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I can tell you one to avoid. A friend has just got a Toyota Priese as a company car. First day he phoned me, nearly incoherent. It had taken him twenty minutes to make the Bl**dy thing move!. :-D

 

Nearly got run over with one reversing off a drive the other day. I was walking along the pavement and hadn't heard it as no engine running, and the old duffer driving hadn't seen me.

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Nearly got run over with one reversing off a drive the other day. I was walking along the pavement and hadn't heard it as no engine running, and the old duffer driving hadn't seen me.

 

 

Old Duffer and run silent tech is not a good recipe for safety!....Quick get out of the way!

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I would stick with 2wd....

 

Reasons:

 

Generally better MPG (Fuel is a huge consideration)

A well driven front wheel drive car can still do reasonably well in snow

If they have road tyres on them they are almost as bad as a 2wd

Cheaper to run

Better for the environment

 

And the odds are that after 2 hard winters, this years winter may be mild.... And you can guarantee that sods law dictates if you buy a 4WD to handle the snow , ww will get the mildest winter on record :-).

 

Now on the other hand , if you live in a flood zone a 4WD may be a good bet.

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I know a lot would argue with argue with that. Not Land Rover's best product. Car first 4x4 second, I'd say the Volvo or the Subaru have it to perfection. The VX70 and the forester also have the added advantage of fitting in car parks.
In fact the Freelander is quite a good car. The only ones to avoid are the 1.8 petrols(Suffer head gasket failures on a reguar basis) And the 2.5 V6. (Heavy fuel consumption). The TD4 (BMW) unit is a very good one. Thats why i picked that. As for it not being one of Land Rovers best product,Then trust me i think that award goes to some of the newer offerings!.

 

Against my advice my firm has just bought three 2010 Range Rover Vogues. One is a pool car. Which i use. Already the digital analogue dash has crashed three times. and we have had gearbox issues(electronic) I think its safe to say that we wont be getting them again. But thats the way its been with all land rover products(bar defender) over the last 15 years.

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Against my advice my firm has just bought three 2010 Range Rover Vogues. One is a pool car. Which i use. Already the digital analogue dash has crashed three times. and we have had gearbox issues(electronic) I think its safe to say that we wont be getting them again. But thats the way its been with all land rover products(bar defender) over the last 15 years.

 

Landrover and electrics ..... never good when mentioned in the same sentance :-D

As someone who often "fixes" modern farm machinery with a lap top I fear electrics less than many.... however sometimes its all just too clever for its own good .

 

Often wonder if all these modern new generation mill vehicles with common rail engines forced on them by daft emmision regs , couldn't all be stopped in their tracks by a hefty dose of Electromanetic interfearance .... simply fry the ECU and it will stop :(

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"Often wonder if all these modern new generation mill vehicles with common rail engines forced on them by daft emmision regs , couldn't all be stopped in their tracks by a hefty dose of Electromanetic interfearance .... simply fry the ECU and it will stop ."

 

 

There are a couple of outfits here exploring use of either very high voltage spiking of electronics by use of a mat placed on the road that the offender drives over and triggers a jolt to the vehicle stopping it by frying the chips orby use by the police of going through the ON STAR system and disabling the engine by remote control and I think there was another that wanted to use directional beam of some sort to knock out the computer clips .Yes the newer vehicles are not going to be of any use if there were a EMP pulse from an high altitude A-bomb burst . Only the older non-computer vehicles would be able to run.

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For about a 100 years we were able to make cars which could be fixed and maintained without a computer.

 

Changing a damn lightbulb nowadays seems to turn into a partially stripping of a car.

Change oil? Hell no, gotta reset a computer.

 

Are they doing this on purpose so you can't avoid going to a dedicated garage for what used to be the simplest things? All about $$$$$.

 

A good thing Hotel Renault is old, change oil or a bulb? No problem.

 

Getting of my soapbox now.

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Are they doing this on purpose so you can't avoid going to a dedicated garage for what used to be the simplest things? All about $$$$$.

 

 

 

Absolutley! They are doing it on purpose. The pressure to produce cars at low cost due to competition means there's little money to be made on selling them. The real money comes from servicing and parts cost.

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We run a 7 seat Hyundai Trajet as the family bus. Front wheel drive on Pirelli P6 tyres, 40 mpg and it takes us on and off wet grassy agricultural show fields with little fuss. We live in the middle of a series of very steep hills and last winter were only stopped once when some silly beggar couldn't make the hill in a van, but refused help to move it out of the road....:nut: we often have to wade streams in it too and has a reasonable ground clearance to do that. I've always had an old Land rover kicking about for the rough stuff, but recently bought an Isuzu trooper for very little money which performed well in the very deep snow. Plenty of torque for using higher gears and lower revs in the snow. I agree that driver experience is important too. We had loads of cars driven by younger people who haven't driven in snow and ice parked in trees, hedges and ditches all the way down our road...:blush: A session at an off road centre would benefit a lot of people for driving in snow I reckon.

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Absolutley! They are doing it on purpose. The pressure to produce cars at low cost due to competition means there's little money to be made on selling them. The real money comes from servicing and parts cost.

 

Despite the good off road manners of our Hyundai one injector(the one with the electronic 'brain') started playing up which required a new set of four at £700. WAS NOT HAPPY :mad: Seeing as that's nearly what the car is worth we will run it to destruction.........

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"Often wonder if all these modern new generation mill vehicles with common rail engines forced on them by daft emmision regs , couldn't all be stopped in their tracks by a hefty dose of Electromanetic interfearance .... simply fry the ECU and it will stop ."

 

 

There are a couple of outfits here exploring use of either very high voltage spiking of electronics by use of a mat placed on the road that the offender drives over and triggers a jolt to the vehicle stopping it by frying the chips orby use by the police of going through the ON STAR system and disabling the engine by remote control and I think there was another that wanted to use directional beam of some sort to knock out the computer clips .Yes the newer vehicles are not going to be of any use if there were a EMP pulse from an high altitude A-bomb burst . Only the older non-computer vehicles would be able to run.

I will be ok then. As the "On Star" fitted to my car doesn't work in the UK.....:thumbsup:
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Absolutley! They are doing it on purpose. The pressure to produce cars at low cost due to competition means there's little money to be made on selling them. The real money comes from servicing and parts cost.

 

There is definitely something in this.

They charge you £40-50 just to plug the computer in and say "Sorry there is no recorded fault code so there is nothing wrong with it sir" I know there is the alarm does not go off on a really hot sunny day for no reason, there is a fault. Their answer is start replacing extortionately priced parts untill it is cured. Luckily here in England we don't have too many really hot sunny days.

Have you ever priced up you car in parts?

 

 

Mike

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Ever heard of 'Bangernomics?' Buy an old car, of a good reputable make that has been well maintained. The idea is to keep the purchase price at no more than £1000. Then run the vehicle with basic maintinece till it falls apart and throw away. I paid £450 for my Volvo 850 SE estate automatic five years ago. Costs apart from a couple of oil changes, two tyres, reclaimed, a couple of bulbs. I've done about 35,000 miles. The first major cost has been £99.76 for a cam belt kit. Thats belt, idler and tensioner.

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Worth a look if you wont a good car and 4wd have a look at the jaguar x type awd. Nice motor plus either a v6 or diesel and you can pick a good one up cheap got mine for £4000 with full leather air con electric everthing and its a jag.

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Worth a look if you wont a good car and 4wd have a look at the jaguar x type awd. Nice motor plus either a v6 or diesel and you can pick a good one up cheap got mine for £4000 with full leather air con electric everthing and its a jag.

 

But it's not really is it? If you underneath it's actually a Ford Mondeo!

If you buy a diesel one you can look forward to replacing expensive injectors at regular intervals.

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Ever heard of 'Bangernomics?' Buy an old car, of a good reputable make that has been well maintained. The idea is to keep the purchase price at no more than £1000. Then run the vehicle with basic maintinece till it falls apart and throw away. I paid £450 for my Volvo 850 SE estate automatic five years ago. Costs apart from a couple of oil changes, two tyres, reclaimed, a couple of bulbs. I've done about 35,000 miles. The first major cost has been £99.76 for a cam belt kit. Thats belt, idler and tensioner.

 

I agree Tony. Bought a Pug 205D 2 yrs ago for £200. Serviced it myself for the cost of oil and filters and a set of tyres. Done 25K in that time at 60 MPG and just sold it for £300 with 192K on the clock. Can't see the point in having a car sitting on the drive depreciating every day. Now the HMRC are telling me I should have bought a newer car than the '97 Trooper as they don't know which band to put it in for VAT purposes. It's too old for their lists apparently....:nut: All this scrappage scheme fiasco seemed like a good idea until you realise that you still had to have the £xx,000 to buy a new car in the first place.

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All this scrappage scheme fiasco seemed like a good idea until you realise that you still had to have the £xx,000 to buy a new car in the first place.

 

No you didn't. Most people who had "old bangers" to scrap didn't have several grand lying around to splash on a new car so most of it's finance. That's the other way car dealers like to make money by commission on finance deals. A lot of the deals on new cars will also be the ones that tie you into to selling it back to the dealer in x years time as trade against yet another new car, so they're trying to keep you coming back to spend more in a short time.

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Worth a look if you wont a good car and 4wd have a look at the jaguar x type awd. Nice motor plus either a v6 or diesel and you can pick a good one up cheap got mine for £4000 with full leather air con electric everthing and its a jag.

 

I've got an X Type 3 litre Sport, with permanent 4 wheel drive, its been a superb car. During last winter I was the only person able to get out of my road (with a very steep hill) and get to work. Many people enjoying scoffing 'yeah but its only a Mondeo underneath'. This is true, but they forget that the Mondeo is a very reliable and capable bit of kit, with tried and tested mechanicals. Heavy on fuel around town, but recently had five people in it on a long distance run, and a full boot, and she still returned 35mpg. I'm happy with that.

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But it's not really is it? If you underneath it's actually a Ford Mondeo!

If you buy a diesel one you can look forward to replacing expensive injectors at regular intervals.

 

Although it does owe quite a bit to the Mondeo it is a very different beast. I used to work at a main dealers and we certainly did not experience problems with the injectors and found them to be a very under rated model. Lovely car to drive.

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One other point is insurance. My Volvo as main car, being older and therefore only third party fire and theft, is £350 a year. The Disco as a second car.....£165! So I can afford to have two toys at less cost than one expensive type car. If I ever do choose to get rid of one, I loose virtually nothing. As for the scrappage scheme, get rid of your big old banger and get a nice little eco friendly match box! Funny how many new big cars suddenly apperead.

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No you didn't. Most people who had "old bangers" to scrap didn't have several grand lying around to splash on a new car so most of it's finance. That's the other way car dealers like to make money by commission on finance deals. A lot of the deals on new cars will also be the ones that tie you into to selling it back to the dealer in x years time as trade against yet another new car, so they're trying to keep you coming back to spend more in a short time.

That I understand Norman, but monthly payments on a finance package I'm sure add up to a considerably greater expense than running a decent older car. You still pay a lot of money in the long run. Tony makes a good point about all the big new cars that appeared though-wasn't it the best period ever for Discovery and Range Rover sales? Makes you think :cool2:

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As far as I know the diesel X type wasn't available in 4wd - certainly wasn't when I bought my 2.0 estate five years ago, the only awd options then were the 2.5 or 3.0 petrol - I wanted an auto but went for economy instead. That aside it is a brilliant fun car which I love to bits and has been completely reliable and no trouble whatsoever . Whilst it may have a vague family relationship to the Mondeo the underpinnings were so much modified by Jaguar that it is very vague .

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But it's not really is it? If you underneath it's actually a Ford Mondeo!

If you buy a diesel one you can look forward to replacing expensive injectors at regular intervals.

 

Errrr - not quite - the S type shared a common platform with the Mondeo... :-)

 

For snow use - try a proper (i.e. pre-GM balls-up) Saab - purpose designed for deep snow driving!

 

If you want a 6/7 seat 4x4 then the Mr Bushy Pajero is a good bet. We had a 2.5 TD versionb for a while and it was very good.

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