Rick W Posted December 8, 2007 Share Posted December 8, 2007 http://i117.photobucket.com/albums/o72/rik242_2006/5239_1.jpg[/img] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Posted December 8, 2007 Share Posted December 8, 2007 http://i117.photobucket.com/albums/o72/rik242_2006/5239_1.jpg[/img] Great picture Rick - do you know where it was taken? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick W Posted December 8, 2007 Author Share Posted December 8, 2007 All I can get from that is the 5th infantry Division before the crossing of the Rhine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlienFTM Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 Exploded the pic. Negativised to sharpen the writing, rotated and expanded. Germany 19/3/45 -- infantrymen of the 5th Inf Div (obscured: possibly speciying the army the div was attached to) file into German half tracks and other vehicles before the start of the drive to the River Rhine. There follows info about the pic, barely readable. Photo appears to have been taken 7/3/45 - nearly three weeks before the previous date, presumably when it was published. obscured radio obscured from London. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snapper Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 Where did you get it from????? This is an American issued wirefoto print. All press issue pix published in the UK had to be passed by the official censor, who used a red pen to mark what he did not want shown. At The Times all these censored prints survivem but a catastrophic cock-up in 1986 allowed all the uncensored prints to be lost. They were kept in a shed on the roof of the old Times building and it was just forgotten about..... Captions were deliberately vague. Unit names and anything of use to the enemy was obscured - which has a detremental effect today. Typically, this means that many prints are now almost "lost" because not indepth notes survive. Identification marks on uniforms and buildings had to be scratched off negatives. This was "easy" with glass plate, but harder with the newer films becoming available. Newspaper pics from the UK were pooled, as were American stuff. You would have British Official on one hand, which were pix taken by the military - which now reside in Lambeth, and then the British newspaper Press pool - which was all the stuff done by the great unwashed. Sometimes the caption would name the original source, such as the Times, The Daily Sketch, or their syndication arm, The Graphic Photo Union. Papers like the Mail and the Express rarely had their names mentioned in Press Pool pix, but regionals like the Yorkshire Post or Western Mail would - as would any Associated group local titles. It's a lottery The pic shown is an example of a wirefoto - hence the caption down the side. These were usually managed by the Associated Press and United Press from the USA and detail will be minimal. I cannot determine whether this a a Signal Corps pic issued by them, or one by a press snapper. A good find...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick W Posted December 12, 2007 Author Share Posted December 12, 2007 Photo came off ebay, still on there I think. I just saved the image to my computer. You can find the odd interesting bit if you are terribly bored one afternoon, just look through photographs in militaria! ;-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snapper Posted December 13, 2007 Share Posted December 13, 2007 Lots of this stuff is material dumped from picture libraries. All the nationals and regional groups have had massive clearouts and theft has always been a nightmare. Picture libraries are a publishers nightmare because they take up space and even though they can be worth a lot of money (my firm's is valued at between £15-25 million) they are a royal pain in the arsenal to maintain. So they get scrapped. It breaks my professional heart. We've managed to keep ours largely intact - but time will tell. I'm going OFF TOPIC...so I'll shut up before someone snaps my moderators sword in two and rips off my epaulettes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ashley Posted December 13, 2007 Share Posted December 13, 2007 Where did you get it from????? This is an American issued wirefoto print. All press issue pix published in the UK had to be passed by the official censor, who used a red pen to mark what he did not want shown. At The Times all these censored prints survivem but a catastrophic cock-up in 1986 allowed all the uncensored prints to be lost. They were kept in a shed on the roof of the old Times building and it was just forgotten about..... Captions were deliberately vague. Unit names and anything of use to the enemy was obscured - which has a detremental effect today. Typically, this means that many prints are now almost "lost" because not indepth notes survive. Identification marks on uniforms and buildings had to be scratched off negatives. This was "easy" with glass plate, but harder with the newer films becoming available. Newspaper pics from the UK were pooled, as were American stuff. You would have British Official on one hand, which were pix taken by the military - which now reside in Lambeth, and then the British newspaper Press pool - which was all the stuff done by the great unwashed. Sometimes the caption would name the original source, such as the Times, The Daily Sketch, or their syndication arm, The Graphic Photo Union. Papers like the Mail and the Express rarely had their names mentioned in Press Pool pix, but regionals like the Yorkshire Post or Western Mail would - as would any Associated group local titles. It's a lottery The pic shown is an example of a wirefoto - hence the caption down the side. These were usually managed by the Associated Press and United Press from the USA and detail will be minimal. I cannot determine whether this a a Signal Corps pic issued by them, or one by a press snapper. A good find...... A few that i have (the ones i never gave away :cry: :cry:) usually had a vague caption typed onto a slip of paper stuck to the reverse. The German (SS) equivalent had large stamp with a pencilled (usually inked over) description on the reverse. Ashley Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick W Posted December 13, 2007 Author Share Posted December 13, 2007 Ive got a few german ones.Done the UV test on them and they appear genuine. Nice aeriel shot of a field of Flakvierling, if I can get the scanner to work I will post them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snapper Posted December 14, 2007 Share Posted December 14, 2007 Good call Ashley. Herein lies another nightmare. These labels, usually on very thin paper, were glued or taped on and down the years they separate from the prints - result: no caption. It applies right thru the ages. Makes my job a challenge at times. I wish I was allowed to post some of the snaps I care for on this forum - but the firm just want money regardless of how research is done. Only yesterday I found some snaps of Leyland Martians or somethig simllar used during snow clearing by the army .....they'll never see the light of day again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joris Posted December 14, 2007 Share Posted December 14, 2007 Can't we buy the off your boss? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snapper Posted December 17, 2007 Share Posted December 17, 2007 No chance. In the media business - ownership is important and the new buzz-word is Intellectual Property. So even if the collection remains in a haunted dungeon (as it does) - it is not being used by someone else. Ipso facto. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snapper Posted December 19, 2007 Share Posted December 19, 2007 Interestingly enough - in the WWII self-propelled guns thread there is a classic example of a censored pic. Pure history. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Signals Posted December 19, 2007 Share Posted December 19, 2007 Can't name names/locations but a huge Government archive of photos from WW2 onwards has been slowly, and not very systematically, put in to skips for the last year or so; for the basic reason that it is too expensive to maintain it or to pay anyone to sift through them sorting them out etc. Absolutely criminal if you ask me. The only reason it hasn't been finished yet is because they dont have enough spare bodies to to the work! Given to believe it is being done on the quiet. What people dont know about wont cause waves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abn deuce Posted December 19, 2007 Share Posted December 19, 2007 All one can hope then is for someone to have sticky fingers and very quietly save as much as possable . Yes your right it's Criminal for such a rare and valuable resource to be other wise lost for Ever!!!! :angry: . The collection coming from that GM executives estate is a good example , where would we be if someone just tossed those items out ! Now if someone has a spare fifty thousand they could donate to a very worth cause, my library fund??? I promise to only use the money for MV research :computerterror: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick W Posted December 19, 2007 Author Share Posted December 19, 2007 Can't name names/locations but a huge Government archive of photos from WW2 onwards has been slowly, and not very systematically, put in to skips for the last year or so; for the basic reason that it is too expensive to maintain it or to pay anyone to sift through them sorting them out etc. Absolutely criminal if you ask me. The only reason it hasn't been finished yet is because they dont have enough spare bodies to to the work! Given to believe it is being done on the quiet. What people dont know about wont cause waves. Thats criminal and ridiculous. Cannot something be done about it?? :whistle: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snapper Posted December 20, 2007 Share Posted December 20, 2007 It is criminal if it is public property. One would hope they checked whether it is a duplicate of stuff held by the IWM - but the plain fact is that the sheer volume of pix taken in WW2 that did and didn't go before the censor - or did and were banned is overwhelming. It makes me cry. But they would not have just given it away, and finding storage is a massive issue. I can only say, if you know where the skips are, then fill your loft. What would be more criminal is disposal of the original negatives. But this happens.... Nobody cares in the modern Establishment. It's a sad fact that - and this is controversial I know - that old wars won by a Britain made up of it's indegenous population are totally out of favour, but there are many more issues besides that make these things happen. The top table have moved on without bothering to tell the whole membership. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Signals Posted December 22, 2007 Share Posted December 22, 2007 It is criminal if it is public property. One would hope they checked whether it is a duplicate of stuff held by the IWM - but the plain fact is that the sheer volume of pix taken in WW2 that did and didn't go before the censor - or did and were banned is overwhelming. It makes me cry. But they would not have just given it away, and finding storage is a massive issue. I can only say, if you know where the skips are, then fill your loft. What would be more criminal is disposal of the original negatives. But this happens.... Nobody cares in the modern Establishment. As I understand it, but I have to stress I am not in possession of the full facts, everything including negatives is getting junked. Some European Theatre material has been 'cherry picked' and given to a body that is willing to catalogue/preserve them whatever, but the vast majority of material goes to an incinerator (I believe). It is too costly to identify/catalogue/store any more. I did ask my contact if it was worthwhile making an essentially cold call enquiry as to whether 'any material was going to be disposed of, given the onward progress of digital technology storage etc ?' and was told not to waste my time as it would fall on deaf ears. Most likely receive a denial that there was anything to be had. Then the problems would start as to who had 'blabbed'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radek Posted December 23, 2007 Share Posted December 23, 2007 I have better pictures :-D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radek Posted December 23, 2007 Share Posted December 23, 2007 another one Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radek Posted December 23, 2007 Share Posted December 23, 2007 And what the US jeep tooken by kriegsmariene and after then by british army? :evil: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick W Posted December 23, 2007 Author Share Posted December 23, 2007 How would Kriegsmarine get hold of a jeep? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radek Posted December 23, 2007 Share Posted December 23, 2007 This was comment for this picture. Possibly HQ, office, ... I don´t know. ;-) Radek How would Kriegsmarine get hold of a jeep? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick W Posted December 23, 2007 Author Share Posted December 23, 2007 Got a german plate onit, I wonder if it was post 1945, although that still wouldnt explain it. Captured in North Africa maybe? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ashley Posted December 23, 2007 Share Posted December 23, 2007 And what the US jeep tooken by kriegsmariene and after then by british army? :evil: Very interesting camo paint job could well be ex mediterranean/italian campaign Ashley Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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