cosrec

Which is stronger which will transmit more power or is it torque :nut: which allow faster speeds ? ] Niether it the ratio of the diff that dictates the the speed

some heavy haulage trucks to day have relatively small diffs with planetry gearing built into the hubs so reducing strain on diffs and drive/ half shafts dont know if this helps with your question

When fastening to axles you can use chains short wire slings or polyester endless slings. You can hang over the springs at the back of the hangers. Problem with more modern trucks is body panels bumpers hang lower so can get damaged. So wrap around the axle its self. This brings about its own problems at the front you usually have the steering rod behind the axle watch you dont wrap around this I have on more than one ocassion at the rear the brake accuation shaft can easily get wrapped around. This brings me on to the best bit of recovery kit for years the polyester endless slings. these are supple enough to wrap around an axle missing the above items which can be impossible with chains or wire slings. These slings are supplied colour coded eg the red sleeved ones are rated at 5 tons. If you look at them they will have a number of lines printed or stitched along the length of the sleeve this will be either 5 or 7 this is the factor of saftey the slings are designed with for lifting purposes. When using around axle you are actually using them in basket form hence you have doubled there rating. Use in pairs one each side of axle and bring together to form bridal and you have the ideal set up for heavy winching with the knowledge that its going to take around 140tons before they start smacking you in the mouth. Now thats a lot more then anybodys going to be able to apply and the axle would probably come of first anyway. They have another great advantage is they are easy to scramble up and down embankments dykes without giving you a hernia. they fold up and you can tuck them behind a seat plus you can even use them for what they were designed for Lifting within SWL of course. What else is good about them if you wrap them around a steel Brake pipe with out noticing they are soft enough to get away with out crushing it. They fit in to the nato hitches fitted on MOD vehicles either singley for say tow starting or doubled to hang to for winching A new pair of 5 ton 3 metre long ones costs about £40 cheaper and a dam sight handier than equivalent chains or wire slings. In use they stretch noticably. On bogged vehicles if you pull hard then leave for awhile you oftence can return and give another pull because they retain pressure as suction eases unlike chains. Ps dont try using as KERRS they are no good for snatching steady sustained pressure is what is needed

A bit more on why I wont use standard towing eyes for heavy pulls. Originally the majority of towing eyes were the screw in type. These were actually lifting eyes the same fitted to electric motors machinery etc if you look them up they have a SWL 2 tons direct pull they could stand virtually no side loading. Next came the centrally mounted xmember type if fitted with correct pin these could stand 5 ton non standard pin smaller than original fitted and they pulled the top flange out around about 3 ton . Next came the type fitted Bedford TK cargos these were good for about 3 ton per side straight pull. Ok for a moderate pull if used in tandem Modern day commercials are fitted with quick connect towing eyes either side front on chassis ends these are good for about 4.5 tons. Only one towing eye is supplied per vehicle. These towing eyes are very substantial so why such a low rating. Because there is a great danger of lozenging the chassis above these ratings. Believe me I have seen it done. Also if subjected to side loadings they can easily bend the chassis ends. With out exception and it usually says in vehicle handbook definitely no lift forces are to be applied to them. Which to me leaves only manufacturer supplied trailer attachments eg drawbar units. These will stand as much as the chassis can so are ok to use but have the problem of being difficult to fasten to. As for cars they have flimsy pressed steel towing eyes or more modern ones have screw in eyes. Personally I wont use these to winch a vehicle on to a slide bed never mind out of mud or up an embankment. Which is why I said fasten to axles.

Hi Clive think ive seen your name before on another forum. You tow a lot of stretched limos dont you. You will find the posters on here very friendly and helpful

Sometimes DVLA come out and check no is marked. Dont know for sure but some Chevrolet chasssis are stamped just to rear of front spring hanger i have have a motor home it certainly is also has riveted plate with vin no on just visable on bulkhead right in corner of windscreen you have to stand on something to get sight of it hope this helps.

Memory bit vague now but our first martian cargo had only one accumulator it was charged using nitrogen and filled twice in 4 years. Second was wrecker version this had two accumulators and my mate filled it with compressed air from a compresser mounted on a Fordson tractor that he filled diving bottles with he used a screw on shrader valve fastened to a hydraulic hose. I am sure that he used to set blow off pressure on compresser to 2200 psi. we got the pressure from a handbook we had i gave the hand book away to another Martian owner so i cant double check we filled that vehicle about every 3 months.

once you have the hydraulic side sorted out a local diving club will recharge the accumulators with nitrogen for you cost you a couple of pints

Ok shockers are not the best of places to hang to on trailers so where do you hang your kit. If you are interested enough have a look round one next time you get chance there are supisingly few places. You may find welded on to the chassis underneath the rails around the fifth wheel and at the back end some hefty d shaped rings maybe painted yellow and may have a transfer next to them with a ships anchor on them. Usually they are painted yellow and are fantastic for what they are designed to do take a direct pull straight down when begin lashed on board ferries. They are capable of holding 4 tons in this job. they will not stand being pull sideways as oftence they are only welded to 5mm plate. What else is there 5th wheel pin ideal its designed for the job but theres a unit fastened to it so use the unit. sides have crash guards there only cosmetic so forget them back end you have tail lifts or under run bars niether of them are any good. Whats left axles. With very few exceptions on any modern civillian and a lot of milatry vehicles regardless of size i would ever do a heavy pull on the axle. i certainly will not use the manfacturers supplyed towing eyes for any serious work

Oh dear looks like them harmless winch rope gremins have struck again. Good job they only bend fairlead rollers and leave people alone. The aid posted by robin craig is a good one. The recheck rigging one would have saved this mishap Remember rigging includes the bit you hang to not just your own kit [ATTACH=CONFIG]34166[/ATTACH]

Stum :undecided:

Can read a lot in to this part of report if you want "'There are other matters ongoing with the police at the moment but I do not want to talk about them." Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1309728/Guns-rocket-launchers-missiles-seized-police-Worcester-house-raid.html#ixzz0yty8vOEK

Thanks for info. If its Styer design like you say they will be good for years to come. By the way green with envy who ever owns that power wagon what a bonny truck love to think when i retire i could nip up to paper shop in one like it. I actually delivered one about three months ago on behalf of a dealer to its new owner it was pre war (1936 ??) and had exactly the same body on i think they look better than the heavy wider bodied models that came later regards Steve

Couple of questions can the winch mid way down right hand side leg used for self front recovery be used straight out the back if so it would tick all the boxes for me i think biggest failing with most ex mod vehicles is only one winch to rear the cab looks like Styer of Austria is that who builds them. If so i think Britsh AreoSpace are tied in somewhere with their manfacture the recovery equpment looks like some also built in austria by a company called something like Emphal you dont know whos design it is do you

maybe its time for a couple of tips for the landrover owners and off roaders. the best general way of increasing holding power on most vehicles under most conditions are scotch blocks. these are dead easy to fab up. but if you are cheecky enough you can cadge them of continental truck drivers on services they all carry them in the form of wheel chocks on trailors and units. the best i have found are those fitted to iveco units. if you have a front mounted winch equiped 4X4 throw one under each front wheel the wrong way up eg curved side down and winch with hand brake of until almost going over the top of it then fasten a ratchet strap to the handle pass it in front of bumper over the top across the chassis up over the bumper and down to handle on opposite scotch ratchet up until tight apply handbrake. you will effectivley nearly double your holding power. Ps if you bumper bends i dont want to know but i can say i have done it my self quite a few times with no problems

I went on this job myself so will try and answer your questions. The picture doesnt actually show very well were the dyke started it is actually about 4ft away from the road. the wheels are sunk on the soft verge between road and dyke the fat middle part of drum is only just resting on opposite side of dyke. the dyke is about 4ft deep if you look to front of mixer the darker green strip is weeds that are choking dyke and give a better idea how it runs. Lifting chassis and dragging on to road would create two big problems. 1 the drum on a mixer is ony held on by gravity at the back if it comes clear of the rollers you have major headaches. 2 pulling it around would caused the drum to fall into dyke causing it to be headdown this would double any winching forces required to stand it back up again. We used a modern wrecker with twin winches on boom parked at right angles in a stubble field opposite two wide straps fastened to chassis then wrapped around drum (makes sure drum is kept tight in rear rollers) using elevated winching pulled until os wheels almost on floor. piont here the fact wheels are off the road is to your advantage as it they dig in and stop mixer shuffling on its side. next big dollop of swarfega on each os tyre and where its going to hit road. then winch untill vehicle is level. once upright it takes virtually nothing to hold it then removed front winch line down to a block on rear leg out to rear most part of chassis on mixer another block and back to wrecker. then its a case of winching the back across and giving a little tweek on top line untill it slides back across road . On this ocassion had to then go to road and winch a bit more to get front wheel out of soft verge. Damage to mirror door and side guards but driver still drove on to destination and tipped 2 hr from call to tipping load. Thank for asking questions Quick tip if mixer is stuck but still mixing 3 bags of sugar in back will buy you enough time to get some gear on scene to sort it out

As promised a drawing to show how to use DT969 to its full potential. Notice the winch lines pass under the vehicle between 1st and 2nd axles. Think you will agree 25 ton of winching power from a 9 ton vehicle is impressive. The vehicle is only reciveng about 3.5 tons load which is pressing straight down a load it is more than capable of carrying the actual winching loads are carried across the head stock of the crane and are perfectly balanced so there is no need for any stabilisers in deed dont even need the handbrake on to deliver these winching forces. So you might have a 70 year old truck but under the right conditions you can have fantastic power available with virtually no stress to the vehicle. To give you an idea of what a 25 ton winching force will do i have put on a picture of a fully loaded mixer it would take around half this force to recover it. [ATTACH=CONFIG]33895[/ATTACH] [ATTACH=CONFIG]33896[/ATTACH]

Have got rigged up and started doing some heavy winching using snatch blocks very important to keep an look out for stones. Try and keep blocks clear of ground and dont winch through earth. Also before applying maximum load check and make sure well greased rope hasnt got any stuck to them. Reason a flinty stone goinging around a snatch block under heavy load will go of like small handgrenade throwing fragments a considerable distance. It also subjects rope to piont loading which can cause strand breaks or deformation. When doing recovery it oftence becomes the case where it takes more to winch a vehicle than it would to physically lift vehicle staight up. Now it may not be practical to back up and pick up vehicle but if you can arrange for an elevated winching angle you can oftence halve the load you need to apply. Unfotunatly most milatry vehicles have no provision to do this eg they can only lift straight up or indepently winch straight out to back or front. In these cases your only option is to try and use terrain to gain elevation. One vehicle that can supply an elevated winching angle is the scammell EKA these well rigged are the equal of two much bigger straight winching trucks in the right circumstances. Another is the 989 diamond t series of trucks even to day these little trucks can be more than a match for some modern much bigger vehicles. Will put a drawing on to show what i mean. To sum up On a post about the Stolly swimming i got a slating for stating what i thought of the operation. It was also suggested i was doing nothing to say what was being done wrong. Hope these ramblings have done a bit to put this right.. Maybe someone has learnt a little bit from this. Maybe it has put someone off doing something that could be dangerous Hopefully it may have saved someone some grief. Plus it may have given somebody a little knowledge and enable them to get some enjoyment out of a situation. Never know might just get you out of a sticky situation one day.

Hats of to you fellas

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Just noticed this photo from a job that has been done lately by our company this is a perfect example of HOW NOT TO USE SNATCH BLOCKS they are getting side loading imposed on them and if crane had been any higher would have resulted in ruined blocks broken wires etc. Photos only came to my attention today somebody in for an upping tomorrow

Once you have added a snatch block you can add more if you run out of holding power you ofset load on to deadmad/anchors etc. After that there is no limit on what you can move given you have enough blocks and rope and something to fasten to. Couple of tips When you have complicated set ups just count no of ropes to object being winched then times by load on winch to get power exerted and check if if connections are strong enough when winching on single line or multiple lines anchored to your vehicle the object being winched will follow path of winch lines. When off setting load to deadman etc this isnt the case. But it is something that can be used to advantage to guide object where you want it. Have put drawing on with simple rigging shown i Know it will be obvious to a lot of you but i catches a lot of people out. We have been out to quite a few jobs were people have rolled HGVs trying to get vehicles out of dykes and put them futher in by not understanding why they are not going towards winching vehicle Compound rigging is handy but on every day jobs i cant see a use for it we have over the years tackled many thousands of heavy jobs and only resorted to it maybe 5 times. [ATTACH=CONFIG]33695[/ATTACH]

I think engineering nylon would make a good substitute. Easy to work available in black . You can buy on line in small quantities. Try goggling direct plastics

Right we have rigged up the winch with a single snatch block the rope leaves the truck round the block and is anchored back to the truck. For every ton that is applied to the line approx 2 tons is applied to the hook on the block Simple. Now say instead of hanging back to the truck you decide to use a deadman of set to one side you have long length of rope out and every ton you apply provides roughly 2 tons at the hook . you keep winching in and as you do an angle starts to develop between the out and return line. If you keep going you may end up with an angle on the two ropes of 90 degrees. At this piont the load on the hook will be only 1.6 tons A bit further the angle becomes 120 degrees the load will be only 1 ton and a bit further 170 degrees the load on the hook will be only 1/12 th of a ton not a lot when you are still putting the same energy into the system. Like a lot of things in recovery if you understand what is happening you can oftence spin it round and use it to your advantage. In this case say you have a stuck vehicle with a strong steel rope stretched to a deadman if you slip a snatch block on the middle of the rope and fasten it to a landrover say as you take the load if the angle is 170 degrees and you apply 1ton to the block you are actually putting a load of 6 tons to the line either side of the block. 6 tons of line pull will sure move a lot. As long as you are aware of the forces involved it could probaly get you out the $*^& at some time. Another time the above comes in handy is if you are using a block to give a change of direction if the angle is only slight what ever you fasten to can a lot less strong than you first imagine.

Right you have a snatch block(s) and the rope is a nice fit in it and you are 100 percent sure that its not designed for use with fibre or synthetic rope. How are you going to use it. My advice not at all until you have checked a few more things. 1 the whole thing is in general good order and free from damage reason obvious 2 the pully is lubricated and rotates nicely Reason when you start using in anger it is suggested that up to 10 percent of power of winch is lost in every block used i think this is an over exageration but if the block is well lubricated then you have done what you can 3 most blocks wether fitted with hook or shackle at load bearing end can swivel make sure they do easily reason it seems to the nature of things that when to have a long line out round a block and you take up the strain there always seems to be three or four twists in the rigging. if well lubricated these will spin out as you apply more load 4 check what ever is used to hold gate which allows rope to enter block is fitted and working correctly reason over the years i have never had a block that has failed but we have had many that have been been bent or distorted beyond safe use because they havent been tightend fastened correctly Ok got some snatch blocks in good working order what can you use them for 1 gain a Mechanical Advantage (more power) 2 cause a change of direction 3 carry a load 4 spread a load