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I've brought two Second World War Loyd Carriers which were recovered from a live target range in Belgium in 2008. I was not envolved with the recovery of the wrecks but was given the details of the Military Scrap guy which had them by a friend of a friend who was searching for Universal Carrier spares for his ongoing restoration project. Thanks Rich.

There are no photos in this first post, but as the wrecks are arriving in two weeks I thought I'd start the thread in earnest. The plan is to rebuild two vehicles but initially one will take precedence with the other acting as a parts source. Many parts will have to be re-manufactured, and as there is virtually no upper hull remaining, many drawings and information gathering missions will have to be undertaken.

 

Both Vehicles are Mk2 Spec (as later type of brake back plates fitted), weather they are No1, No2 or No3 variants can't yet be established, engine inspection is required.

 

My wife has christened one of them already:

'Little Tinker'

 

I'll get one of the guys to add 'restoration' when it really has started!

 

NB: See http://hmvf.co.uk/forumvb/showthread.php?19376-Loyd-Carrier for a first part of the tale!

Edited by ajmac
Added a Link to the original thread when I 1st found Loyds

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hi alastair

 

sounds like it's coming together for you and good luck to you mate, it's an ambitious project to start with and i'm sure there's plenty of guys out there willing to help you if they can, i know i will.

 

carpe diem

 

eddy

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1st 1 hour work on the Loyd.

Took all the chassis measurements and put them on the drawing for the fab shop, some hot riveting will be needed for the cross members. Noted that chassis is different from that drawn in the parts book, suspect the later TTs with larger towing brackets is to blame. Drawing is probably from an early vehicle. The two chassis also vary in small details.

 

Engine:

Although rebuilt post war the spark plug lengths confirm it is of US manufacture, so that makes the Loyd a No2 Mk2 1943.

Edited by ajmac

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Managed to get a few hours in on Saturday, jamac gave lots of assistance, undoing what bolts were not beyond hope. There is now a small pile of parts next to the Loyd, mainly the smaller more delicate parts that need to be removed before the chassis can go for repair. I have a quote from a local fabrication shop who have rebuilt a Universal Carrier and work on historic buses, so they have plenty of experience.

 

We removed:

Both steering cantilevers and linkages.

Left hand tiller and linkages.

Hand brake and linkages.

Clutch pedal and linkages.

Seat frame.

Accelerator linkages.

Rear axle hub covers.

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hi alastair

 

good to see the restoration has started in earnest, what was the condition of the linkages and other components you took off were they shot or did you get lucky, i don't know about you but i've a feeling on my carrier it's gonna be the little fiddly things that take most time but it'll be worth it in the end.

 

all the best

 

eddy

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A couple of photos, I took lots, but this Netbook doesn't have PSP on it at the moment so I have to upload the full image, they are too large really.

 

Stripped down hand brake lever & the right hand steering swing lever.

Note the original paint, there seems to be a lighter green over the top in places (not in any of the photos below), so I presume that is post war Belgian Army colours.

 

Over the coming week I'll strip down all the parts I recovered and send them to be paint stripped and acid dipped, they can then be painted and boxed up in the workshop. When I get the hand brake back from cleaning I'll make a new Pawl rod as the original is virtually rotted through. Making a replacement hand brake release handle should be interesting! The quadrant has a thumb sized impact, but I am leaving as much of that as possible as it is part of the vehicles history.

RHSteeringUpper.jpg

HandBrake_stripped.jpg

Edited by ajmac

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Hi Alistair,

I have just found that I have a workshop manual for a Loyd. Did you get one or would you be interested in a photocopy?

Cheers

John Pearson

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Hi Alastair ,

just wondering if you know what a complete Loyd carrier weighs ? I have been trying to drag one home over here in oz and need a rough idea of weight for the tilt tray operator .

 

cheers James

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rough idea of weight

The chassis with engine and box is over 1.2 tonnes as we hit a weight limit when off loading with the forks. I would say, with tracks and upper hull 3.5 tonnes should cover it... however if you have a TPC you could have a lot of armour plate added which could put you past the 4 tonne mark.

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A universal carrier is only a little over 3.5 tons if memory serves correct. A loyd is going to be much lighter than this, as it has no armour plate and the panel work is just that, panel steel. Not every TPC had armour fitted, and when they were, it was only really a token amount.

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Wartime manuals quote over 4 tonnes, but I presume this is Gross rather than Net. It's true that the TPC only has a token amount or armour, but that is still twice the amount the TT had. I am hoping that without the BP plates added I may just be able to tow her on a 3.5 tonne trailer. We will only really know when I get it to a weigh bridge. If a whisper turns into truth and I have a little luck I may have a third Loyd to take measurments from, just a few miles from my house locked away in a barn for decades.... will have to see.... this one is 95% complete and in British army demob condition.

Edited by ajmac

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Most references are for 4tons (imp) so possibly down to 3.5 without kit, but at least one photo shows a 5ton bridging class- possibly it had add on armour.

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Not trying to pour cold water on your efforts but remember the 3.5t is the gross weight including trailer and I am fairly sure that is the maximum allowed with overrun brakes, it certainly used to be the case. A few 4X4's can tow up to 4 tonnes but I think this would involve fitting a compressor to use air braking on the trailer. Many years ago we fitted a compressor to a 109 1 ton Land Rover for just this purpose.

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Not trying to pour cold water on your efforts

I'm sure it wouldn't be possible, just wishfull thinking.

 

PS. That whisper has turned into reality, going to see the Loyd later in the week! The farmer said it was converted to a Diesel after the war and modified for pulling a plough, however it hasn't had an engine in it for years now and is blocked in at the back of one the sheds on his farm. I thought 'Barn Finds' were something of myth and legend :-)

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PS. That whisper has turned into reality, going to see the Loyd later in the week!

 

good luck with that and don't forget the camera

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nice one alastair it would be great if you could get hold of a nearly complete loyd that would help you no end with the resto.

 

good luck

 

eddy

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Went to see the other Loyd this evening, there is no chance of a sale as the owner is a collector of farm vehicles and had dozens of tractors, old trucks, engines, just about anything! The Loyd was in a building with a roof, which was good, but some of the roof had come in on the front of it covering the axle. The data plate said it was a No1Mk2 TPC and one of the bogies said 1941, it also had road wheels with circular holes, which I think means it was built by Wolsley, but I'm not sure. I'll post a photo tomorrow.

Edited by ajmac

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ajmac

.... there is no chance of a sale as the owner is a collector of farm vehicles

 

Oh well at least it has a good home and it will help to have a complete one fairly close by.

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For obvious reasons I'll keep the location quite, but here are two photos showing the wheels and interior. It wasn't as good as described as the rear of the chassis had been cut up and a x-member removed to fit a diesel motor. The dash and fuel tanks were also missing although it did have most of the armour, except for the main front plate. War Dept number on the data plate stated: CT65563 Which is interesting as I didn't think the Canadians used Loyds. The owner was a very nice gent, he offered time to take measurments and said he was planning to pull it out and around the yard at sometime to keep the tracks free.

 

As I said before it looked like an early example, 1941 was cast into one of the suspension arms and a brake drum, it's a TPC which was an early model although those type of tillers don't arrive in the parts book until 1942. When I come to re-manufacture the hull for mine I am going to try and come to an arrangement whereby I can borrow the Loyd for a period in order to remove the body parts to use as patterns. It will probably be a none starter but I can but ask!

DSCN0098.jpg

DSCN0080.jpg

Edited by ajmac

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Very nice AJ!

 

Did you happen to come across any dates on the wheels? It seems they are of the type introduced very late in the war. A few years ago a Loyd in France turned up with the same type of wheels. Although you do come across these wheels on Universal carriers in period photo's...all of them are late 1944 or 1945, if I remember correctly.

 

Alex

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Alex,

It had 1941 cast into one of the suspension arms and only had the rear body support brackets, front ones were not fitted and had never been, that makes it an early vehicle in my book. The data plate was simple brass affair with machine stamped headings on the left and hand stamped details on the right, including War Dept No, Engine No and carrier type but Contract No and Vehicle No were left blank for some reason.

 

Any info welcome, there isn't much about Loyds around.

Edited by ajmac

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Alastair, I wasn't questioning your conclusion that is an early loyd, it's just the wheels I was talking about. I have only seen them on late war pictures, so I presume this Loyd was fitted with a different set of wheels late in the war or maybe even post-war......or maybe my conclusion was a bit premature and someone does turn up with a 1941 pic showing this type of wheel:D

 

Alex

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