Zero-Five-Two Posted December 11, 2011 Share Posted December 11, 2011 Doing the front brakes on the old Militant, Got the drums and shoes etc off, but cannot seem to remove the hub. Cap came undone easy enough to reveal a big nut holding the drive shaft in, but having removed that the hub is still securely attached. Anyone know how they come off? I tried giving a few hefty whacks with a copper hammer but that didn't help. Drive shaft splines are free enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Farrant Posted December 11, 2011 Share Posted December 11, 2011 Doing the front brakes on the old Militant, Got the drums and shoes etc off, but cannot seem to remove the hub. Cap came undone easy enough to reveal a big nut holding the drive shaft in, but having removed that the hub is still securely attached. Anyone know how they come off? I tried giving a few hefty whacks with a copper hammer but that didn't help. Drive shaft splines are free enough. Hi Rob, Looks like the bearings are tight on the stub axle tube. What you need is a hub puller, a gert big thing like a spider, you fit collars on four of the wheel studs, screw the wheel nuts on and the puller legs then screw on to the collar. A jacking screw is used to push it off. Care would have be taken on this one as you should not really be pushing on the drive shaft. Richard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zero-Five-Two Posted December 11, 2011 Author Share Posted December 11, 2011 Thanks Richard, I didn't really fancy using a puller which would be pushing on the drive shaft, in case it pushed it back into the tracta joint. I was more concerned that I had missed undoing a circlip or something that was still holding it on. it looks like there is room for something like a portapower spreader to be used from the brake shoe side to push it off. It doesn't "have" to come off, but it would make it easier for cleaning and refitting the brake spring and some fresh grease in the bearings would be good too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Farrant Posted December 11, 2011 Share Posted December 11, 2011 (edited) Thanks Richard, I didn't really fancy using a puller which would be pushing on the drive shaft, in case it pushed it back into the tracta joint. I was more concerned that I had missed undoing a circlip or something that was still holding it on. it looks like there is room for something like a portapower spreader to be used from the brake shoe side to push it off. It doesn't "have" to come off, but it would make it easier for cleaning and refitting the brake spring and some fresh grease in the bearings would be good too. Rob, Just had a closer look at your photo, the nut would only appear to hold the tracta shaft in place, what holds the hub on? It is too many years since working on these and I cannot visualise them now, have you got a manual? Edited December 11, 2011 by Richard Farrant Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrisg Posted December 11, 2011 Share Posted December 11, 2011 may be that ring with what look like 6 holes in has something to do with it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philb Posted December 11, 2011 Share Posted December 11, 2011 Rob, if it's like the Matador axle, and it looks like it, the book says take the whole hub off the swivel joint first then (eventually) drift the centre (the bit you are trying to remove) out from the whole unit. Having spoken to a few people who have done this, it seems to involve a lot of blood, sweat and bad language - as well as taking a long time. If you do decide to take it apart, give us a photo diary of it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulbrook Posted December 12, 2011 Share Posted December 12, 2011 I would be astonished if it were so complicated that it needed to be taken off as a big lump and then dismantled on the bench (or, more likely, rolling out of control on the floor causing alarm, despondencey and barked shins). Do not fear Mr Hub-Puller, as it will not press the stub axle into the joint, merely create an irresistible force between the shaft and the hub - and it will be the hub (or more precisely the bearings on the shaft/in the hub) that will let go first. It is amazing how accurately applied force does the trick where sledgehammering in the wrong place wont. But it will need a big one and I was just wondering how I would fettle a makeshift one. I think it would involve steel channel cut and welded into a bridge, with feet bolted onto 2 wheel lugs using the wheelnuts and a 3 ton bottle jack between the bridge and the end of the stub axle. If that didnt crack it I would modify it and use a 5 ton bottle jack........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zero-Five-Two Posted December 12, 2011 Author Share Posted December 12, 2011 Thanks for the encouragement gents, I do have access to a proper Leyland hub puller that bolts on to the wheel studs and has a twin screw pushing bolt in the centre for extra torque pulling. But to be honest I'm scared of breaking something that I can't replace. I have had a second look at it and under the cobwebs on the inside is a ring of 1/4 whit studs and lock nuts, but even undoing them doesn't release anything. I think, for now, I might just clean the shoes etc so they work properly and leave the hub for the warmer weather next year. Dont fix what ain't broke as they say. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
16svt Posted December 12, 2011 Share Posted December 12, 2011 I would be astonished if it were so complicated that it needed to be taken off as a big lump and then dismantled on the bench (or, more likely, rolling out of control on the floor causing alarm, despondencey and barked shins). Do not fear Mr Hub-Puller, as it will not press the stub axle into the joint, merely create an irresistible force between the shaft and the hub - and it will be the hub (or more precisely the bearings on the shaft/in the hub) that will let go first. It is amazing how accurately applied force does the trick where sledgehammering in the wrong place wont. But it will need a big one and I was just wondering how I would fettle a makeshift one. I think it would involve steel channel cut and welded into a bridge, with feet bolted onto 2 wheel lugs using the wheelnuts and a 3 ton bottle jack between the bridge and the end of the stub axle. If that didnt crack it I would modify it and use a 5 ton bottle jack........ I rebuilt my Matador front axle last year (they are the same). You have to have the swivel assemble completely apart. You need to take both swivel pins out, then extract the tracta or CV joint and half shaft. then disassemble the whole shooting match on the deck. it really is not a nice job to do. if you are stuck, i can email the pages out of the manual. You can still get all the bearings from Timken, but they are not cheap. I also have some felt strips for the swivel seals. You also will need 2 new bearing oil seals (each side). I found a couple of NOS ones, but i am sure you could get new for a bearing supplier. if you need any help or if i can help with any parts, PM me and i will give you my number. Good luck. Dan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
16svt Posted December 12, 2011 Share Posted December 12, 2011 I forgot to say, if you think it will be much easier going back together. it wont, as you have to lift the very heavy swivel assemble, whilst getting the swivel pin bearing in the correct place and the get the pins in. I did manage by myself, but if was not easy. Good luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zero-Five-Two Posted December 13, 2011 Author Share Posted December 13, 2011 Cheers Dan, nothing like a bit of good news I don't mind a challenge, but with that sort of excitement to look forward to I think it can stay as it is for now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butch Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 Cheers Dan, nothing like a bit of good news I don't mind a challenge, but with that sort of excitement to look forward to I think it can stay as it is for now. Hi Rob, If you still want to take the hub off, send me a pm with your email address and i will scan the relavent pages in the emer and send it to you . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zero-Five-Two Posted December 21, 2011 Author Share Posted December 21, 2011 Thanks Butch, PM on its way Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Daymond Posted February 6, 2012 Share Posted February 6, 2012 Rob, don't you have a manual? I'll scan you some if you wish? Should have bought a 6x4, no complication there. Front drum etc just all came apart, last people to touch it, REME I'm guessing, put everything back with plently of grease etc. Shame they didn't replace the brake spring, instead it was lock wired to the top shoe, as the top hook had broken off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zero-Five-Two Posted February 6, 2012 Author Share Posted February 6, 2012 Thanks Simon, I have the proper operators handbook for mine, and a parts book for the 6 x 4 which is near enough for most things. As for the wheel hubs I decided to leave well alone for now, don't fix what ain't broke so to speak. It looked too much like hard work. Does your Dart spring fit? or are you still trying to get hold of Charlie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Daymond Posted February 6, 2012 Share Posted February 6, 2012 (edited) I have the proper manual, it has loads of pictures! I haven't tried the dart spring, Charlie reckons to have some, but I'd have to find time to go over. Friend of mine with a Matador had some made, which might be a route to go down if Charlie hasn't any? I'm sure some of the other militant owners will want some, unless they are a fortune. Edited February 6, 2012 by Simon Daymond Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zero-Five-Two Posted February 6, 2012 Author Share Posted February 6, 2012 Nice, might have to get a copy of that at some point. Is that the full repair manual? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Daymond Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 Yes full manual, I didn't realise but it is ring bound, so should undo to scan. I could do with making a digital copy, that way it's safe, I've lost count of the times I've mislaid it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Daymond Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 just rebuilt the O/S front hub, yes a Dart spring does fit, I'm thinking of getting some proper ones made if anyone's interested? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon_M Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 I'm sure I'm not the only one that doesn't know what that is, so a word or two on the subject would be welcome please. Gordon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zero-Five-Two Posted February 14, 2012 Author Share Posted February 14, 2012 Hi Gordon, Didn't mean to sound secretive, it's just me and Simon are in the same line of work and allowed a bit of jargon to creep in. Explanation of a Dart spring: A brake return spring taken from a Dennis Dart service bus. Fits a Militant front brake quite well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Daymond Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 Hi all, sorry about that, and to add a bit more... it was a front spring I put it on as a temporary fix, just so I could move the wagon out of the garage. If it works, I'd have to do the N/S as well as I'm guessing two different springs might cause brake imbalance? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon_M Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 OK, ta, know how that happens. Just sounded like you had some really useful secret weapon there. Notice how everyone else was too scared to ask? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zero-Five-Two Posted February 15, 2012 Author Share Posted February 15, 2012 OK, ta, know how that happens. Just sounded like you had some really useful secret weapon there. Notice how everyone else was too scared to ask? Absolutely, we keep it in the same box as the "Sonic Screwdriver" and the "Round-To-it" :-D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattyboy Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 If anyone is stripping down front hubs Militant or Matador do the big nut up tight I think its 80mm socket, leave the covers off, drive round for a few miles take the nut off again clean it up and locktite it on, two centre punch marks so you can see if it comes loose later on. You may think this is all common sence......... but I've seen enough loose hubs to raise the point! I have plenty of spare axle parts if anyone needs them and my other top tip for lighter stearing is don't fill the hubs with oil, pump it with grease, makes so much difference regards Matt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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