nz2

This is a period where Leylands and Crossley were losing their dominance as vehicle suppliers to the RAF, and also the introduction of the 6x4 vehicles. Doug

During the British mandate of Mesopotamia of the 1920's to early 30's, the RAF held a strong presence and control with its air power. In support of the operations would be the air field ground support crews, but I have located very few photos of support vehicles. I take it that Leyland were still the preferred supplier of RAF tenders following on from The Great War practice. It would be interesting to know of the vehicle types and models used, along with the special type applications needed for air field and aircraft servicing of the time. Also seeking information on the paint colours used and vehicle signage, as there could be a carry over from the Egyptian occupation. The Leylands of the time had some similarities to the earlier Great War models, but civilian models had progressed on in design. Did the RAF use new models or the earlier types? And to those questioning why; there is a suitable chassis and parts here for such a restoration make over. Another centenary product! Doug

On the other hand we do have people like Ben and the Gosling's who build parts to original specifications. In my own situation it is a matter of what parts are available to use, the facilities I have to construct some parts, or the funding to otherwise pay to have these parts built. Each of us will have a different set of criteria to work from to produce an operational vehicle. Doug

I know I said parts should fit correctly. It still is the situation where modification has to occur as the newer part is the now produced part and the older version is no longer available. Different mounts and linkages abound. The other option is a line of the vehicles history, where modification and changes have occurred to keep the vehicle going particularly is used away from a city and a regular supply of parts. The local blacksmith and garage would have kept the vehicle operational. In the same line during the early days of The Great War, there was a problem with the rear axle housing on Thornycroft trucks in France. The army engineers in France cast their own version, which was later accepted by Thornycroft and became the standard part. Doug

Is the situation any different to vehicles of todays era. Part number XXXX is now superseded by part no YYYY. It fits straight on, does the job asked of it and is a genuine product for that vehicle. Doug

The steam roller has strakes in place on the rear roll that is visible, giving additional grip for driving out. The site is on a hill when comparing the angle on the house foundations, steps and the slope of the footpath. I would assume the roller has traveled backwards out of gear to end up against the house. The hole in which the front roll is court up in could be a of water main. Some rollers had a winch built into the rear axle, however I'm uncertain how common this was with American products The steam shovel looks to be a Marion. The driver certainly was game to drive the machine on the timber ramps. One length of timber appears to be broken and the cause of the fall. Doug

Andrew, Does the tyre steel band have a beveled shape to it? Also what are the tyre sizes you are working with. We have acquired recently a set of as new solid rubber tyres. Dunlop 670 x 140 with a rounded profile to the road face, more in keeping to a military style. These will fit on the wheels to the front of my Thornycroft. Doug

Dans use of identifying parts recently made, does have its merits. Reading through the Turin Charter on the restoration of vintage vehicles, the point is made as to being able to distinguish between original and replacement parts. Much of the context however is referring to vehicles of known provenience, where retaining it in a state of originality is the objective. Further to that becomes vehicles that were changed during their life, whether a re-body took place, as happened with many up market cars, or in the like of commercial vehicles the body style changes with use. Whether it be a flat deck, tanker or bus, early trucks were adaptable. So Ben's formate of identifying parts produced follows an accepted pattern. To those restoring a Model T so many parts are available off the shelf, how these are identified as, I do not know as I have not rebuilt one. In our own situations, I'm trying to rebuild the Leylands and Thornycrofts using the spares accumulated, however new parts will be stamped identifying them. A further problem here arises with the issue of replacement parts that themselves are many decades old and are local copies of parts. We have here some radiator castings that have no Leyland marking on them, and are just different enough in pattern to indicate a different maker. Also made from cast iron rather alloy. Probably made in the 1930's. The Turin Charter is a interesting topic to read, however not all will agree to the principles involved. Doug

Welcome to a fellow Kiwi

I stand corrected. It is AEC. The latter photos show the same cross member and that characteristic double curve to the radiator top. A further search from that link to the AEC Society also shows that same blunt dumb irons. I did not see the red truck with these blunt dumb irons, as I be came engrossed with the earlier models shown. The image of the factory painted grey vehicle shows clearly so much detail. From the photos otherwise supplied by members, have those vehicles been restored or in an awaiting stage. Doug

I can not agree to it being an AEC. The tubular cross section for AEC is too high up the dumb irons and the dumb irons themselves are curved. Those on the original question are squared off dumb irons with that cross member well down. likewise I consider that engine to be a 6 cylinder, by comparing the stud position in relation to the plugs. There remains a space towards the firewall end of the engine after counting 4 plugs. Lets get a few more photos to assist with the Id. Doug

Can you post any more photos of this truck? Looking at the back ground it would appear to be in Australia, with a Ford falcon ute of the early 70's there. As for the truck chassis, this appears to be a 6 cylinder engine so probably American unless it was a fire engine chassis from Britain. The tubular front cross member low down on the spring hangers make it be an identifiable feature. However at this point I have no makers name. Doug

Correction The wording should have been "reply with quote" Then the message gets transferred to a new date. Just like I have done now.

Welcome. What are makes of the WW1 trucks you are interested in? There are a only a few of us rebuilding such trucks down under. Doug

Please do not put a like button into the system. Under the present arrangement postings remain in order of date, with other groups a like posting then shuffles an older posting to the top and out of time sequence. Currently following through the story line of a vehicles restoration is straight forward, it follows a set order of time. ( unless someone has commented on an earlier point and included a section of the post in their reply) This Forum is a research tool to provides information and has a good search option. Other forums tend to lack that search facility and as for the ability to go back and look for a particular subject, is near impossible. However in saying all this, some one as a computer programmer could well design a way around these points. Doug

In fact it is a recipe for disaster and these radiators only last about seventy years! Steve Should that be 95 years plus? Or is that after seventy years they start to leak Doug

From your description, as it like this? There also is another similar Triangle Logo including an A to the Right hand side. That company name includes the word Axle. I understand its the same company as Detroit Timken, at a different time period.

And they say interesting finds can be only found in the colonies!

Well done Rick in restoring the Albion and allowing it to survive through to see it's own centenary. The choice of the date 29th February is interesting. being a leap year. A Google search notes 1916 was also a leap year, so the truck has had only 25 birthdays ( if it was delivered on 29th and again Google tells me it was a Tuesday). Latter this year we plan to have a celebration for the 1916 Leyland truck. First option is to get it mobile for an event, then complete the body work latter. We have no exact date when it left the factory although the chassis number does match an order allocated for the War Dept. It was then most probably allocated to the Royal Flying Corps. Other vehicles here have passed by their centenary, their day of celebration can wait to they are restored. well done Rick

The press story of a secret room only adds to their highlights of the story. I know of serious collectors who have their collection securely stored away, in a room with a concealed entrance. That is part of their security to protect their collection. Is it any different to some one having a secure room to store a collection of art, or stamps or some other valuable antique.

Can anyone identify origin of the wheels in these photos. The chap I got them off knew nothing of the background. About the face of the tyre appears a darker strip as if it has been in contact with a section of track like from a tank or similar vehicle. These are the right size ( 670 mm) to press on to my early Thornycroft front wheels. Doug

It is disturbing to read of the number of British museums closing or reducing services (http://www.theguardian.com/culture/2016/jan/13/one-in-five-regional-museums-at-least-part-closed-in-2) And it is happening all over the globe. A conflict between funders (Councils and Govt), local politics, and the senior museum staff being accountants and managers. Those on the museum floor handling the items appear to get little say. Reading that sentence again makes me think of the downfall of many great British engineering companies. Similar lines. Doug

Interesting to read the name on the manufacturers plate, that of the Kissel Car Co. The automobile production was from the Kissel Kar Co., the second K being changed to a C during the period of WW1. Also at this time the radiator badge was change deleting the word Kar, and then showing only the name Kissel. These cars were an expensive up market line with a limited market, but were offset with a strong manufacturing presence of light commercial vehicles. My interest in Kissel Kars is based on having parts for a 1914 model that was sent to NZ and set up as a fire engine. ( this is not the 4X4 type) To those with FWD trucks of the time I would be interested to know of the engine type installed. Are there stamped numbers on the engine mounts? While the cars appear to be all in house built, the war time contracts appear if Kissel assembled components brought in. It is unclear if some of the commercial vehicles used proprietary engines, therefore my query. A couple of photos of production from Kissel. Doug

You are not the only one with this problem in trying to store larger vehicles. Aside from have another set of smaller diameter wheels to soley move the vehicle into a low building, I have looked over the idea of altering the spring mounts to enable the chassis to be lowered on to the axle. What ever way it still requires some time in undoing bolts, moving hangers etc, then a re-assembly. Otherwise a re-design to the top of the framing over the door. Doug

The position of lights on Thornycroft's appears to vary with the times. Aside from those with no lights at all, various photos show others with lights on the scuttle, and as you illustrated, mounted beside the radiator. There appears to be a series of different mounts, ranging from a flat plate bolted in place similar to the mud guard mount. Two positions appear one in a vertical side of the chassis rail, the other on the top of the rail. Another photo shows a u bolt about the chassis dumb irons area. Yet another shows the threaded mount in the area of the radiator protector upright section, sharing a common bolt hole. My 1912-13 chassis has bolt holes on top of the chassis rail, with no holes in the side rails for a radiator protector. The 1920's chassis has holes also on the top of the rails and on the sides. Nothing approaching 1 inch in diameter. Without an accurate dated illustrated parts list of the war era to work from it appears to be the restorers choice.(manuals so far located all are post 1918) Doug