corporate use of military vehicles your views ?

[sharky]

I am interested to know what peoples opinions are on the usage of ex military vehicle for corporate and general public driving experiences.

I work for a firm doing this(mainly FV432 but also BV206 /202, bedford MJ, ferret and BRDM 2) and we have in the region of 150 customers a weekend and hopefully we have given them a glimpse into the hard realities of what these vehicles are designed for aswell as a novel experience. Many customers comment that they now have a new found respect for AFV crews after there session.

On a maintenance side of things our vehicles are well maintaned and not thrashed to death as many people believe(this would be self defeating as the vehicles only earn money if they are running) .

If any one has any views feel free to post them but dont mention companies by name if you have horror stories as not sure they would appreciate it.

Iain (sharky)

[griff66]

i have seen a few ex corporate machines being serviced for their new owners and the term well maintained whilst in corporate hands does not spring to mind !! but i,m sure there is exeptions:-)

[Markheliops]

Hi Iain -

 

Good question well presented.

 

Can of worms mate but I shall give you my opinion.

 

The trouble with corporate firms is when one of their MV's becomes more trouble than it's worth - they give them a spray job and sell them as excellent runners etc - only for the new owner to find themselves with a pile of junk for which they paid above the going rate.

 

My own experience is I went to see a Cent ARV which was advertised as a good runner with rubber tracks. When I spoke to the chap who shall remain nameless - he assured me I just needed to add two new batteries and some fuel and the tank would be up and running.

 

I drove a considerable distance only to stand in front of a rusty pile of scrap metal which clearly had not moved for many years.

 

Some time after, I managed to speak to some other Cent owners at W&P who informed me they had visited the same Cent ARV eight years prior to my visit, in the same place and in the same condition.

 

Well Iain - that was four years ago since I visited the Cent ARV from a well known corporate user -

 

Would you be surprised to hear the same Cent is still for sale now (I just checked) describing the same condition as when I went to see it.

 

This is the advert

 

Centurion ARV

Rubber boot tracks. Smoke dischargers excellent runner

 

I know not all corporate users are responsible for the above - but until corporate users change their attitude towards selling the vehicles which are no longer profitable - I can't see them getting a respectful image.

 

Markheliops

Edited September 6, 2010 by Markheliops
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[rbrtcrowther]

I bought my scammell without seeing it but the chap was really nice and said he would rather i came to take a look at it. I new it would be worse than the pictures and it was. he was in the prosess of taking the buisnes back off the people he let run the company and was not impressed with the state of the toys, infact they had run them into the ground. He bought the scammell for people tp off road but knowone could change gear in it so he kept it for himself.and just used it on odd ocasions. Got as far as restoring one wheel and hub and decided to flog it.

[Stone]

I can think of at least one I wouldn't buy anything more complicated than a spanner from.

 

Then again, the price would probably suggest that it was a spanner lovingly handcrafted, by elves, from purest unobtanium and personally blessed by Elvis. There's no stopping some people, yes buy low and sell high but their Milweb listings are taking the urine!

 

Stone

[timbo]

No particular beef with this but you have to remember these people are first and foremost trying to make money.

 

The prices they want for their old kit seem to be ridiculous but then most of this stuff doesn't sell but sits in a field until it is no use to anyone but the scrapman...

 

Wouldn't touch anything corporate with a bargepole myself but I suppose it does stop vehicles being scrapped (at least in the short term).

[Stone]

Short term is about right. They spend 20 years sitting in a field before being scrapped because the owner wants a bajillion pounds for it!

 

The irony is of course that they'd usually be worth a lot more than scrap value when they first arrive anyway :-|

 

Stone

[Stormin]

Hi Iain -

 

Good question well presented.

 

Can of worms mate but I shall give you my opinion.

 

The trouble with corporate firms is when one of their MV's becomes more trouble than it's worth - they give them a spray job and sell them as excellent runners etc - only for the new owner to find themselves with a pile of junk for which they paid above the going rate.

 

My own experience is I went to see a Cent ARV which was advertised as a good runner with rubber tracks. When I spoke to the chap who shall remain nameless - he assured me I just needed to add two new batteries and some fuel and the tank would be up and running.

 

I drove a considerable distance only to stand in front of a rusty pile of scrap metal which clearly had not moved for many years.

 

Some time after, I managed to speak to some other Cent owners at W&P who informed me they had visited the same Cent ARV eight years prior to my visit, in the same place and in the same condition.

 

Well Iain - that was four years ago since I visited the Cent ARV from a well known corporate user -

 

Would you be surprised to hear the same Cent is still for sale now (I just checked) describing the same condition as when I went to see it.

 

This is the advert

 

Centurion ARV

Rubber boot tracks. Smoke dischargers excellent runner

 

I know not all corporate users are responsible for the above - but until corporate users change their attitude towards selling the vehicles which are no longer profitable - I can't see them getting a respectful image.

 

Markheliops

 

To be fare regarding the Cent ARV, at 51 tonnes it is for sale at below current scrap price, so maybe you can't expect too much.

[timbo]

To be fare regarding the Cent ARV, at 51 tonnes it is for sale at below current scrap price, so maybe you can't expect too much.

 

Is it deffo still there then ? Does it have an engine etc..?

 

Lovely bit of kit - I still always enjoying looking at Agrippers Cent BARV.

[Stormin]

Is it deffo still there then ? Does it have an engine etc..?

 

Lovely bit of kit - I still always enjoying looking at Agrippers Cent BARV.

 

PM Sent.

[John Pearson]

Just a thought, (a similar thought occurred about range targets as well):

If the corporate entertainers had not bought the hundreds of 432's, cents, chieftains etc at the time, the low demand would mean that the prices would probably have been so low that scrappage would have been very attractive. Years later, a lot are now in very poor condition but even so, they are easier to restore than steel ingots are!

 

It is said that Pounds scrap yard cut up and melted down 97% (?) of all the AFV's they ever had, the survivors only being left because the price of scrap went down making it uneconomic to cut them up. If the price had remained high for a few more months then there would be almost no M10's, Centaurs, Churchill crocodiles, T16 carriers etc in preservation. It would have been a pity if the 432's, cents, chieftains etc had mostly gone the same way!

[Adrian Scott]

I beleive my M10 came out of Pounds yard a good few years ago ,it seems one of the few lucky survivors !! and as for the high prices that the corperate companies ask for there redundent vehicles , there only worth what some one is prepared to pay !!!! , i wouldnt want a ex corperate vehicle myself.

[Stormin]

Another point to bear in mind is that although they likely get abuse from un-sympathetic punters, most of the driving is supervised and the maintenance is likely done at least well enough to keep them running and earning their keep.

 

I know someone who ran few vehicles for corporate entertainment for a few years and they were reasonably well maintained. If you make the investment on many vehicles you also need to invest in the necessary equipment to maintain them, heavy lifting gear, specialist tools etc. That sort of investment is probably beyond the scope of many hobby enthusiasts but is almost essential for someone running several vehicles for profit. From that perspective vehicles may well have been better maintained in corporate hands than by private individuals.

[andym]

I suspect there's a distinct difference between the simple "keeping everything topped up" and real maintenance with investment in the proper tools and people who know what they're doing. The latter represents an appreciable outlay and some firms may either just not bother, or consciously decide it's more cost-effective to treat the vehicles as disposable, replacing them when they need anything difficult doing to them.

 

Andy

[timbo]

I beleive my M10 came out of Pounds yard a good few years ago ,it seems one of the few lucky survivors !! and as for the high prices that the corperate companies ask for there redundent vehicles , there only worth what some one is prepared to pay !!!! , i wouldnt want a ex corperate vehicle myself.

 

Slight tangent but wasn't it Pounds that ran a bulldozer deliberately through a rare 19th century navy ship a few years ago when they got wind of a possible campaign to try to preserve it ?

 

Lucky survivor indeed..

[Markheliops]

To be fare regarding the Cent ARV, at 51 tonnes it is for sale at below current scrap price, so maybe you can't expect too much.

 

Hi Norman.

 

Presumably you know of the Cent ARV I'm referring to.

 

I have no problem in the fact the chap is selling the vehicle for below scrap value but two things should be duly considered.

 

Scrap dealers do not want to touch large armour as it is over-sized and not many have the equipment or the inclination to cut the things up - so scrap value doesn't really apply as size doesn't equal value.

 

Secondly. The advert stated the Cent ARV was an excellent runner - which was clearly a miss-leading statement considering the thing hadn't run for a good many years.

 

Markheliops