6 X 6 Posted September 8, 2008 Share Posted September 8, 2008 It can and has been done (3 running around to my knowledge) just it takes a bit of savvy, if you really want to fit one I can recommend it 100%! I reckon 10-15 MPG and total reliability. What sort of road speed is your Explorer capable of with the L10 and how does that compare with the Meadows ? Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gritineye Posted September 8, 2008 Author Share Posted September 8, 2008 What sort of road speed is your Explorer capable of with the L10 and how does that compare with the Meadows ? Thanks. Just to get most questions out of the way at once. My reasons for fitting a Cummins L10 despite the amount of work needed to get one in an Explorer are these. Engine is the exactly right size, and weighs only, 876 kg (1930 lbs.) The clutch is easily accessible because the original length shaft and both rubber couplings can be used. Reliability, never heard a bad word against them, (running for cover now!) always starts on first jab of the button. Power band is perfect for an Explorer 1200-2100 rpm, red line 2400. cruising at around 30 mph-1700rpm and hardly ever need to change down out of top gear again, twice this year I think! Hit the red at a tad under 40 mph on the over-run but 30 suits me fine Spares are readily available. Only downside is, it looks a bit small with the bonnet sides off and the tick over is a little fast for delicate off roading. To fit one you will need to turn the exhaust manifold upside down, make up a spacer to the turbo, split the turbo and turn two parts to suit, blank off one inlet manifold hole and use the other one, make up a new exhaust and filter/inlet pipe. Then make rear engine mountings, move the fan up to suit the rad shroud and if your sump is at the front it will have to be reversed and the pickup altered. The clutch can be done different ways depending on the type used. It is possible to use the meadows clutch shaft unaltered, although I didn't. A 1980s/90s ERF fuel tank pickup has the same thread as the Scammell one so the fuel line is easy. If any one is really interested I could dig out some pix of what I did and post them, the most difficult part is the thinking, and that's all been done now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
younggun Posted September 8, 2008 Share Posted September 8, 2008 ime very interested bernerd post away . p.s ime still working on getting those bellhouseing pics due to thecnical failur will be seeing the exeplorer in question again at the weekend i havent forgoten u bernard thanks for the grate dvd of scammell porn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gritineye Posted September 8, 2008 Author Share Posted September 8, 2008 There is a chap I know who is fitting one now, I will try and contact him to look at progress and take pix, he drove Forceful and picked my brains for a day before getting an engine so got the rear sump, single plate clutch, single front mounting pad, and a rev counter from the same truck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stormin Posted September 8, 2008 Share Posted September 8, 2008 If any one is really interested I could dig out some pix of what I did and post them, the most difficult part is the thinking, and that's all been done now. You can never have enough pictures! Over 3000 views of this thread. Of course people are interested! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6 X 6 Posted September 8, 2008 Share Posted September 8, 2008 Gritineye, Thank you for taking the time to give such a comprehensive reply. The L10 does seem to have a lot to commend it. I know of two older Meadows to diesel conversions in 20t Constructors, one a Gardner 180 LXB giving a cruising speed of 25-27 mph plus that gorgeous exhaust note and the other, a Leyland 680 Powerplus, which being slightly higher revving, gives 30-32 mph. Both engines are very reliable with a good spares situation. As far as I know there is one complete Meadows petrol engined 20t Constructor still around with possibly one other in bits. Although I fully appreciate why people do these conversions I'd like to think that some of these petrol engined Cons/Explorers may be able to stay intact until some cheaper, microbe based, petrol substitute becomes available in the future. I'll never understand why unlimited petrol/diesel is not prescribed free of charge to all HMV owners through the National Health Service like the free methadone scheme that enables others to get stoned all day at our expense. N.O.S. What engine is in your MoS Constructor ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gritineye Posted September 8, 2008 Author Share Posted September 8, 2008 6X6, the path to a happy life is the way that causes less stress and more enjoyment, Diesel engines can help one to find that path. :banana::banana: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big chris Posted September 8, 2008 Share Posted September 8, 2008 (edited) hi all just to clear things up meadows on lpg is great have you ever gone to your petrol explorer pulled the choke /wound for a while then a long splutter then firing into life the meadows starts great when warm sounds lovely but at huge cost big steve and i were going to convert his to l10 howerver we went lpg instead best move ever on the bottle returns equivalent 9 to gallon price wise no noisey diesel no spluttering 1 turn shes away not even a puff of rich un burnt petrol from exhaust after we converted it i was so impressed with the results i even changed my mind on petrol explorers if one had come up instead of the diesel one i bought i would have jumped at it,, but it never i have noticed a big difference with my engine conversion 680 to 690 turbo i though it would be a straight forward swap no chance differences are rear of sump wall will not house 690 oil pump exhaust no chance struggled to even get an exhaust in inj pump doesnt rev as well wwaterpump and housing different complete strip of everything rear inc bell housing plate to metalastic coupling swapping fly wheels everything different mounts/fuel lines/returns/side covers put it this way by the time you finish the new engine is almost the same colour as the old one not just abolt out bolt in job everthing is tight and heavy but it was well worth it it now up hill sounds like a jet pulling up the runway and in the 28 miles i travelled my missus followed in the car and she said on her speedo it was running along at 43 mph so i think the 690 is perfect however vibration of gear gate at that spead well just a hase i did think about a full conversion to l10 however i though at the time a 690 was the way to go as it should just drop in HOW WRONG I WAS!! cheers chris Edited September 8, 2008 by big chris spelling Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gritineye Posted September 8, 2008 Author Share Posted September 8, 2008 LPG is a viable option then and may well be the way forward if you have a sound Meadows to start with, I didn't but Andy Fowler has! I suspect he will be along soon to ask how much it all cost! It has to be the only way to keep a Meadows engined one in regular use, Well done. Watch that rear Prop like a hawk at those speeds :shake: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6 X 6 Posted September 8, 2008 Share Posted September 8, 2008 6X6, the path to a happy life is the way that causes less stress and more enjoyment, Diesel engines can help one to find that path. :banana::banana: Yes, alright Gritineye, I happen to know where you lifted that quote from: "Diesel engines can help one to find that path" is on page 23 of "The Sayings of Lao-Tzu", The Wisdom of The East Series. Anyway, petrol is for girls. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gritineye Posted September 8, 2008 Author Share Posted September 8, 2008 Yes, alright Gritineye, I happen to know where you lifted that quote from: "Diesel engines can help one to find that path" is on page 23 of "The Sayings of Lao-Tzu", The Wisdom of The East Series. Anyway, petrol is for girls. Never ever heard of any of that stuff, all mine I'm afraid, only original thinking this end old chap Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big chris Posted September 8, 2008 Share Posted September 8, 2008 (edited) the only advantage to diesel i can see is the colour gritineye i would be interested in those pictures as well of the bell housing conversion just to see if my idea of doing the conversion is how you have done it thanks chris Edited September 8, 2008 by big chris spelling Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gritineye Posted September 8, 2008 Author Share Posted September 8, 2008 Been looking for them, can't find em, they may be on a backup disc after a change of PC, please be patient Chris. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radiomike7 Posted September 8, 2008 Share Posted September 8, 2008 the only advantage to diesel i can see is the colour In my case it was quite OK to run on red, which saves at least another 50%:cool2: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gritineye Posted September 9, 2008 Author Share Posted September 9, 2008 (edited) Here we go with the Cummins L10 conversion evening classes, I can't find all my pix so more words may be needed, sorry for that. Due to the Scammell shaft being too short and the clutch being a twin plate pull off type, I started to adapt the one that came with the engine/gbox, without much hope of success it must be said! The Eaton/Fuller bell housing, the clutch release components were moved to the other position opposite the access hole and the housing fitted upside down so the hole is at the top, and shaft (not fitted in this pic) protruding out of the bottom r/h side. The clutch brake was missing and I never bothered to get one fitted, a mistake! The first motion shaft from the E/F gearbox fitted, the bearing that supports this was located in the front of the gearbox, this bit of the casting was anglegrindered out for re-use, bad things were said to me at this point by onlookers! Note that the large centre boss is only a push fit in the alloy at this point. This is the first motion shaft, you can see where the clutch brake has worn the shaft and spline (or groove) and why I didn't fit a new one. Anyhow this was an experiment and a new shaft etc was not in the budget. classes will continue tomorrow night. Edited September 11, 2008 by gritineye Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radiomike7 Posted September 9, 2008 Share Posted September 9, 2008 Bernard, have you since fitted the clutch brake? I suspect that drag from the twin plate would make it difficult to engage a gear from neutral.:confused: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N.O.S. Posted September 9, 2008 Share Posted September 9, 2008 N.O.S. What engine is in your MoS Constructor ? The original Rolls C6NFL. The LPG conversions sound a great idea. BTW I have a partially dismembered Meadows petrol in a Constructor skeleton if anyone needs any bits. No dealers please Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madrat Posted September 9, 2008 Share Posted September 9, 2008 Very interested to follow this thread, I always intended on buying a petrol explorer and converting to lpg and modern ignition. Just bought a 6lw pioneer first! I'd like to see how your lpg system is setup, any pics for the posting?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big steve Posted September 9, 2008 Share Posted September 9, 2008 I would be intresteaded in the meadows engine n.o.s you can never have to many spares Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gritineye Posted September 9, 2008 Author Share Posted September 9, 2008 Bernard, have you since fitted the clutch brake? I suspect that drag from the twin plate would make it difficult to engage a gear from neutral.:confused: No Mike, and it drags, and drags................ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest catweazle (Banned Member) Posted September 9, 2008 Share Posted September 9, 2008 No Mike, and it drags, and drags................ Thought you had gone to bed:-D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gritineye Posted September 10, 2008 Author Share Posted September 10, 2008 Thought you had gone to bed:-D Still looking for pix, :yawn: No Mike, and it drags, and drags................ It takes a long time to slow enough to get a gear when standing, but on the move I rev to 2200, slip into neutral, let it drop to 1200 and it goes in perfic, with or without the clutch. The power band matches the gbox nicely, but you need to rev it because of the 'slow rev decay', a technical phrase I heard somewhere'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gritineye Posted September 10, 2008 Author Share Posted September 10, 2008 (edited) Lesson 2 Scammell gearbox input coupling flangy thing. End of Fuller shaft, bush to be removed. Plug turned to fit both internal sizes of shaft and flange Flange shortened and shaped, shaft shaped and the two pieces pressed together. Did I hear voices off saying "That ain't gonna work, daft ba****rd" ? Well this method was used when putting a locker and Salisbury shafts in a LR S3 front axle swivel and never broke in competition use. Pre heated in Rayburn and welded together with dissimilar metals rods and turned off to eliminate stress points Welding caused a bit of warping of the flange face, so this was turned true again, the bolts were splayed a tiny wee bit but the holes in the Metalastic coupling had enough clearance to allow for this Still looking for the rest of the pix so end of class 2 Edited September 12, 2008 by gritineye Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest catweazle (Banned Member) Posted September 10, 2008 Share Posted September 10, 2008 Interesting,giz a choclate,i spy a v8 water pump? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gritineye Posted September 11, 2008 Author Share Posted September 11, 2008 Interesting,giz a choclate,i spy a v8 water pump? No games or sweets allowed in class, hand 'em over lad :nono: Lesson three This is where it all gets a bit messy I'm afraid, but you must remember that this is cutting edge stuff and prototypes aren't always pretty! This is the bell housing fitted, the bit cut out of the E/F gearbox with the bearing inside bolted to the centre boss, to stop the boss from falling out I used bits of steel flat stock bolted through existing holes as far as possible. It would have been easier to use the whole end of the gbox. The thin plate is covering a thick leather seal I cut out to fit, a grease nipple is fitted (can just see a bit of it at top) The release shaft was connected ti the original pedal and rods by cutting and welding the arm, this took a few goes to get right as at first the clutch worked OK but was so light that there was no 'feel', so I shortened the lever until it felt right. Can't find pix of the rear mountings as made so this will have to do for now, note the link to prevent fore and aft movement, l/h side. Fan relocating next, keep up at the back! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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