jenkinov Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 I am interested in building up a toolkit for the triumph 3swept ..the handbook lists the tools but I was interested in understanding if the spanners are chromed or unchromed ...it looks as if some of th e tools were produced post war . I am assuming the wartime tools were uncorked .... Does anyone have a toolkit .....or know ... Jenkinov Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 UNCORKED?? Have you been at the wine again? Ron Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jenkinov Posted January 18, 2015 Author Share Posted January 18, 2015 Ron..predictive text strikes again ...unchromed was the intended word.... Jenkinov More of a beer man....bitter and porter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Robert Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 UNCORKED?? Have you been at the wine again? Ron The illustrations in my 3SW handbook 100/T.C.3 are drawings of the spanners and therefore impossible to ascertain the type of finish. ...however in keeping with all WD bikes the toolkits would have been a mix of Manufacture specific tools., and generic supplied tools such as pliers, spark plug spanners and adjustable wrenches. Most of these if not all were not plated but etched black, a semi rust free process called Parkerising which was easily done in house as a cheap finish. It is always tempting to have and carry an authentic tool kit, but on the road any breakdown/puncture is far better dealt with with modern tools especially combination spanners that actually work in the heat of the moment. there are serious experts on The WDBSA bikers website covering all makes of WD bikes if you want further opinion etc.great to see a bit of interest in a fairly rare bike.... Ed Abbott. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
79x100 Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 (edited) A military vehicle isn't truly complete without its issue toolkit. Any chance of posting up some scans of the handbook / parts book illustrations ? I agree with the comment that a Parkerised or oil-blacked finish would have been normal. I'm not sure that I've ever seen pre-war vehicle tools with a chromed or polished finish. Triumph would have supplied a certain amount of the tools, based pretty much on their pre-war civilian kits and in addition there would have been a list of tools and equipment to complete authorised scale...these were War Office supplied standard tools and the list would normally include substitution lists for use in the case of lost or damaged tools needing replacement. There can be clues in the registered design numbers shown on some tools such as adjustable spanners and also in the use of the dual Whit / BSF marking that came later. The 3SW was of course an early-war bike so I wouildn't expect tools to be marked 'War Finish' and in general, the tools supplied with the kit were not WD marked or dated, although replacements would have been. The kit supplied with WD Nortons was quite useful and in fact there is no substitute for the cranked gearbox nut spanner. I do use mine for the odd roadside adjustment. More serious work is, of course always carried out as preventative maintenance in the workshop ! 🙂 Personally, I have a lot of fun rummaging for tools at jumbles. The perfect antidote to 'not needing anything'...This is the WD16H kit (or as close as I've got to it yet)... Edited June 16, 2020 by 79x100 Improved photo uploaded direct. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jenkinov Posted January 25, 2015 Author Share Posted January 25, 2015 great looking toolkit ...In terms of the toolkit for the 3sw it contains the following triumph spanners NA66 NA55 PA56 PA57 PA60 DA87 DA5 NA65 DA21 DA16 DA72 KA50 The link below takes you to a free site with all the triumph Handbooks including the 3sw and has pen and ink images of the spanners http://www.pdfmotomanual.com/index.php?r=site/page&view=manuales&order=t&key=T&make=1966&lang=ENG interestingly no oil can or grease gun ..So i must assume these were army issue ... I believe some of these spanners continued in use well after the war ..but will try and get the un chromed versions as that does appear to be more war pattern finish ...interestingly as the bike is early war 1940 ..it has chrome brake and throttle fittings painted green plus still had rubber Grips ...Triumph were actively using available stocks which were clearly still civilian pattern .. As such if chrome tools were around potentially they could have been issued with the bike ....I was hoping to find an owner with an original toolkit but looks unlikely ... Jenkinov Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jenkinov Posted June 15, 2020 Author Share Posted June 15, 2020 I would like to revisit this topic ..the handbook lists all the tools supplied by triumph with The bike ..firstly does anyone know how these are supplied ..in a triumph toolroll and if so does anyone have one or were the bundled in string ? secondly the toolkit is missing oil cans grease guns et c ..did despatch riders carry these or were they retained at the camp or depot ? Regards Jenkinov Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
79x100 Posted June 16, 2020 Share Posted June 16, 2020 I have no specific knowledge of the Triumph situation but it seems likely that there was a similar practice to the better known kits supplied with Norton, BSA and Royal Enfield....The Ministry of Supply agreed a basic toolkit with the manufacturer which was based on the standard pre-war civilian tools and roll. To this was added a list of extra tools and equipment to scale such as oil cans, where supplied, chain spares, tyre repair kits etc. This situation doesn't seem to have been entirely static. Sometimes these were supplied by the manufacturer, at other times via WD stocks and the contract price adjusted accordingly. I now have three pre- and early-war Norton Spare Parts Lists which include these additional pages. Somewhere around 5 or 10 percent of the books seem to have the extra lists. Without these or a similar insert, it is very difficult to ascertain what should have been included. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welbike Posted June 16, 2020 Share Posted June 16, 2020 Here's the Wesco folding oil can, early ones were silver. When enough interest, I will have the transfers printed again. Cheers, Lex 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
79x100 Posted June 16, 2020 Share Posted June 16, 2020 The AB412 listed all the tools and equipment...This one is BSA M20 but it's clear that most of the additional items were standardised. I wonder if Mark 'Tiger 80' can still be contacted ? He didn't scan the page from his AB412 which shows the tools...maybe it hadn't been completed, but if it has then you'll have the definitive answer. http://hmvf.co.uk/profile/13288-tiger80/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jenkinov Posted June 18, 2020 Author Share Posted June 18, 2020 Gentlemen Thank you for the great feedback , it certainly a good start in building a toolkit for my 3SW I have included a Download i was given of the Triumph 3sw and 5sw handbook which contains the list of parts supplied by Triumph , I will as suggested contact Tiger 80 and see if he can fill in the Gaps on the tool kit supplied by the army Jenkinov triumph-3sw-5sw-instructionsmanual.pdf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
super6 Posted June 20, 2020 Share Posted June 20, 2020 On 1/18/2015 at 1:31 PM, 79x100 said: A military vehicle isn't truly complete without its issue toolkit. This is the WD16H kit (or as close as I've got to it yet)... Where did they carry all of this kit as looks to be quite a lot? What are the leather straps for, saddle bags/panniers? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welbike Posted June 20, 2020 Share Posted June 20, 2020 (edited) Early bikes didn't have the pannier frames and bags yet (they were actually already invented by Norton, but that's another story) so the straps are for securing greatcoat and kit to the small rear carrier, I'm sure Rick will have pictures from that setup, I put some on my January 1940 Enfield. Edited June 20, 2020 by welbike spelling 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rewdco Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 Don't want to hijack this thread, just want to give some inspiration... Here's the WD/RE tool roll: 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rewdco Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 (edited) And here's the Royal Enfield WD/C tool roll and supplementary kit. The tool roll goes in the rectangular toolbox, the supplementary kit was stowed away in the triangular toolbox: Edited June 21, 2020 by rewdco 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jenkinov Posted June 21, 2020 Author Share Posted June 21, 2020 That's a great toolkit I appreciate your attention to detail in 're creating it .that must have taken months of not years to find the correct pieces.. Jenkinov Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
super6 Posted June 22, 2020 Share Posted June 22, 2020 @rewdcoA few questions, What is the soft iron or copper wire for (emergency) HT lead? Where does the supplementary triangular toolkit get stowed? In that triangular toolbox, when stowed, what is the item on the right, a funnel? I'm an electrician but I've never seen insulating tape in a tin, presumably this is a cloth backed bitumas type of tape? Interesting that the fixing for the large toolbox is called a pin, secured with a nut and washer! As above, great attention to detail putting that lot together, thank you for sharing with us Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rewdco Posted June 22, 2020 Share Posted June 22, 2020 I think the wire is for general repairs, plastic straps and ducktape weren't invented yet... The triangular toolbox was fitted at the right hand side of the bike, in the triangular opening of the frame. On the WD/CO, the supplementary kit was stowed away in a similar triangular toolbox on the left hand side of the bike. Indeed, that's a Royal Enfield funnel for topping up the engine oil... The insulating tape is cotton based, impregnated with something bitumen-like... Thanks for the compliment! 😊 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Posted June 22, 2020 Share Posted June 22, 2020 I've always known that old type insulating tape as "Self amalgamating" Ron Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G506 Posted November 19, 2020 Share Posted November 19, 2020 (edited) Inspired by this thread, I've started to put together a Triumph tool kit for display. A question regarding the King Dick adjustable spanner, I believe they were supplied to the WD in 4", 6" and 7" lengths (the lists posted by 79x100 show 7", and thanks for sharing that by the way). So, are the secondary tool kits standard on all bikes, and therefore is 7" the correct size for Triumph? Edited November 19, 2020 by G506 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
79x100 Posted November 23, 2020 Share Posted November 23, 2020 The King Dick type adjustable sizes are nominal. They're usually referred to as 3", 4", 6" and 9"...but in actual fact they were slightly longer. I have a number and don't recall seeing any 7" versions. "F-Type" adjustables though tend to be a true 7"....Did WD replace KD types with "F"s ? If you're looking for one, the 1931 - 1946 type has a closed groove above the nut and the thumbnut itself will be the shorter type (they were lengthened for 1946 due to the the need to find new design novelty aspects after the 15 year registration expired). The additional tools to scale varied based on what the manufacturers were supplying...My feeling is that a 6" / 7" adjustable would have been likely, although I believe that the BSA chaps regard a 4" as correct in their kits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G506 Posted December 1, 2020 Share Posted December 1, 2020 On 11/23/2020 at 6:52 PM, 79x100 said: The King Dick type adjustable sizes are nominal. They're usually referred to as 3", 4", 6" and 9"...but in actual fact they were slightly longer. I have a number and don't recall seeing any 7" versions. "F-Type" adjustables though tend to be a true 7"....Did WD replace KD types with "F"s ? If you're looking for one, the 1931 - 1946 type has a closed groove above the nut and the thumbnut itself will be the shorter type (they were lengthened for 1946 due to the the need to find new design novelty aspects after the 15 year registration expired). The additional tools to scale varied based on what the manufacturers were supplying...My feeling is that a 6" / 7" adjustable would have been likely, although I believe that the BSA chaps regard a 4" as correct in their kits. Many thanks for your reply, and my apologies for the delayed acknowledgement (I've been away with work). That really clears it up, thank you. Now I know exactly what to look for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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