No Signals Posted July 20, 2013 Share Posted July 20, 2013 A pal of mine is in to 'model' engineering and asked if I knew of any plans for any railway guns. Short answer was that I don't but I knew a forum where someone might know of having seen some. Any references to any books or publications that have technical drawings/diagrams/schematics/ that kind of thing or good photographs of the side, front etc. Accepting that there are quite a number of different ones from different countries. Could start with the East Coast mobile guns and the South Coast heavies? Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony B Posted July 21, 2013 Share Posted July 21, 2013 Most models seem to be of German weapoms. Two places that might have the info, are Wolwich Firepower Royal Artillery musuem, or the Artillery Museum, Royal Amouries at Fort Nelson. Both have good archives. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hair Bear Posted July 21, 2013 Share Posted July 21, 2013 I have seen a very grainy pic of a 12" howitzer that was stored in Golgotha tunnel near Shepherdswell, Kent. It is now part of the East Kent Railway. I think they also have the remains of the lineside ammunition huts. Give them a call, they may be able to help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony B Posted July 21, 2013 Share Posted July 21, 2013 There were two famous railway guns, 14 inch on the east coast during ww2 Winne and Pooh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wally dugan Posted July 21, 2013 Share Posted July 21, 2013 There is a short BRITISH PATHE film on RAILWAY GUNS I think filmed in 1940 on the internet worth a look Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Signals Posted July 21, 2013 Author Share Posted July 21, 2013 Thanks for your suggestions so far fellas. I will pass on all suggestions thanks, keep them coming. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wally dugan Posted July 21, 2013 Share Posted July 21, 2013 Just a thought the obvious musems have been mentioned but how about the ROYAL ENGINEERS MUSEUM at Chatham they were involved in the operation of these rail guns also I remember a full scale model of a rail gun and wagons in the archives at beverley which MAJOR TUBBY ROBINS kept on his desk I think it was on loan to us from Chatham Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ploughman Posted July 21, 2013 Share Posted July 21, 2013 You could have a look at this article. http://www.bluebell-railway-museum.co.uk/archive/newsletter/027/newsletter.htm Scroll down to the bottom and there is a feature with links to film clips of Railway cranes changing coastal battery guns. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Signals Posted July 21, 2013 Author Share Posted July 21, 2013 I remember a full scale model of a rail gun and wagons in the archives at beverley which MAJOR TUBBY ROBINS kept on his desk It must have been one hell of a big desk :wow: But I understand what you mean. Thanks again everyone so far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
utt61 Posted July 22, 2013 Share Posted July 22, 2013 There were two famous railway guns, 14 inch on the east coast during ww2 Winne and Pooh. Winnie and Pooh were not railguns, though they were rail-served. The same goes for the other batteries in the Wanstone Down area, namely Clem, Jane, and the ultimately unsuccessful experimental hypervelocity (i.e., supercharged) Bruce. There were four true railguns at large in Kent in the early days of the war, namely the 13.1/2" Piecemaker (often mis-spelled Peacemaker), Gladiator, and Sceneshifter, and the 18" howitzer Boche Buster. One BL18" tube has survived and until recently was at Larkhill, it is at present on loan to the Dutch National Rail Musuem. As far as I am aware no decision has yet been made where it will be located upon its return. There is more information on the Breakdown Crane Association's forum, http://www.bdca.org.uk/forumtwo/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=117&p=436 , and I quote part of one of my own posts one that site:- The story of the coastal defence batteries around Dover is fascianting and worthy of a book in its own right. The first guns constructed were intended as cross-channel guns and used spare 14" calibre “King George V” class battleship guns, modified for use as coastal artillery pieces. Manned upon completion by men of the Royal Marines Heavy Siege Battalion, these guns were named “Winnie” (after the Prime Minister, Winston Churchill) and “Pooh” (after Winnie-the-Pooh!). These were joined shortly afterwards by the Coastal Defence batteries at Wanstone Down, which used even larger bore 15” battleship guns. All of these guns had barrels so heavy that it needed all three cranes lifting together to lift one. The Wanstone batteries were later augmented with the experimental (and ultimately unsuccessful) hypervelocity gun “Bruce”, which was designed to be able to fire at targets well inside occupied France, but in the event proved less than ideal – the rate of wear in the barrel was such that a barrel would be worn out after only 35 rounds had been fired! Not long after Wanstone Battery had been completed, the four surviving WWI railway gun mounts, rebarrelled with contemporary ordnance, were also moved to the area. These guns were named “Boche Buster”, “Scene Shifter”, “Piecemaker” and “Gladiator”, and in truth played little strategic role since theit limited range meant that they could not fire across the Channel. The were used to harass German shipping in the Channel, and would have been significant had the Germans actually invaded. “Boche Buster” was upgraded to carry an 18” howitzer and became the largest bore railway gun that Britain ever constructed. As far as books, diagrams, and literature on the railguns is concerned there is sadly very little. I do have a fairly old (and rather disappointing) book entitled IIRC "Rail Gun", which is about the only book on the subject I know of. It is quite scarce and i cannot offhand recall the author etc (if I remember I will look this evening). For reasons I have never understood it is printed entirely in blue (illustrations as well) thus rendering it less than satisfactory! There is also a Squadron publication about the German K5(E) rail gun, currently listed on Amazon. One of the German model railway manufacturers (Trix or Marklin perhaps, I forget) used to make an HO scale model of one of the German guns. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hair Bear Posted July 22, 2013 Share Posted July 22, 2013 The original model K5 'Leopold' in HO was made by Lima. 2 piece loco, coach, ammo wagon, open wagon, and the gun itself. There are 1/144 (N) versions of the gun made by a Japanese company but for the moment the name has escaped me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lwt Big Cheese Posted July 22, 2013 Share Posted July 22, 2013 The Romney Hythe and Dymchurch Railway had guns. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony B Posted July 22, 2013 Share Posted July 22, 2013 The Romney Hythe and Dymchurch Railway had guns. Yes, but about .303 and 20mm. :-D A lot of fun to ride on the railway, and they have a very good musuem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wally dugan Posted July 22, 2013 Share Posted July 22, 2013 The ROMNEY HYTHE AND DYMCHURCH railway was and is a narrow gauge railway and I think it ran a armoured train during the second world war which was lightly armed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
utt61 Posted July 22, 2013 Share Posted July 22, 2013 (edited) The book I mentioned above, as far as I know the only book sofar written on the subject of rail guns, is "RAIL GUN" by John Batchelor and Ian Hogg, published in 1973 by John Batchelor Limited and distributed by Model & Allied Publications Limited. It covers American, French, British and German rail guns, and, if you can ignore the inexplicable blue print is not bad. It seems hard to find now, and I suspect wasn't taken as seriously as it deserved due to the bizarre blueness! Hogg's "Allied Artillery of World War Two" has a rather inadequate chapter on railguns and coastal artillery. Squadron/Signal Publications' "Armor No 15 German Railroad Guns in action" is well illustrated but (obviously) only covers German guns. Edited July 23, 2013 by utt61 Correction to Ipad's infuriating auto-mispelling of words it doesn't recognise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jessie The Jeep Posted July 22, 2013 Share Posted July 22, 2013 I took these at one of the Normandy ( I think ) museums, though I can't remember which one. I'm sure someone will know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Signals Posted July 23, 2013 Author Share Posted July 23, 2013 I took these at one of the Normandy ( I think ) museums, though I can't remember which one. I'm sure someone will know. Battery Todt, Calais. Thanks for the very useful info utt61, and others. Everything will be passed on, and I'm sure will be appreciated. I also found a very good online site, but which takes a bit of wading through. Hereon Yahoo groups if anyone else fancies a look. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/railwaygun Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
utt61 Posted September 30, 2013 Share Posted September 30, 2013 One of the five BL18 howitzers - serial number L1 - survived the post-war scrap drive and lived on at Shoeburyness, later moving firstly to Woolwich and then, in 2008, to Larkhill. This howitzer differed from "Boche Buster" in as much as it was only ever fitted on a proofing sleigh, rather than an RTM or Railway Truck Mounting (the proofing sleigh has very limited elevation compared to the RTM). Earlier this year L1 and its sleigh were loaned to the Dutch Railway Museum at Utrecht for a period of 6 months, and both were cosmetically restored at Larkhill prior to the move. The task of dismantling the howitzer and moving it by road to Utrecht was the subject of an episode in the Channel 5 series "Monster Moves", broadcast last Friday evening. The episode is available online (http://www.channel5.com/shows/monster-moves/episodes/gigantic-gun-monster-moves) until 26/10/2013. The howitzer has now returned to the UK and is on display at the Royal Armouries Museum at Fort Nelson outside Portsmouth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Locolines Posted September 30, 2013 Share Posted September 30, 2013 The pier that was built for the gun is still there at shoeburyness, rails and all. We use it for fishing now Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony B Posted September 30, 2013 Share Posted September 30, 2013 (edited) The pier at Shoebury was the Ordance pier. At one time the Royal Ordnace had it's own fleet, including tugs and ML's. The guns themselves were built at Woolwich and transported on barges named Gog and Magog, after the two giants of London. The ROC has it's own flag a defaced Blue Engsign. The Fleet office was also in charge of the Woolwich Arsenal Gas works. In 1890 two huge and at the time most expensive battleship guns ever built were being shipped for proof, and fell off the barge into the Thames at Woolwich! It made the front page of the times. During WW1 large loads such as rail guns were shipped on three specially built railway ferries (One of which was sunsequently sunk at Dieppe in WW2, and one was used to evacuate troops and equipment from Jersey in 1940) the port was the super secret built from scratch Military Port of Richbourough- http://1914-1918.invisionzone.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=105335 http://www.berkeleygroup.co.uk/property-developers/berkeley/developments/royal-arsenal-riverside/history I used to vist the old gun very regularly back in the old Rotunda days, ee.. when I twere lad! Edited September 30, 2013 by Tony B Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grasshopper Posted October 2, 2013 Share Posted October 2, 2013 (edited) Having recently watched the "Monster moves" program about the Larkhill gun, I noticed that one axle was seized. That jogged a memory of a story about its extraction from a siding in Shoeburyness. I found a link to pthe story, probably the last rail movement the 18" rail gun, and it was by an army Austerity steam locomotive http://www.iwsteamrailway.co.uk/the-railway/locomotives/73.html Edited October 2, 2013 by Grasshopper Spelling error Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
25 pounder Posted October 2, 2013 Share Posted October 2, 2013 Back in 1944 , towards the end -we were liberated in september '44- of the war , the German Wehrmacht moved a "small caliber" railway gun into our small town . It had a 17 cm barrel , and fired its projectiles about 30 km , towards the city of Ghent and its neighborhood . Same tubes were used on German battleships. The railway track goes trough the town center , so it's obvious that a lot of damage occured at each blast . Now , 70 years after the conflict , many people living along the railway have 17 cm shells at home , even unfired specimen. Couple of yezrs ago I was given a wooden transport case for 2 17 cm shells , with inscription on the cover , (E) , what stands for EISENBAHN . I hope to recover the 2 shells that belongs in it in the near future Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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