1915 'J' Type Thornycroft up and running.

[Tomo.T]

Without wishing to steal any thunder from the excellent Gosling restoration. I can reveal that John Marshall's 1915 'J' type Thornycroft 2282 is now running and driving, and appeared at the recent Armed Forces Day event at Scarborough yesterday. The M4 engine is a composite of two originals and the restoration includes various parts that have been acquired by John over several years, or made from scratch as required.

 

The engine starts and runs very nicely which is going to be useful as the lorry has been tasked with an important mission in Ypres in September this year. A new peal of bells has been cast by John Taylor & Co. of Loughborough for the St. Georges Chapel, Ypres and it is hoped to deliver the bells in style on the back of the Thornycroft.

 

St. Georges Chapel was built at the end of the Great War as a memorial to the many troops killed in the area. It has full Church of England status but has never had a peal of bells until now. It is anticipated that these bells will be in place and rung to mark the centenary next year.

Edited June 26, 2017 by Tomo.T

[john1950]

What a great looking truck. Good luck with the delivery.

[nz2]

Good to see another J up and running. Just a small point for John regards dating; I have 2282 as built 1915 with delivery 31-3-15 to WD and on to Hornsey Brick Co. I take it was allocated to the Brick Company for the supply of materials for the war effort.

The question here becomes were such lorries repainted out of military green, and or were the new operators permitted to label (sign write) to show their use.

Having the flat deck on this restored vehicle would follow the home use form.

Well done John.

In time another J will emerge from our yard!

Doug

[Tomo.T]

Hi Doug, John has an earlier build date but the same date of issue. The brick company had the lorry post war ( ex military )and it was built with a standard G.S. body which will be reinstated at some point.

 

Tomo

[Old Bill]

Nice to see it running!

 

Steve :drive:

[Tomo.T]

Nice to see it running!

 

Steve :drive:

 

 

John has it ticking over like a clock ! I'm sorry I didn't get a video :-(

 

Tomo

[Redherring]

How many J's are restored/under restoration?

[Tomo.T]

Doug is quite right, the lorry was ordered in 1914 but not delivered until March 1915. Therefore, for 1914 please read 1915 throughout. My mistake, apologies. Tomo.

[goanna]

I have the book that describes the Thornycroft history, building naval vessels and steam lorries. Thornycroft were leaders in marine propulsion technology 100 years ago.

[Tomo.T]

Thornycroft Automotive were based at Basingstoke. The Marine division was a separate company later becoming Vosper Thornycroft.

[goanna]

So Thornycroft trucks were built by a company that had no association with the Thornycroft company building naval vessels .

[goanna]

So Thornycroft trucks were built by a company that had no association with the Thornycroft company that were building naval vessels ? The book I have , published in the 1950's , details the history of the Thornycroft business, it includes chapters on both the land vehicles and the marine vessels . I am confused

[Tomo.T]

I've had a brilliant idea. Why don't you read the book?

[Richard Farrant]

So Thornycroft trucks were built by a company that had no association with the Thornycroft company that were building naval vessels ? The book I have , published in the 1950's , details the history of the Thornycroft business, it includes chapters on both the land vehicles and the marine vessels . I am confused

 

Mike,

In 1904 the vehicle side of Thornycroft was split up from the shipbuilding side in to two different companies. In 1961 the truck business passed to ACV (Associated Commercial Vehicles), of which AEC was a part of, it had been renamed Transport Equipment (Thornycroft) Ltd. Later it was part of British Leyland, but this was when the vehicle designs such as Nubian, passed to Scammell.

 

This will explain the timeline easier; http://www.gracesguide.co.uk/Thornycroft

Edited June 26, 2017 by Richard Farrant

[nz2]

The Thornycroft family controlled or led both companies.

[nz2]

Doug is quite right, the lorry was ordered in 1914 but not delivered until March 1915. Therefore, for 1914 please read 1915 throughout. My mistake, apologies. Tomo.

 

It is interesting to read through the production records of the period pre 1920's. They can become confusing as the chassis types were built in batches using allocated numbers, then other chassis types fit in the gaps. Engine number sequence is even worse to follow as the same engine type can be used over different chassis types. Some engine numbers do not appear at all, and I assume those never got into vehicles. As the register is for vehicles, if engines went out for boats or other applications they would have been listed in a separate register.

 

There is a column in the production register that appears to relate to model plans and variations of design, but as there is no supporting bookwork known trying to reconstruct the column entries is challenging. This is even more so with so few examples of vehicles and parts to work from pre 1914.

 

Also of interest is the variable time frame between ordering and delivery. Some show a gap of only weeks while other orders took many many months before a delivery date. I wonder if this was involved with financing arrangements of sales. That becomes another question for did Thornycroft operate their own finance for it is a point I have not seen any information on.

Doug

[goanna]

The Thornycroft family controlled or led both companies.

 

OK got it now.

 

The book is more of a public relations exercise than a history text - the land vehicle side of things is barely mentioned . The marine designing and vessel building is detailed and various vessels described , gun boats , destroyers , faster , faster more speed.

 

If a Thornycroft owner wants the book, it cost me 50 cents but I will have to find it , it's here somewhere

[Great War truck]

That's looking nice. Great to have another restored WD Thorny. With ours that will make four?

[Tomo.T]

Wow ! Only four, out of 5,000 built? Any more in Oz / NZ ?

[Great War truck]

That is WD Thorny. With civilian ones that takes us up to about 15 in this country.

[Tomo.T]

That's interesting Tim, of the additional civilian ones how many were original WD lorries ?

 

Tomo

[Tomo.T]

Probably fairly safe to assume that most of the survivors were originally built for, or were commandeered by, the War Dept. There was a roaring trade in the sale of Ex Military lorries after the War and many businesses were founded this way by Army trained drivers looking to employ their new found skills.

[Great War truck]

At least four are post war.

[nz2]

And prewar numbers of Thornycroft's is another challenge again.

[Tomo.T]

Just a reminder that both Thornycroft 2282 and John Arthur's Dennis subsidy will be on display with the new peal of bells for St Georges Ypres, at the Great Dorset Steam Fair. South Down, Tarrant Hinton, Blandford Forum, Dorset, between Thurs. 24th and Mon 28th Aug. 2017.

 

They will be found in the WW1 area together with many other 1st war vehicles, horses and a manned trench system.

 

Immediately following the steam fair both Thornycroft and Dennis will be transported to Belgium to deliver the bells to their new home.

 

More info here; http://www.stgeorgesmemorialchurchypres.com/latest-updates/latest-news-on-the-bells-for-st-george/