N.O.S. Posted September 27, 2010 Share Posted September 27, 2010 You'd have thought the crane driver would have dunked it in the river a few times to clean it up........:cool2: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abn deuce Posted September 28, 2010 Share Posted September 28, 2010 That was some reaching ! I m sure it was all with in that cranes limits but looked like it wasn't possible to lift that much weight from that distance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rog8811 Posted September 28, 2010 Share Posted September 28, 2010 If you watch the second part of the rescue there seems to be a lot of waving about of suspended 360 excavator going on. A very impressive rescue all the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbrtcrowther Posted September 28, 2010 Share Posted September 28, 2010 they also cut through the hydraulic pipes on the dipper arm to get it on the lorry:nut: Like nobody had a spanner:-( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cosrec Posted September 29, 2010 Share Posted September 29, 2010 using the axles is not a good idea! once down on the slab, some know it all serge (names withheld to protect the innocent) got the landie bogged in, so he promptly started to recover it from the axles, he was told that's not a good idea, by me and some others, (but as i was only a lance jack at the time,and the others private's) we were told to shut up, "im a sergent" so he continued, the rover bogged in and then the funny noises started to be heard until, "bang" one bent and damaged axle! it gave way on one side and pulled it off! :blush: lesson learnt, and one red faced sergent with a slightly lighter wallet! strong chassis fixings are the only point! Curious you want piont these out for me plus how you fasten to them. I work mainly on civvy landrovers so perhaps there is some strong pionts i dont know about on MOD landrovers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grumpy Posted September 29, 2010 Share Posted September 29, 2010 Curious you want piont these out for me plus how you fasten to them. I work mainly on civvy landrovers so perhaps there is some strong pionts i dont know about on MOD landrovers Bridle on the Jate Rings Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cosrec Posted September 29, 2010 Share Posted September 29, 2010 These jate rings standard on MOD vehicles Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
recymech66 Posted September 29, 2010 Share Posted September 29, 2010 These jate rings standard on MOD vehicles Standard on Military Land Rovers mate, older MV's like Bedfords etc it's always best to form an apex using strops or chains reeved around the spring hangers, very strong. Quite a few vehicles have recovery eyes (Defence Standard) which are connected/welded to the chassis, these are obvious recovery attachment points and are extremely strong. We are never taught to go around axles as most MV's have driven front axles and the casings (which the half shafts go through) could easily deform, and cause irrepairable damage. Army recovery mechanics employ some different techniques to civilian recovery operators due to the nature of the vehicles, however most recovery techniques can be used for both civilian and military. We could learn a lot about roadside recovery from the civilian operators, especially side over sides, or rollovers in civi speak.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grumpy Posted September 29, 2010 Share Posted September 29, 2010 We could learn a lot about roadside recovery from the civilian operators, especially side over sides, or rollovers in civi speak.. You mean not just yanking it back over and onto its wheels then :blush: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
recymech66 Posted September 30, 2010 Share Posted September 30, 2010 You mean not just yanking it back over and onto its wheels then :blush: Ooooo that's a cutting remark, we're not all bad you know:cool2: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cosrec Posted October 1, 2010 Share Posted October 1, 2010 using the axles is not a good idea! once down on the slab, some know it all serge (names withheld to protect the innocent) got the landie bogged in, so he promptly started to recover it from the axles, he was told that's not a good idea, by me and some others, (but as i was only a lance jack at the time,and the others private's) we were told to shut up, "im a sergent" so he continued, the rover bogged in and then the funny noises started to be heard until, "bang" one bent and damaged axle! it gave way on one side and pulled it off! :blush: lesson learnt, and one red faced sergent with a slightly lighter wallet! strong chassis fixings are the only point! Something dont ring true with this will put a post on to say about stong fixing pionts but would suggest it was rigged to one side or something was snagged somewhere sure it was fastened to axle not just say one spring hanger Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cosrec Posted October 1, 2010 Share Posted October 1, 2010 Agreed - imagine dragging a bogged FH70 by the axles :nut: Snap! Beg to differ on that and will put some pictures on to prove. Be about a week though going on Hols tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cosrec Posted October 1, 2010 Share Posted October 1, 2010 [ATTACH=CONFIG]35542[/ATTACH] Bit complicated but above is my take on stresses in different parts of system when winching a bogged down LR have guessed wieght at 3000kg and pull required to move it at same. Where figures say *2 i am assuming loads are being shared either side of chassis. Suprising how same load in causes different stresses in diffent places. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N.O.S. Posted October 1, 2010 Share Posted October 1, 2010 Well now I'm not sure about that, Cosrec - here's my take on it. Note by pulling on front axle you must be pulling not only force due to weight of vehicle but also force needed to overcome resistance of bogged vehicle - so certainly more than 3,000kg? Mind you I've been wrong before :blush: Anyway have a great holiday and thanks again for a very informative and useful thread :thumbsup: Keep it coming! [ATTACH=CONFIG]35545[/ATTACH] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N.O.S. Posted October 1, 2010 Share Posted October 1, 2010 Oh crickey that's wrong too isn't it? The 3,000kg is shared between 2 hangars (gvenerally only one spring hanger anchors the spring, other one allows spring end to float especially on bigger vehicles) , so that is only 1500kg each spring hanger plus bogged effect :blush::blush::blush::blush: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N.O.S. Posted October 1, 2010 Share Posted October 1, 2010 No No No - you had it right all along, you've just labelled it up wrong Your middle pic shows the 1500kg on each front hanger but that should be pulling on the axle, not chassis. The lower pic should show the pull on chassis same effect as top pic? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N.O.S. Posted October 1, 2010 Share Posted October 1, 2010 Hmmm that isn't right either - the middle one is labelled right as you have shown it being pulled by spring hangers. But the lower one I still think should be same as middle, as forces must still be transmitted through hangers? :nut: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cosrec Posted October 1, 2010 Share Posted October 1, 2010 (edited) Hmmm that isn't right either - the middle one is labelled right as you have shown it being pulled by spring hangers. But the lower one I still think should be same as middle, as forces must still be transmitted through hangers? :nut: the force required is same on all three examplesWhen you pull directly on axle you over come all forces that axle is causing then you only worry about the forces the next axle is causing in this case 1500kg what i tried to piont out with drawing is as long as the axle can handle the strain you are imposing no more on mounting pionts than you would if using towing eyes certainly less than just using front hangers. Only difference in forces between two is direction Edited October 1, 2010 by cosrec Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N.O.S. Posted October 1, 2010 Share Posted October 1, 2010 Good job I didn't get into recovery work!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cosrec Posted October 1, 2010 Share Posted October 1, 2010 [ATTACH=CONFIG]35546[/ATTACH] Hi i have some questions to ask not having any milatry background . Before replying to any questions i looked at a lot of pictures on this site looking at different towing eyes. This picture posed a few problems to me the lower nato type hitch looks like an after thought i wouldnt have thought the manufactuers would have compromised its hill climbing ability by sticking this here ??? Lower down are two more rings with shackles attached these look like lashing eyes to me .??? Higher up is another towing eye this dont look like its standard to me ?? Either side of this towing eye are two welded on lugs is this were you are supposed to hang to ??? One more nothing to do with recovery what colour is it sprayed ?? i think it it will be ideal for my leyland drop project it looks much yellower than usual or is it the light Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amphibi boy Posted October 3, 2010 Share Posted October 3, 2010 Cosrec, the story of the land rover recovery by the axle, (i am delving deep into my head archive, it was a loooong time ago when i was a b3 reccy mec) anyway if i remember the sergent bent the axle casing and one side link arm bracket broke, as i remember the axle was on the p**s, i.e after, the wheelbase on one side was longer than the other! we were always told not to use jate rings for recovery? only for lashing down, i think because 1, thats what they are designed for, 2, how much load will the bolt take? the photo of the sand colour stolly, the attatchment on the lower hull, is not standard military (at least its not in any of the manuals, and never seen it in any official photo's) the 2 little eye's are for suspended recovery, the tow jaw in middle is standard fittment. and the two eyes at lower of front hull, are lashing eye's (should be 8, welded on the hull) and the 2 front also for towing/recovery, and the cables are stowed up along the cab. hope you had a good holiday. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Farrant Posted October 3, 2010 Share Posted October 3, 2010 Re. the Stalwart with extra towing attachment on the front. There was once, one like this in use by a certain MV dealer, used for shunting tanks and other large vehicles. Maybe this is the same vehicle. Definitely a post-demob fitment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
recymech66 Posted October 7, 2010 Share Posted October 7, 2010 Cosrec,the story of the land rover recovery by the axle, (i am delving deep into my head archive, it was a loooong time ago when i was a b3 reccy mec) anyway if i remember the sergent bent the axle casing and one side link arm bracket broke, as i remember the axle was on the p**s, i.e after, the wheelbase on one side was longer than the other! we were always told not to use jate rings for recovery? only for lashing down, i think because 1, thats what they are designed for, 2, how much load will the bolt take? the photo of the sand colour stolly, the attatchment on the lower hull, is not standard military (at least its not in any of the manuals, and never seen it in any official photo's) the 2 little eye's are for suspended recovery, the tow jaw in middle is standard fittment. and the two eyes at lower of front hull, are lashing eye's (should be 8, welded on the hull) and the 2 front also for towing/recovery, and the cables are stowed up along the cab. hope you had a good holiday. My bold, so were would you attach your recovery tackle on 90/110 Defender? (and all Land Rover variants since) there is no other suitable recovery points, jate rings are the way forward, always have been for both suspend tow and winching, they are extremely strong and will only deform/elongate the holes when doing something you shouldn't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stormin Posted October 7, 2010 Share Posted October 7, 2010 I think some clarification is required on the difference between the Jate Ring and the lashing / tie down eye, which both affix to the same points on the chassis. Jate ring [ATTACH=CONFIG]35764[/ATTACH] Lashing eye [ATTACH=CONFIG]35765[/ATTACH] The Jate rings should be used in a pair and fixed to the chassis using M12 Grade 8.8(min) bolts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony B Posted October 7, 2010 Author Share Posted October 7, 2010 Try a Disscovery owner pulling another stuck vehicle. Rope went from lashing eye, up around spare wheel carrier on back door, then to stuck vehicle. Apparently the glass popped clean oout unbrocken. Luclly there was a spare door at the yard. :-D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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