentioned 380 but if that picture is dated 2002 I would be very surprised, we had an urgent overnight task using 380 for gulf war 2 it was only avalible in those days to special order as it had BC resistant properties. 380 has a pink tinge in most light conditions it was a dream to apply we did an urgent overnight task at Leuchars for the mobile radar boys based at Boulmer, they set off north to Leuchars one morning and were driving south very happy bunnies the following morning. BS380 is almost identical to FS30279 which we used used in gulf war one.

As an aside re FS 30279 we had it as an ARTF for aircraft finish and as an alkyd synthetic mixed to a formula in dustbins for some of our vehicles and ground equipment; whilst we also did a lot of stuff in 361 again mixed in dustbins after depot stocks ran out and we overtook the ability of industry to keep pace.

regards

 

TED

Edited August 21, 2013 by ted angus

[fv1609]

Ted oh its that pink stuff, always wondered what that was.

 

But I see 380 was added to BSC381C in 1996. Although it hadn't found its way into 0220-A-221-013 Painting of Service equipment Oct 1997.

[ted angus]

Hi Clive, we didn't use 0220-A-221-013 as our bible, although we held a copy for tasks we did under parenting arrangements for 71 Eng Regt and occasionally prestige jobs for the Lowland Gunners or HQ Army Scotland. I do have a copy of the oct 97 edition and note 380 is absent. .

Some of our painting stuff re theatre colour was in AP 4545 Vol 2, that was up to the late 1980s, but our bible roughly our equivalent of the Army document 0220 etc was contained in the AP119A-0601- 0 series . I have a sheet copied from AP 119A-0601-0B to Amendment no 7 dated oct 94 and 380 is in the BS 381c table in chap 8-0 page 9. As you possibly know when a new page is added to an AP lines that contain changes or additions are prefixed and suffixed with an arrow head mark, from the marks on my copy I can tell you 380 was not added as part of AL 7 so in that RAF publication it was added prior to AL 7 of oct 94. I guess your date of 1996 will be when there was an amendment issued to the BS381 and it therefore first appeared in the published BS document, but the colour is at least mid 94 in age.

Whenever we had to undertake operational measures re surface finishing it always came by Signal, this applied to both GW1 & 2. FS 30279, BS 361 & 380 had never appeared in then current publications by the time I left in 2004.

regards TED

Edited August 21, 2013 by ted angus

[fv1609]

Ted I have very few APs (although I do have one written by the Admiralty which is an AP(N). But nothing to do with paint I'm afraid).

 

The other clue to Army usage would be its appearance in COSA H1 (Part 1). The latest one that I have is 1996 & it hadn't made it into that.

[fesm_ndt]

I 100% confirmed that Pinzgauers were delivered by BAE in Austrian army green (RAL6031) and oversprayed or rolled with a variety of colours, then standardised to RAL colour codes 1002, 1015 and RAL1019. Other codes I was passed from BAE was an Austrian paint Code called B40 and Aerodex 735068 (which I cannot find any reference). At the time I thought it was a bit odd as I am talking about when BAE made Pinzgauers in the UK, not fabricated by Steyr Daimler Puch in Austria.

 

The only paint colour I could not confirm was the rolled on stuff as was a quick fix I suppose.

 

I realise I am talking Pinz specific, but given the range of colours I wonder what else was painted the more yellowish than beige version of paint, given that BAE is rather big. To the eye most vehicles appear to be leaning towards the yellowish end than the beige, which also is similar to the American colour.

 

A row of Pinz at Guildford

[ATTACH=CONFIG]81018[/ATTACH]

 

I was told this was the temp stuff as in a lot of pictures you can see it peeling off in large sections

[ATTACH=CONFIG]81023[/ATTACH][ATTACH=CONFIG]81020[/ATTACH]

 

Light stone. Interesting that the Land Rover is more yellow and what is the vehicle in the middle?

[ATTACH=CONFIG]81019[/ATTACH]

 

My current interest in the more sandy colours . Being French is another weird colour coding system

[ATTACH=CONFIG]81025[/ATTACH]

[ted angus]

Very interesting must get my RAL sheets out but I think the "LAND GREEN " being applied to the PFI R.E. vehicles & plant ans a lot of new RAF equipment is very akin to RAL 6031

 

great photos, photo 4 Your mystery vehicle could be a HUMVEE the Piz with trailer in front of it could well be 380 compare its overall finish to the board carrying the recognition symbol ?? . the furthest away Landie looks like Lt stone ???

Our experience was the temp stuff tended to come off as if it had been sand blasted not in large sheets, the wear in photos 2 & 3 are akin to poor preperation before the colour change.

Edited August 22, 2013 by ted angus

[fesm_ndt]

I was wondering if a Humvee but thought whats it doing in the middle of two Brit vehicles

[ted angus]

Could be an O group or a swapping kit meeting ??? my son has pictures from GW 1 which include vehicles amongst his from nations not even in the war ???

TED

[Desert Rat]

This thread should be about as interesting as watching...er... paint dry....:-D

However, I am finding it of great interest, especially how Ted and co. were mixing short supply paint in dustbins !!

Ted, the pic of the S26's in sand/pink look great.

 

I remember reading that in Gulf War 1 desert paint was again in very short supply and units were mixing their own and one lot ended up with the nick-name 'Banana Custards' because their trucks were more yellow than sand coloured !

[ted angus]

and it was made worse when we were mixing our own that we were buying the required ingredients from any source we could find. A gallon of DULUX trade gloss paint had greater "colour power" than a gallon of a domestic from say B & Q once done we had to matt it but that is another story . At least in UK we could get ingredients of the correct BS colours but for our counterparts in Germany they had to rely on best guessing the RAL equivalents - I have always thought it was our home brews that led to the exotic variations that went to the gulf, especially the stuff out of Germany which is mainlt where the yellow bananas came from. .

TED

[fesm_ndt]

Dug these up years ago for the BS colours

 

[ATTACH=CONFIG]81082[/ATTACH]

[ATTACH=CONFIG]81083[/ATTACH]

[ruxy]

The title of this thread :-

 

Re: Salisbury Plain Camouflage Scheme

 

---------

 

This is getting me a little confused , is there presently / has been in the past - a DP that has gone by the official MOD title of "Salisbury Plain Camouflage Scheme" ??

 

To me - it is just the same as has been used by British forces in Cyprus and the Canadian Training Area ?

 

Apart from the colour tint (the reasons we are probably aware of) , it seems to me that a new and unneccesary common term is creeping in and that is going to involve yet another abbrv. SPCS DP

[timbo]

The title of this thread :-

 

Re: Salisbury Plain Camouflage Scheme

 

---------

 

This is getting me a little confused , is there presently / has been in the past - a DP that has gone by the official MOD title of "Salisbury Plain Camouflage Scheme" ??

 

To me - it is just the same as has been used by British forces in Cyprus and the Canadian Training Area ?

 

Apart from the colour tint (the reasons we are probably aware of) , it seems to me that a new and unneccesary common term is creeping in and that is going to involve yet another abbrv. SPCS DP

 

 

You seem to be forgetting CATC BG at Warminster who also use the sand and green scheme! I think the point is this scheme can turn up in a number of places. When used in training is it always the case that it is used to differentiate OPFOR vehicles, but presume this isn't the case in Cyprus?

[ruxy]

This reveals just a little more, I would be interested to know a little more , are there designated named descriptions for the British DP's to differentiate the colours used ?

 

http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/showthread.php?150728-British-Armed-Forces/page60

 

I suppose this scheme may be related to training or to blend better with the range colours ??

 

Is it a local decision ? At what military executive level ?

[fesm_ndt]

Was digging around paint codes this morning and found this very good list of RAL codes http://army-uk.com/color-ral.php