ted angus

There was a binned store on the Bedford but the dims page for this RL body is missing from my manual does anyone know if the Ford E2 and RL shared the same binned stores body please ?? TED

Morning Richard, I remembered late last night I have the user handbook for the Ford E series; The Ambulance "proper" had 2 high level windows each side, the ex binners a single window high level to the rear of each side. Attached is the RL ambulance ; The body detail and innner detail is identical to the Ford E3 version. At about this time the RAF bought the Ford Sussex 6x4 heavy ambulance; a real heap of rubish in fact less capable than the WW2 Fordson WOT1 6x4. TED

there was also the FV 13304 which was an ambulance version utilising Binned Stores Bodies The Bedford RL version was FV 13126 used by the RN. TED

There was a final lowering of the RAF ensign on 31 March 2010, Both remaing units were then moving to Northolt, the Bunker was then to be handed to English Heritage. Officially RAF Uxbridge is history and what an incredible history it is !! TED

Yes all closed but the bunker is now in the hands of English Heritage

My wife served there and later I was a patient a fantastic place TED

The TAF/83 and similar Command/Group codes were to be 5 inches high in white.. the Roundal 9 inches high. The reg number size was not given but seem to vary between 3 and 5 inches. The speed limit was a road safety measure. Accident rates especially in blackout was very high. many of the vehicles especially cars did not have brakes that could match the top speed, by putting it in big letters it let following RAFP, Civillian police and RMP patrols the max. later it was stencilled on the drivers door Max speed and cruising speed to conserve fuel. Richard that car looked great on completion !!! rEGARDS ted

Its one of the Canadian sqns in 83 group I think I scanned that to you to answer a query you posted Richard. the colour would be SCC 2 or SCC 15 I don't think too many cars of this period conformed to the camo rules by having a disruptive colour. If it did it was no doubt SCC14 a near black colour. TED

The RAF Crossley and the company Commer both have their headlights masked; the uncovered light on both are a fog light. The RAF Hillman configuration of one masked was not uncommon. I had access to some old ARP/CD journals and they revealed the blackout relaxation started soon after D Day it was done regionally. Cheshire would have been one of the first areas to be relaxed; It is possible that if the two left hand civvy vejicles were only on local running they may never have had blackout masks ?? TED

WOW what a great shot my Dad was a Commer man from 1940 until he retired in the early 1980s plus RAF vehicles being amongst my pet subjects. Thanks for sharing. I can offer : MAP was unique as it was a Ministry in a Ministry; It was an offshoot of the Air Ministry. The badge is a mystery, is it the MAP badge and the 2 civvy left hand trucks are impressed ?? or is it something the company have applied. The Crossley has TYPE 1000 on the door type 1000 is indeed an artic tractor used with QM trailers. I would also think the Van which is a Hillman is the personal mount of the local AID Aeronautical Inspection Dept Inspector. Every picture of an RAF vehicle allocated to MAP has the MAP stencilled on it, However this was never authorised and it should have simply been the letter Z; But on all the MAP vehicles I have seen Z has never appeared. In addition to all the recognised aircraft factories MAP ran the contracts and oversaw the production in thousands of companies directed to war production. In addition it ran virtually all the storage unitsaerodromes in Maintenance Command 43 Group.. I will dig into the badge. I would suggest the Crossley has had a wipe down with a parrafin rag but compared to the Commers its Matt. If you ever see the same Hillman with or without windows carrying a ladder that would be an aerodrome lighting team's vehicle. TED

been having trouble for nearly a week can't get things to open yet other sites fine.. most things very slow BT my ISP tell me they have an intermittant fault that they are striving to fix !! TED

Yes in 1967 there were a lot of silvery 7Vs and Austin ATVs near Bawtry at a dealers possibly this was Jacksons ??/ I used to pass the place going from Scampton to Finningly once a month on task. . from my research it is now apparent that this was a primer, when the ex WW2 stock was refurbished for long term retention it went into primer. I have noted in the Minute Books of several local authorities circa 1949-54 notes that brigades borrowing depot stock for AFS training could paint appliances into brigade colours - but not apply brigade names- and the notes detail how much cash will be granted to the brigade for materials and labour. From lads who bought GGs from withams I have also now established the the vast majority of 4x4 goddesses were in primer until the mid 1960s; Most of them came with extremely comprehensive paper records . TED

Yes that about sums it up; The WW2 period colours are well documented in TNA Kew and other sources. All appliances supplied from 1938 for the AFS from the HMG emergency fire organisation programe were to BS 32 dark ad grey. This included items to the Armed forces for ARP use. Indeed the trailer pumps at RAF Scampton were still grey very late in the war. At the outbreak of hostilities place names were painted out and some brigades took tone down measures; london was one such brigade and both appliances in the film are LFB. Generally the trend seemed to be if an appliances required a repaint it often went to grey. HO NFS Memo 48 of 1945 dated oct 45 authorised certain appliances earmarked for the peacetime organisation to repainted to red, in 1946 gloss deep bronze green was authorised in lieu of grey for support appliances. CD vehicles were initially in what ever colour they were when impressed by the local authorities; many quickly adopted grey. Subsequent CD vehicles purchased by HMG were in grey but this was later replaced by SCC2 ( with 50% varnish. ), Subsequently aftyer hostilities, CD vehicles earmarked for long term retention also went to Deep Bronze Green. RAf & Army fire tenders followed the relevant instructions on Camo finish once war commenced, certainly all the Armies gleaming Leyland pump escapes were very soon in camo. with the RAF not far behind. TED

No the Barkston collection is an off shoot from the RAF DFS firefighters Ass. they started at Shoreham got the boot moved to halfpenny green got the boot now at Barkston; those at Scampton belong to my friend W.O. Steve Shghirley he owes the bulk of the Manston fire museum collection. He also has a handful at East KIRKBY where he provides fire cover. TED

Somewhere I have a piccy of an AEC bowser with a yellow top . talking to the old boys ( when I was younger !!!) they tended to get the larger vehicles done with the yellow first as the driver had very limited vision. When I find an AEC with a yellow top I will post the pic I have seen several piccies just finding them in my files well they not really files more like dozens of discs that all need soprting !! TED.

Firstly marking MT in UK: MT was to be marked with the parent Command and the Group within that command. 617 was in 5 group which was part of bomber Command hence B/5. colour RAF blue grey and golden yellow were both to BS 381c the blue grey was tint 633, the golden yellow was tint 356. Even during WW2 AMOs required vehicles which were established to work on the active area to have yellow or orange markings. by mid war this was to be golden yellow or orange on upper surfaces, on tractors normally just the bonnet ( examples can be seen in the Film Night Bombers shot in colour by the CO at Hemswell and availible on VHS). on refuellers the cab top was normally the only part yellow although I have seen WW2 photos of AEC bowsers with overall yellow tops. However it must be said many COs ignored the rule and kept vehicles totally camo. . post war the yellow tops were still required and became more common. The vast majority of David Browns had a multi position tow pintle with pin,. many were winch equipped to be used during recovery of aircraft that had crash landed off runway. Air Ministry works dept or contractors cut the grass using agricultural tractors. Attached ; one towing bombs at Hemswell winter 43/44, the other adjacent to the Comet is post war. The big triangle on the front of the WW2 example and a small triangle mounted on the yellow plate on the rear mudguard had a red light at each corner of the triangle it was to tell other vehicles that it was towing. TED

I will add to your rant; if it really has to be 617 Sqn the marking for 617 should be B/5 B Bomber Command 5 for 5 Group of which 617 were part. Sqn numbers were not permitted in the UK. A bit like the "dressing up brigade" who all wear medals they are not entitled to wear and all want to be commisioned officers !! end of my rant TED

Its a 44 pattern helmet of course they remained in production for several years, the liner appears to be of the original pattern but not sure of the chin strap. The first helmet I was issued with in Cyprus (1970 RAF ) was a tommy style, in 1974 I got my first 44 pattern, its liner was identical to yours, with the same chinstrap. . My helmet was replaced by another 44 pattern in Germany in 1979 this one had a later style of liner.

Golden yellow BS 381c tint 356 TED

Send me a PM and I will explian TED

Thanks Clive I found a site selling colour chip fans containing several BSs for paint. Unfortunately the price is beyond me, But I managed to download the BS 381 c component; It appears to contain every colour from 1948 to date ? obviously the colours are not true in the download but it will make a welcome addition to my files PM your e address and I will forward . I dare not put it on here for obvious reasons regards TED

Ah but not in this detail !! TED

can't help with DBG to OD, as RAF B/G was our standard pre IRR for MT and traffic blue BSC 169 for Ground support equipment. What I can tell you RAF Regt were still in standard colours pre IRR I don't recall an interim non IRR green /drab. Off the top of my head most of those additions in 1964 were colours continueing in HM armed forces use that had peviosly been in the AM later MAP later AM/MoS standard this includes 109, 111, 210 450 and all the 600s in your list. 641 being wrongly grouped for many years until renumbered to 241. I thiink it was at this time that the surviving war emergency colours to BS 987c also came into BS 381 at this stage I think 436 was SCC 1A ?? and 437 was either SCC 15 or 16 ?? look forward to anyother additions/deletions regards TED

Hi Clive, yes understand how you arrived at your dates but, as you are no doubt aware: often items and practises are introduced way ahead of the publication of policy documents. example : Gulf war one. we were instructed to paint certain items in the pink sand colour that was applied as ARTF to the Tornado GR1, buccaneer, Jag etc. and some in light stone. (of course we were to use Alkyd synthetic not ARTF), intially we received warnings by phone from our paint people at Wyton ( now known as the IPT) so we could take certain steps; then we got warning order signals, then action signals . The pink sand has never received a BSC and remained under its F.S. number. RAF APs relating to GSE & Mt were never amended to reflect the use of that colour, nor do I recall a DCI. For gulf war 2 we put a lot of RAF vehicles into BSC 380 camo desert sand, by the time I was invalided in 2004 no RAF publication had been amended to reflect the intro of this colour. I have numerous interesting modification leaflets (1950s & 60s) relating to crash tenders and I know from photographic evidence and vehicle/equipment record cards that again many of the mods were carried out using the draft leaflets so the Air publications, reflect a date that can lag by months if not years. Turning the clock back even further, it is repeatedly stated that the RAF started camo painting in early 1941 as this is the date of the earliest AMO that has been unearthed, but photographic evidence shows camo painted commence in advance of mobilisation. I will delve into my discs and try and narrow down the CTC viz BCF ext date from photographs. re the intro into BS of BS 285, yes I don't recall ever seeing a BSC number when I was involved in the early days; in the reverse I believe it was in 1980 that traffic blue BSC 169 was deleted from the BS but we continues using it for several years after that date. Do you have copies of BS 381 you could share please Clive I have lots of notes but would appreciate anything between 1960 & 1980. Regards TED

Clive we started changing from CTC to BCF during my tour at Scampton 67-70. Irr Matt Green repaint commenced late 1974, I was at Marham at the time I had to plan with SNCO paintshop to get all GSE painted during its scheduled annual sevicing. We only had one paint bay, and the MT fleet repaint was dovetailed in as well. the plan went haywire in spring 75 when we received 30 AG70 TACR 1 fire truck it was finished in day glo fire orange. Strike Com instructed it had to go into IRR Mt Green before release to the fire section. It was a nightmare cutting back the dayglo to take dark admiralty grey under coat that the IRR Green needed. Everything also had to have a 4 " wide golden yellow around the vehicle/GSE at approx mid height which could not be applied until the IRR was fully cured. . It was late 77 when we first received the Vinyl stick on yellow strips to replace the painted bands. Initially the IRR Green programme was only applicable to Strike Command and RAF Germany units. As an aside it was never intended that the yellow band/stripe should be applied to vehicles remaining in RAF Blue/grey or GSE remaing in traffic blue BSC 169, as they should already have had yellow upper surfaces if operating on airfields. I moved to Bruggen in jan 1979 and at the time of my move both Marham and Bruggen had completed their repaint programmes. TED