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WW1 Peerless lorry restoration

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2 hours ago, Minesweeper said:

... the 1/2" studs 

... they are 18 tpi 

Any thoughts on that one, please?

http://www.bodgesoc.org/thread_dia_pitch.html 

Says none of the standards there. 

So, another "Special". 

Maybe there was a reason to enforce a specific nut design in that position? Is the seating area particularly small, for example? 

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Dad, always looking for new exciting things to do thought that he should start cleaning the Fly Wheel. The back of that was full of congealed crud  - oil had dripped on to it over the years and that then mixed with dirt/sand/ any other rubbish and had tuned it all into what was like thick concrete. He chiselled it away all afternoon – absolutely solid and would not give up easily.

  It could also do with a good sand blasting later on if that is practical. If sand blasting is not possible, perhaps it will be easier to clean it properly when it has been taken out.

 

He found that a lot of this crud had been painted grey – obviously when the lorry was last painted the then owner decided to paint everything without cleaning it!

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2 hours ago, radiomike7 said:

Did you manage to identify the crankcase/cylinder stud threads?

No, not yet! Fortunately, all of the studs and their nuts seem to be in good order - so they might have to fight again! I realy am curious about what we are going to find next!

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55 minutes ago, Minesweeper said:

No, not yet! Fortunately, all of the studs and their nuts seem to be in good order - so they might have to fight again! I realy am curious about what we are going to find next!

So they aren't UNS? 

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2 hours ago, Minesweeper said:

No, not yet! Fortunately, all of the studs and their nuts seem to be in good order - so they might have to fight again! I realy am curious about what we are going to find next!

I have just had a word with Steve about that thread again and although I have done no research, he tells me that UNS comes in a variety of pitches - the 1/2" ones are - 12UNS, 14UNS, 18UNS and 24 UNS - so this could be the answer!

Tracy Tools always seem to have a very wide range of threading Tools so if needs be, perhaps they can help! We will try to save the originals if we can.

Tony

 

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The Peerless continues to throw up unusual threads - the smaller studs on top of the Crank Case are 5/16" x 20. Although tap and die are available, I really do not want to have to make up a lot of steel nuts of that size if there is a Supplier  who holds them. Does anybody know of one, please?

Tony

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Posted (edited)

Some of you may have seen that the Imperial War Museum have remastered their WW1 driver training film "The awkward soldier". It is actually very watchable and entertaining. Here is the link to the them. The third part is especially interesting as it shows a Peerless engine being stripped down at about 12 minutes in. Well worth watching

https://www.iwm.org.uk/collections/item/object/1060022731

 This is part one of three. Parts two and three have clickable links further down.

 

Edited by Great War truck
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Great viewing and a bit of a laugh at times.  Only one good shot of an Albion A10 is where the horse drawn wagon comes out onto the road from the farm and he has to stop.  Plenty of other identifiable makes as well.  What would the Prince Henry Vauxhall car sliding about be worth today?.

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Another chain that we have was so encrusted with guck that we dont think that the molasses would have had any effect upon it so this one was sandblasted. It needs to come apart now as a lot of the links are stuck.

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2 hours ago, Great War truck said:

I suggest you throw it in a bucket of diesel and come back in a month or 2. At the least it will make disassembly much easier.

 

Another chain that we have was so encrusted with guck that we dont think that the molasses would have had any effect upon it so this one was sandblasted. It needs to come apart now as a lot of the links are stuck.

 

 

 

 

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Dad dug out of the garage the oil pump which we tucked away some years ago. It is a bit battered but is great to have the original. I dont hold out much hope of finding another one.

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On 5/15/2019 at 1:40 PM, MatchFuzee said:

Could be. 

Thread calculator and data for UNS and other UN threads:-

http://theoreticalmachinist.com/Threads_UnifiedImperial.aspx

"Radio Mike 7" -you were right all along! They are 1/2" x 18 UNS ! Confirmed that quite by chance - I was still desperate to identify them and  had a look on U.S.A Amazon for Tap and Die 1/2" x 18 - they were there - did not say UNS but they were cheap and I ordered them. The Die has arrived with Tap to follow and the Die is marked NS ! Able to check that on the surviving good threads - and a perfect fit! Well identified - and thank you!

Tony

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Interesting that the die is marked NS, National Special, rather than UNS, Unified National Special, so it is liable to be as old as the thread you are gauging.  That's probably why it didn't say UNS on the advert too.

 I wonder if those endlessly complex trade laws would stop you making and selling something like that as NS these days, with only UNS permissible?

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If you are interested the history of NS UNS etc, this covers the changes:-

The “UN” thread form was developed after World War II by representatives of Great Britain, Canada, and the United States of America, to prevent recurrence of the wartime difficulties in supplying fasteners and tools in both British Standard Whitworth and US Standard configurations when and where needed. In 1949, after years of committee meetings between Canada, England and United States of America the American National Standard Series was replaced with the Unified Inch Standard Series. In the end there were three base reasons identified for the change. The first reason was to provide interchangeability with Canada and United Kingdom. The second reason was to allow for interchangeability in the growing global marketplace. The third reason was to correct certain thread production difficulties. The jointly-developed thread form was named the Unified Thread Form. the Unified Thread is also referred to in the B1.1-2003 as Unified Inch Screw Thread. This Unified Inch Screw Thread both superseded the previous British, Canadian and American national standards, and later served as a prototype multi-national thread form standard that was eventually metricified to become the ISO Metric Screw Thread (the M-series).

More history on here:-

https://www.ring-plug-thread-gages.com/ti-N-vs-UN.htm

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The strip down of the last parts of the engine is still to be completed and this awaits the arrival of the other members of the team in Axminster to do it. In the mean time, we have been having a go at some of the other parts.

The Pedal Shaft was taken out earlier and this has been stripped down and sand blasted. This consists of two brackets to hold it which are bolted to the chassis. The brackets and the shaft are hollow and a steel "spindle" runs inside the bracket and the adjacent part of the spindle so that the shaft can turn on the spindle when the pedals are activated - a running fit, The "spindle" at the bracket end is locked in the bracket with a pinch bolt - 1/2" diameter with again a 18 t.p.i.thread on the end.

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One of the two spindles is corroded and worn and part of the flange is broken off. Furthermore, the slot for the pinch bolt is very much over size and looks as if it has been attacked with a file at some time - it needs to be replaced

 

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A new "spindle" has been made up out of an off cut of EN8. The half-slot will not be put in it for the pinch-bolt until we can do a trial assembly - to ensure that we get that in the right place.

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Just a short report to let you know what we have been up to during the summer months and the "Peerless" progress situation at the present. It was our hope that the Peerless chassis would be up on axle stands by this time, in our Lorry Shed but it is true that the more "toys" that you have and the more that you take on very much delays progress on new projects. And again, you may recall that we are somewhat limited by lack of space and it was our hope that by this time, one of the lorries in the Lorry Shed would have found "new lodgings" to free up some space for us to really get going on the Peerless
 
Well things are starting to move at last. A good friend in Bedfordshire has very kindly offered to find a home for the Thorny for the time being - not only does this solve the accommodation problem for us, it means that it will then be much nearer to both Steve and Tim and this will give them the opportunity of using it more often. So we hope that the Thorny will be moving out next month.
 
The Peerless chassis frame that we intend to use is stored in the Lorry Shed at the present, trapped in behind the FWD - which will have to be moved to get that frame out. Steve was fortuitously in Axminster yesterday and we started to plan the shuffle around to get everything ready for the move.. The FWD will have to come out - we are not ready to move the Peerless frame just yet, but as the FWD had not been started for over three years, we decided to move it out and to make sure that it still runs! Amazingly, it started on the second pull of the starting handle.
 
We gave it a bit of a wash whilst it was out and then put it back for the time being.
 
Other initial work has been going on, the 1/2" x 18 UNS nuts and the 5/16" x 20 UNS nuts replacements have been made - both mentioned in previous notes. Cleaning of other fittings has been started and we are making good progress with those tasks.    

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