Albion WDHD 23S Restoration. Will's.

[Guest catweazle (Banned Member)]

A rare and interesting project Will.you have got your work cut out for you,but a very worthwhile restoration.looking forward to seeing its progress.cw.

[Swill1952xs]

 

 

I just love this picture, and the speedo works too. Note the mileage.......thought to be genuine. Look at the air gauge 100 psi and the way the air builds up would put a lot of new trucks to shame.

 

 

I'm really lucky to have an ex quarry truck with two of these. The o/s one works if you talk to it nicely, and the other one makes a grumbling noise when it is operated.

 

 

A little note for the driver on the o/s door.....ie, dont try tipping the three way tipper with the pins in opposite corners.:argh:

[Swill1952xs]

Right.................... now for the porn shots. :-D Do ya wanna see my underneath :cool2:

 

 

Looking forward......... the front axle is a bit skinny for a 20 tonner...... must have been made out of some good steel. The beergox casing is all aluminium, and the sump is a massive ally casting too.

 

 

The rear axles are permanently linked worm and wheel diffs. I don't know if Albion made these or not. Braking is full air Westinghouse equipment. Axle travel is limited by cable stops at the end of the springs. Suspension is two inverted semi elliptic springs.

[Swill1952xs]

I'm beginning to get quite excited by the rebuild, and buying the donor truck was just about the best thing I ever did. Between the two of them; they have most of the parts I need, and the original truck appears not to have been cannibalised abused or stripped of its original fittings. Ok some will have to be remade, but at least I have patterns to work from also there are the photo's you've been kind enough to post up for me, for which I'm very grateful. :thumbsup:

 

The roof from the complete truck will be restored and used again. The cab panels are skinned with sheet steel folded around the angle iron

frame in a 'C' shape and are not welded to it, so with the exception of the compound curve front corners; I'm seriously considering re skinning it. The problem being finding some good quality steel sheet. Most of the sheet steel available is more like sh*t steel. I was wondering whether to use some steel with what is known as "Zintec" coating. That is obviously zinc coated and has an etched sort of finish so it should take paint well. One thing I may have difficulty finding in a size large enough; is the sound deadener felt stuck to the inside of the back panel of the cab. Ideally it needs to come off a roll wide enough to cover the height of the panel itself. It is sandwiched between the angle Iron frame and the sheet steel. Normal sound deadener material only comes in small squares and I don't want it either to look like it has been tiled and have it all peel off on the first hot day of the year. :-(

 

Work is a pain in the bum......... now I've started, all I want to do is get on with it. :-(

[AndyFowler]

Nice one Will ! Hope it all goes to plan ! Should be a real show stopper when she's all done ! Really will be a rare old girl ! Well worth the huge effort in saving her ! :-D

[gritineye]

Nice to see more detail Will, very interesting truck, a lot of work ahead of you, but we're with you all the way, keep posting :thumbsup:

 

As to Zintec, I would use it if only because it means you won't have to worry about priming every thing when you run out of time or it gets dark, and then you have to leave it for a week or so.

[Simon Daymond]

hi matey, like the part about being ashamed at letting her sit out, been there myself!

 

I wouldn't rush to use zintec, it doesn't take paint well unless you really abrade it, normal sheet steel is good enough for the panels, and with a good coat of paint will see you out.

I have a zintec rear corner on the militant, it was all the metal we had left at the time, yes it stood up to the weather, but it was a pig to get the paint to stick to it.

[gritineye]

Simon, I agree with the paint not sticking but if it is washed with 'Mordant solution' this prepares the Zinc coating for paint, had good results when painting new galvanized Landrover chassis.

 

http://www.decoratingdirect.co.uk/viewprod/t/TORTWASH/

[ArtistsRifles]

I think this will be a lovely truck once you finish - keep up the good work, don;t worry about the time it take - it will take as long as it does.

 

I'll look forwards to seeing it one day

 

As for the brackets - on the Mk 1 Militants we had there were no brackets because they were the short wheelbase 3-way tipper units. some where in this house are some photo's of 215 Sqdn's Militants - one of these days I'll find them!!!

[Swill1952xs]

I think this will be a lovely truck once you finish - keep up the good work, don;t worry about the time it take - it will take as long as it does.

 

I'll look forwards to seeing it one day

 

As for the brackets - on the Mk 1 Militants we had there were no brackets because they were the short wheelbase 3-way tipper units. some where in this house are some photo's of 215 Sqdn's Militants - one of these days I'll find them!!!

 

I'm getting really peed off with work at the moment...... it gets in the way of the important things in life like my trucks. Since I have gone from a salary to being paid hourly, my bosses have decided that I need to do more work in the depot and that means working from 7:30 to 5:30. When I was doing more driving I used to start at 2:30 in the morning and if all went well I could finish at about one and go and work on my truck. Bloo*y typical. :argh:

Er.......... do you or anyone else know where I would find a Militant 3 way tipper body...... an Edbro one..........because it is the same body as mine...... and I desperately want one. Surely someone must have one lurking in the corner of their yard some where. I have a feeling that I will never find one though, but I still keep hoping.:-(

[Swill1952xs]

hi matey, like the part about being ashamed at letting her sit out, been there myself!

 

I wouldn't rush to use zintec, it doesn't take paint well unless you really abrade it, normal sheet steel is good enough for the panels, and with a good coat of paint will see you out.

I have a zintec rear corner on the militant, it was all the metal we had left at the time, yes it stood up to the weather, but it was a pig to get the paint to stick to it.

I wouldn't mind using ordinary steel if I could get good quality stuff. As I said earlier, the stuff car panel suppliers sell; if any area of it is left unprotected; will rot through in three to four years. It seems to have a very open 'grain' and although it is very easy to bend and work with; it rusts within hours of being welded. Must be recycled washing machine metal. It isn't that cheap to buy either. :-(

[6 X 6]

but it was a pig to get the paint to stick to it.

 

Has anyone else tried this product, 'CombiPrimer', for overcoming poor adhesion by paint to certain surfaces ? I reskinned a similar cab to Will's Albion using galvanized sheet and, after degreasing, applied this stuff which dries leaving a tacky film to

which an undercoat of paint will bond. I think it's suitable for most types of paint, and in every case where I've used it, has successfully endured over many years. Rust-Oleum is the brand, it's not a rust treatment.

 

 

I think it's called an adhesion primer....... I would have thought most proper paint shops sell/could get it.

 

http://www.colglo.co.uk/products.php?cIndex=942_944_945_949

Edited March 2, 2009 by 6 X 6

[Swill1952xs]

Has anyone else tried this product for overcoming poor adhesion by paint to certain surfaces ? I reskinned a similar cab to Will's Albion using galvanized sheet and, after degreasing, applied this stuff which dries leaving a tacky film to which an undercoat of

paint will bond. I think it's suitable for most types of paint, and in every case where I've used it, has successfully endured over many years. Rust-Oleum is the brand, it's not claiming to be a rust treatment.

 

 

Thanks for the info......... praps I'll google it and see what it says.:thumbsup:

[gritineye]

You could try Parker Steel they will know the type of steel you're after, I got mine from them, can't remember what type though. I don't think they do COD for small orders any more and their website is down at the moment.

[6 X 6]

some where in this house are some photo's of 215 Sqdn's Militants - one of these days I'll find them!!!

 

I look forward to seeing these pix.

[ArtistsRifles]

I'm getting really peed off with work at the moment...... it gets in the way of the important things in life like my trucks. Since I have gone from a salary to being paid hourly, my bosses have decided that I need to do more work in the depot and that means working from 7:30 to 5:30. When I was doing more driving I used to start at 2:30 in the morning and if all went well I could finish at about one and go and work on my truck. Bloo*y typical. :argh:

Er.......... do you or anyone else know where I would find a Militant 3 way tipper body...... an Edbro one..........because it is the same body as mine...... and I desperately want one. Surely someone must have one lurking in the corner of their yard some where. I have a feeling that I will never find one though, but I still keep hoping.:-(

 

Trust me on this mate - you're better the way you are rather than being like me right now - loads of work I need to get done on the Stalwart and some on the OT - but being out of work means no money even for the fuel to get there!! :cry: :cry:

[Swill1952xs]

Trust me on this mate - you're better the way you are rather than being like me right now - loads of work I need to get done on the Stalwart and some on the OT - but being out of work means no money even for the fuel to get there!! :cry: :cry:

 

Sorry to hear about your lack of employment. It must be really depressing and demoralizing, especially if you had the sort of income that isn't readily found in new employment. :noyay:

What worries me is that employers may exploit new staff by offering much lower wages than a job is worth, and then expect you to be grateful for just having a job.

The company I work for is as busy as hell. Overheads are extortionate

and we sometimes make very little profit from fuel sales. We think we are sitting comfortably, but you never know what is round the corner. Our bosses have Hotels in Austria and could easily pull the plug at any time, leaving us out in the cold.

The last time I got made redundant; I tried applying for jobs but the pay was crap, so I started off my own car repair business with offers of work from members of The Jaguar Enthusiasts Club to which I belonged.

Word of mouth soon brought me more work and the business was always busy. Sadly my weakness was failing to keep accurate records of the time I spent doing the jobs, and didn't make as good a living at it as I should have. I got fed up living from one set of bills to the next, trying to avoid going VAT registered, interference from the Council, and all the other busy bodies.

 

Fortunately my Albion donor is a half hour walk from my house so it isn't impossible to get to, and there's a lot I can do before I need to spend any money.

 

Good luck with your job hunting, but I suggest you take a good look at yourself and assess what skills you have and how you could make use of them. Is there a service you could offer friends, relatives or acquaintances that would give you an income. If you start off doing something and people like you, word will spread quickly and soon you will be independant. Word of mouth is the best advertising, and there's the added bonus of not having to pay income tax for the first year. Don't forget to pay your national insurance though. Whern I was self employed; I only paid about 8 -10 pounds a month.

 

Good luck with your job hunting.......... buy a cheap caravan and get someone to tow it and transport you to your vehicles. You can stay there all week and get some serious work done. Maybe you could sell it and use some of the money to live on and buy another to restore.... there ya go, you are already in business. :goodidea: :yay:

[ArtistsRifles]

Thought about this very idea!! My skills lie in the IT world - Relational Databases to be precise and - hopefully our very own Clive might have some nice words to say on that topic!!

 

Did consider, though, the possibility of a business looking after PW MV's - there seems to be a shortage of places offering a good & reliable service to PW owners (try mentioning a Stalwart and most existing companies blanch and add a couple of noughts to the bill - the Terry Pratchett version of quantum accounting ). To do this though would need:

 

 

1. A couple of other guys who are good mechs - the accident in 07 has left me a bit immoblie too.
   
2. A building large enough to work on more than one vehicle in - preferably three so work can keep going if parts are needed on one or two - and accessible from the main routes via low-loader with adequate room outside to unload.
   

 

It is a possibility though!!

[6 X 6]

[Swill1952xs]

 

Lovely picture............. have Salvage Squad been down the field where mine's kept and finished it for me. I wish that was mine in the picture.... maybe one day. :-D

 

Pssst, don't tell anyone, but I have exams for my ADR license tomorrow, and hopefully I will be away by noon, so I'm going to "Bunk off" work tomorrow and carry on dismantling my donor Albion. Well they don't know what time my course finishes. :-D

 

I've been hunting for parts for the restoration and sent an E mail to David Crouch to see if he has any Albions left lying around. I'm after a complete spare wheel carrier, and have asked him if he has any idea where I could find a three way tipper body.

 

I've also been searching E bay for parts and will probably order two new front side lamps tomorrow. I'm looking for some complete headlamps too. There are a couple on E bay at the moment, but both have the outer domed ring missing. That's the bit that looks like the chrome surround on a normal vehicle; fitted the wrong way round. I call them "Inside out" headlamps.

 

I will keep you all updated on progress. Catch ya later!

[Swill1952xs]

Hi Dudes,

I managed to escape early from my ADR course today and have been stripping my donor truck. I had a bit of a setback though, my nearly new angle grinder gearbox blew up, so I didn't get quite as much done as I hoped. Bloo*y angle grinders don't last five minutes any more, either that or I expect too much of them.

 

Here are some pictures of how things are at the moment.

 

 

The back panel doesn't look too bad, but there's some nasty rust under the soundproofing on the left hand window. Definitely a re-skin job.

 

 

This picture gives some idea of how the cab is made. Albion made the floorpan and windshield, the rest was made by A.C. Penman of Dumfries.

 

 

I 'E' Mailed David Crouch yesterday to see if he had any Albions laying around rotting in the grass. He had some a few years ago, so I was wondering if he could help me with a spare wheel carrier as I need a complete one. I have some of the parts, but a complete one would be better.

I also asked him if he had any idea where I could find a three way tipper body for mine. Stupid question I know, but you have to ask all the same.

 

This evening I have bought some 1960's Lucas rear indicators for the restoration, off of E Bay. I know they didn't have them originally, but had the army fitted indicators; these would have been the type they would have fitted. They are the same as the very early Bedford TK ones, about four inches in diameter. Trouble is that it isn't really safe to use semaphore indicators on todays roads.

 

I've also bought the correct sidelights for the front from greenmachine surplus. They are brand new old stock units. I also wanted a Nato hitch locking pin so I E mailed him for a better price on postage. He came back to me with half the total postage and threw the locking pin in for free. As you can imagine I was delighted, and said I would give him a plug on here. Plug done........

 

I'm hoping to carry on with the truck on Saturday so there may be more pictures soon.

Catch ya later. :thumbsup:

[6 X 6]

so there may be more pictures soon.

 

 

Will, if you get time, would you please include a close up 'photo of the type of headlights fitted to your lorry ? Thanks.

Edited March 12, 2009 by 6 X 6

[madrat]

Hey Will,

Just wanted to say that I'm very impressed with what you are attempting! It looks like you are making good progress :-D

 

As they say 'I saw this and thought of you' spoke to the owner yesterday who said it was a tipper originally? I don't know the first thing about Albions so sorry if its irrelevant!

 

[Swill1952xs]

Just another little update of what has been going on this weekend.

 

Yesterday I was lucky enough to have a whole day working on dismantling my donor Albion. I bought a new grinder to assist with dismantling and got all of the cab off bar the floor panels.

My enthusiasm is still there, as I have it in my mind what has to be done and how I will do it. My biggest nightmare and area of doubt in my skills is with regard to the wings. I'm certain I can overcome the manufacture or repair of the inner cab wings, but have serious doubts in my mind about how to go about making the outer wings. I either need to develop some new skills or buy a wheeling machine and produce some compound curves for the outer part of the wings. I doubt whether I could afford to have some professionally made as I aint that rich.

Here are some more pictures of the stripdown and comments on the condition of the parts removed.

 

This is obviously the front panel. All the supporting steelwork at the back is in very good condition. The front panels look fairly good, but the outer edges and headlight mounting areas are pretty poor.

If you look closely you can see a join just above the corners of the radiator shroud, so the plan is to replace the outer metalwork with new, using the old ones as templates. Crafty eh... :cool2:

 

This next picture shows the top edge of the front panel. The outer panel and the inner frame are spot welded together, and as you can see, the water has got between the spot welds and forced things apart.

The edge has gone very wavy, and as this is the face the windscreen closes against, drastic action will be needed to stop the front looking decidedly wrinkly. More so if it is painted with gloss paint. It would be nice to have it in gloss, but I prefer the look of the Nato green matt.

 

 

The next pictures are just general views around the chassis and engine.

 

 

 

 

 

One thing I really enjoy about dismantling this truck; is finding out all the design innovations Albion used in the manufacture of this truck. Firstly I hadn't realised that the engine had a separate block and crank case. The other surprise I had was finding out the reason for its very close precise feeling gearchange. The secret of that being that the gearlever box is actually mounted directly to the crankcase and not the chassis. No lost movement there.

I heard of a chap who had a petrol HD23 N (The one I wanted to buy last year) and he told me he was going to fit an AEC 760 into it. Looking at mine, I think he will have a hard time as he will have to make a chassis mounting for the gearlever box, and there is very little room to do so. If the 760 engine is wide, he's going to have some real problems. I've tried contacting him to see how he got on, but I've had no replies to my E Mails since he moved.

 

That's about all for the moment. Just looking forward to my holiday so I can get on with it. I will update you on any further progress. I am itching to get stuck into freeing off the engine to see if I can get it to run. If I can and it sounds ok, then I may decide whether to sell one of the engines. Possibly to the chap with the 23N if I can get hold of him. Not sure that that would be such a good idea though, as Albion Engines are as rare as rocking horse poo.

[Swill1952xs]

Hey Will,

Just wanted to say that I'm very impressed with what you are attempting! It looks like you are making good progress :-D

 

As they say 'I saw this and thought of you' spoke to the owner yesterday who said it was a tipper originally? I don't know the first thing about Albions so sorry if its irrelevant!

 

 

Bloo*y hell,:shocked: you'd have to be brave and extremely clever to restore that one. :sweat:

Believe it or not, I don't know a great deal about Albions, so I don't know what model this is. I wonder if the owner has any of the remainder of the cab. I would imagine this would be spares only, but if it is ultra rare then it needs a home with someone with a bank balance that will allow it to be restored properly. It definitely isn't a Claymore but I will try and see if I can find something resembling what it could be.