question Mystery prop shaft

[fv1609]

This is not a quiz! I am trying to find the identity of a prop shaft that can be used as a replacement for the Humber 1-Ton.

 

Some years ago I removed the prop shaft on the left from a Mk2 Pig that had come direct from service in NI.

 

 

The one on the right is a genuine Humber item. It has no NSN as the parts lists pre-date NATO codification. My 1952 list gives the VAOS as LV7/HP FV17550. The 1960 parts list now gives it as LV7/HP/51-019 FV17550.

 

Contrary to what one would expect it is not prefixed LV9/BOE which is exclusively for Humber 1-Ton. It is prefixed LV7 which is for a non-standardised British vehicle. But what does HP mean within this section?

 

Well in VAOS Section LV6/MT1 - LV6/MT15, HP is allocated to Hardy Spicer. It seems extremely likely that this prop shaft was indeed made by Hardy Spicer. However no HP code appears in any LV7 list I have seen, nor should it appear as that section is for manufacturers of vehicles, not components.

 

As this is not an exclusive Humber 1-Ton item (ie it is not LV9/BOE), I wonder what other vehicle it was used in? Furthermore I think the item has been wrongly codified & should be in LV6/MT10.

 

LV6/MT10 is the VAOS Section for proprietary vehicular power transmission components, which seems much more appropriate particularly now that the HP code is for use within this Section.

 

This brings me onto the identity of the prop shaft on the left.

 

 

This is NATO codified as 2520-99-794-8119 & prefixed by the DMC of 6MT10 (a contraction of the former VAOS Section LV6/MT10)

 

So it does look as if it is in the correct section of 6MT10, so it must be used in some other vehicle(s). But does anybody recognise it? Doing a cross check on the NSN brings up the part number 05/806316 of our old friends Hardy Spicer! There is also a part number 05/806316 for Marconi, which rather surprised me.

 

So this long waffle throws up three questions.

 

1. Out of curiosity I wonder what other vehicle also used the Humber 1-Ton prop shaft?

2. What other vehicle(s) used the larger prop shaft, which could be used as a replacement if the Humber ones pack up?

3. Does anyone agree that the VAOS was wrong in allocating the Humber prop shaft as LV7/HP when it should have been LV6/MT10/HP?

[Richard Farrant]

 

 

3. Does anyone agree that the VAOS was wrong in allocating the Humber prop shaft as LV7/HP when it should have been LV6/MT10/HP?

 

 

Clive,

 

LV7 was used to list Hardy Spicer components for many vehicles, It might be that the shaft fits something else as well, but with so many varied vehicles in service in the 1950's it would be difficult to find out.........unless you could find a Hardy Spicer catalogue of course.

[fv1609]

Richard, I wonder what dictated whether a non-standardised British vehicular component went in LV7 or LV6/MT10?

 

It must have been something earlier than the Humber 1-Ton as if that was the first, then I imagine it would have slipped into LV9/BOE, as at that stage it would have been exclusive.

 

I peeped in the K9 parts list but nothing. As for the newer prop shaft I have gone through piles of fiche, it is not Saxon, any Bedfords 4 - 8 Tonne & doesn't appear on the fiche stock list of a large depot shall we say. That was rather surprising as I thought it might have been something that was contemporary to Mk2 pig & to hand. I had imagined, with typical REME ingenuity, a fitter had twigged that you could squeeze the fatter one in...& it is a bit of a squeeze getting it through the oblique holes in the cross-chassis struts.

 

PS Its odd that the later one is given the DMC of 6MT10 rather than follow the earlier structure which would have made it 7HP, given that is also an item made by Hardy Spicer.

Edited October 16, 2009 by fv1609

[Richard Farrant]

Richard, I wonder what dictated whether a non-standardised British vehicular component went in LV7 or LV6/MT10?

 

I had imagined, with typical REME ingenuity, a fitter had twigged that you could squeeze the fatter one in...& it is a bit of a squeeze getting it through the oblique holes in the cross-chassis struts.

 

PS Its odd that the later one is given the DMC of 6MT10 rather than follow the earlier structure which would have made it 7HP, given that is also an item made by Hardy Spicer.

 

Clive,

 

After replying last night I checked a few parts books of the 50's era, and would think that driveshafts other than those listed under the vehicle makers code, ie LV9/BOE, LV7/BD, etc., several came under LV7. As LV7 list not only included Eaton transmissions, engine manufacturers, etc, I conclude that they initially thought it should show driveshafts and components. As an example, The Commer Q4 4x4 parts list show two types of drive shaft fitted, one is the old Layrub coupling type, with parts prefix of LV7/LEG (Laycock Engineering), and the normal u/j type as LV7/HP (Hardy Spicer). I think the change to 6MT10 might have come in early 60's.

 

The larger shaft you have with a NSN might well have been a modification introduced when the heavier Mk2 Pig was in use in NI, and unless you have an updated parts list, it will not be shown. Or it could be that stocks had run out of the original type and new shafts procured of a larger tube size, thus making it another part number as design had changed.

[fv1609]

Richard, it's odd that that is the only large prop shaft I've seen fitted. Unless of course our readers know differently!

 

I have had the privilege of looking quite a lot of pigs, but not nearly enough! Clearly only a small fraction of the total.

 

Although there are EMERs that introduce new components they are, as you well know, only EMERs because something has to be modified to accommodate the change.

 

So there must have been, as you suggest, a substitution. Although in the IPLs I've seen, I have never seen an amendment for the prop shaft. But I expect it was just a single sheet of paper lost in the mists of time.

 

But it would be nice to pin down what this prop shaft was also used in, so that in future years when we're dead & gone, the new owners will find my list of Humber equivalents to keep them running. Sobering really that our vehicles will last longer than most of us!

[Marmite!!]

Nothing to do with the Pig but here's an old Hardy Spicer poster..

[fv1609]

Yes they seem to get everywhere, good old Brum. Although I was surprised that some of the Humber hub bearings were made in Espania.