White metal crankshaft bearings

[Scammell4199]

Does anyone here have any knowledge and/or experience in refurbishing white metal crankshaft bearings?

 

Having found shards of white metal in the sump on the Scammell, and a low oil pressure when hot I’m preparing myself for the worst when I strip the engine.

 

Being quite an experienced machinist I initially thought this was something I could tackle myself, although having read up on the subject on the internet, I’m not so sure anymore.

 

Providing I can gain access to a lathe bigger than mine I can sort the moulds, and i’m sure I could handle the rest of the machining side of things ok. It’s the selecting the right white metal and casting it i’m concerned about because it has to be right first time, and also the final fitting. I read somewhere about an electronic bond test you can do to check the bond between the new white metal and the backing.

 

All that said it might be aswell to bow to someone with more experience of such things given its critical nature. But I’d like to learn something along the way, rather than just shipping it off to an engine rebuilder and getting it back a few weeks later done, aside from the fact I couldn’t afford that anyway.

 

Any ideas? Richard

[rbrtcrowther]

If it still has the gardener engine fitted i would have thought a set of shells would be pretty easy to get hold of. Gardener engines are pretty common and are rather long lived so i would be looking deeply into the reason why the bearings have failed

[Ed Batchelor]

We had bottom end trouble on our Pioneer, white metal shells were originally fitted, we were recommended to upgrade to later LX rods which take later type shells. Saves a lot of aggro scraping in new shells (lots of engineers blue and patience) and longer lasting. Dont know how easy white metal shells will be to obtain, try some marine places as 6lws were used in a lot of marine applications (and still are)

[Richard Farrant]

Richard,

 

try these people;

http://www.gardnerspares.com/parts-by-engine/gardner-6lw.aspx

[john wheatley (R.I.P.)]

Don't know if this is any help to you but when the bearings went in my Morris I had them done by Gosneys in south London, it might be worth having a chat with John Cox of Cox and Turner in Hampshire.

Regards,

John Wheatley

[Richard Farrant]

it might be worth having a chat with John Cox of Cox and Turner in Hampshire.

 

 

Richard,

 

As John says, talk to Cox & Turner, in fact their workshop is quite near to you, at Tintinhull near Yeovil. They only deal with vintage engine work, I have had work done by them ( not whitemetaling though) and they are excellent.

[Scammell4199]

Going on the advice i've had to date, unfortunatly its not as easy as just fitting shells. Early 6LWs were fitted with thick walled bearings that had to be line bored in position, later models were fitted with shells. It may well be possible to upgrade to LX rods, and convert to shells in the case of the big ends but the mains are dictated by how early / late your crank case is. As far as i can establish NOS thick walled bearings are virtually unheard of now, and shells aren't too common either. I've tried a number of places including gardner spares, with the advice generally being to get it pulled apart first and figure out what i've got and what state its in, so guess thats the first step, i just wanted to see if anyone else had any experience of doing it themselves, because i like to do things myself rather than shipping them off for someone else to do. I will definatly contact this Cox & Turner though, Tintinhull is very close to me.

Thanks all for your input. Richard

[ruggyjohn]

hi scammell 4199, had same trouble with my pioneer, it went to gardner enthousiast 01865 400703. ask for david, not something i could tackle myself, if i remember correctly i think you can use the old metal back from the original bearing as a spacer to be able to fit the newer type shells. hope this may be of help. john.

[Scammell4199]

ah nice one ruggyjohn, i was thinking about making some sort of spacer to fit shells into my crankcase. I'm a member on gardner enthusiast, so i think once i've got it all stripped i'll try them aswell.

 

Richard

[Stormin]

ah nice one ruggyjohn, i was thinking about making some sort of spacer to fit shells into my crankcase. I'm a member on gardner enthusiast, so i think once i've got it all stripped i'll try them aswell.

 

Richard

 

Sounds like an interesting engineering project.

Are you thinking of machining the spacers individually, then fitting shells, or going for a line bore for the final finish before installing shells?

Be nice to see some details and pictures of your eventual solution. I'm very keen on the old Gardner diesel engines and consequently the Scammell Pioneers.

[utt61]

Probably not much help, but you could try contacting your nearest heritage railway (provided that it has workshop facilities and carries out loco overhauls). Axlebox bearings on heritage locos and rolling stock are almost exclusively white-metalled and many railways now routinely remetal them.

 

Your bearings will be unusually small to them though!

[Scammell4199]

We had bottom end trouble on our Pioneer, white metal shells were originally fitted, we were recommended to upgrade to later LX rods which take later type shells. Saves a lot of aggro scraping in new shells (lots of engineers blue and patience) and longer lasting. Dont know how easy white metal shells will be to obtain, try some marine places as 6lws were used in a lot of marine applications (and still are)

 

Ed,

 

Can you tell me who told you to change to LX rods and bearings please?

 

Thanks, Richard

[Ed Batchelor]

Sent you a PM.

Regards

Ed