ArtistsRifles Posted February 4, 2015 Author Share Posted February 4, 2015 Will do Richard - soon as it gets warm enough again to hold cold steel :-) Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArtistsRifles Posted February 8, 2015 Author Share Posted February 8, 2015 OK - re-ran the compression test today with throttle wide open. Results were: Cyl1 - 90 psi Cyl 2 - 80 psi Cyl 3 - 0 psi Cyl 4 - 0 psi So now the head is stripped ready for removal when the daughter gets home tomorrow. No sign of damage externally. Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Farrant Posted February 8, 2015 Share Posted February 8, 2015 Gasket could have blown between 3 and 4. I seem to think you had a gasket blow before so head and block surfaces need careful inspection for damage or warping. Also that head is torqued correctly, using the order shown in the manual. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArtistsRifles Posted February 9, 2015 Author Share Posted February 9, 2015 My thoughts exactly Richard. I used the order and torque setting in the book - took it down in 20 Lb/ft steps rather than all in one go. Was that correct? Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Farrant Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 My thoughts exactly Richard. I used the order and torque setting in the book - took it down in 20 Lb/ft steps rather than all in one go. Was that correct? Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk That is what I do, torque in stages. Think you need to look closely at both faces. Also make sure the thread holes are clean with no sealer in the bottom, in case this is preventing bolts tightening correctly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArtistsRifles Posted February 9, 2015 Author Share Posted February 9, 2015 Thanks Richard - will do. :-) Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArtistsRifles Posted February 9, 2015 Author Share Posted February 9, 2015 Life sucks :-( Took the head off today and the headgasket was a god-awful mess Even worse was the state of the head: Plus there seems to be some minor damage to the rear edge of #3 piston. Good news is there is no discernable movement in the pistons but the state of #3 worries me. I don't want to put it all back for more problems to crop up I have a scrap engine I might be able to use the head from - but its been sat outside since 2006 so its internal condition is debatable. If I can't use it I have a major problem called lack of money Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Farrant Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 Neil, you need to pay careful attention to the block top face as if that is burnt then no point just changing a head as it will happen again. Maybe the damage was started before the last gasket blew? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArtistsRifles Posted February 9, 2015 Author Share Posted February 9, 2015 Block face looks - emphasise looks - OK Richard but I will have a closer look tomorrow. It was getting dark time I finished with the head. Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeePig Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 Oh noes, it looks like some kind of detonation and local overheating to nibble away at the piston like that, and unless you have cleaned up the pistons and head they look remarkably clean, almost like they had been shotblasted. Do you think it was running very lean? What did the plugs look like? I would say that the nibbling away on the piston matches the squish area between piston and head. It reminds me of my R&D days trying to get a Norton Wankel rotary to run on diesel, where detonation in the squish zone used to nibble away at the aluminium side plates just like that. I know nothing much about Landies, but one possibility is that the gasket was too thin for flat-top pistons? Are there low compression engines with different pistons that use a different gasket? trevor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArtistsRifles Posted February 10, 2015 Author Share Posted February 10, 2015 Bear in mind its running on unleaded so the old grey nose guide no longer applies - the plugs were a sooty black. Gasket was the right one according to Craddocks....... Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Farrant Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 Are there low compression engines with different pistons that use a different gasket? Trevor, Pistons were all the same but there were two heads, 7:1 and 8:1 as I recall. The 24v FFR equipped 2.25 litre engines suffered from burning across between two cylinders, normally 2 and 3, came from static running. When we had a engine reconditioning line there would always be blocks in the welders shop being built up then bored and sleeved to reclaim. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArtistsRifles Posted February 10, 2015 Author Share Posted February 10, 2015 Can't be static running in this case Richard :-( Is there any way to tell the difference between the two head types?? Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Farrant Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 Can't be static running in this case Richard :-( Is there any way to tell the difference between the two head types?? Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk A large 7 or 8 was stamped on top face of head halfway along, outside of rocker cover area. I forget now what the criteria was, but as we built engines to all kinds of specs, it might have been S2a or 3 or maybe FFR, someone will know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zuffen Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 I'd like to see a straight edge and feeler gauge on the block between 3 & 4 cylinders. It looks a bit rough in there and I can only see decking the block or replacing the block as the correct repair method. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArtistsRifles Posted February 11, 2015 Author Share Posted February 11, 2015 When it stops raining again I will be doing just that! Incidentally, that gasket has also started to fail between #1 and#2 - perhaps the reason for the low CT values in these cylinders... Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zuffen Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 I think you will find the head and/or block (if not both) have passed their use by date. I feel they've failed before and the only solution is open your wallet (I know I hate doing that too!) and fix it right the first time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArtistsRifles Posted February 11, 2015 Author Share Posted February 11, 2015 Only to happy to open the wallet - but all its got are moths :-( Like I said - I 've been out of work 8years during which I footed the bill both for my daughters uni and my own MSc so the reservoirs are now bone dry. I'm an IT specialist (Oracle databases) and at 58 have been told I am now unemployable. But enough of that side of the doom and gloom - this is the photo of the spark plugs with #4 on the left. 1 and 2 look a bit lighter in colour... And this is a close-up of the block between #3 and #4. Looks and feels like carbon build up more than damage - an investigative light scrape with a piece of glass took some of it off. Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArtistsRifles Posted February 15, 2015 Author Share Posted February 15, 2015 This is the scrap engine by the garage - who reckons the head will be salvageable looking at the rust IN the ports??? Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArtistsRifles Posted February 15, 2015 Author Share Posted February 15, 2015 Well - finally got the head off. Hell of a battle getting the head bolts to release being as its not secured :-) First thing noticed was the difference in rockers - they were not removable so far as I can tell and there was a plate bolted on under were the breather cap would be. Once the head was off - and it felt lighter than the other one the extent of the rust damage was evident So I am thinking the best/safest course of action would be to put it into a reconditioners to have new valves fitted and the rust around them machine polished away. But it does look like the head can be used. So now to check the block in the vehicle and lets hope I am lucky and it is just carbon build up. Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeePig Posted February 16, 2015 Share Posted February 16, 2015 The head looks OK, as long as no valve seats or guides need replacing it should not be much of a job. I guess you have set the heads down side by side to make sure there is no practical differences? I will cross all fingers and hope that the block is OK. trevor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArtistsRifles Posted February 17, 2015 Author Share Posted February 17, 2015 Dropped the head off at a enginnering shop today - initial estimate is £50 to strip and clean it then what ever the price of new valaves, guides etc are. They reckon 2 days or so to complete the work. Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArtistsRifles Posted February 18, 2015 Author Share Posted February 18, 2015 Firm rang back this morning - £262.50 inc head gasket set. Paint ordered ready for when it comes back, also the OMD 75 stencil for the rocker. Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArtistsRifles Posted February 22, 2015 Author Share Posted February 22, 2015 Head is now back - and what they forgot to mention was that price was plus the 20% VAT!! Ouch!! But they have done a good job. I left it in the back of the RangeRover as there was no where else to put it, the requirement to change the pistons meaning it cannot go straight back on, and as you can see from the photo's the non-stop rain and general dampness have already taken their toll! So I have permission from the OH (a rare occurrence indeed) to bring it inside to paint and store. If I can find somewhere safe to put it..... So, after clearing a space tomorrow I will clean off the gasket faces and give them a coat of grease or light oil then paint the required areas the normal duck egg blue. Next job - once the bl**dy rain stops - is to drop the sump and remove the pistons so they can be measured and replaced. Might think about changing the bearing shells as well. Got a bad feeling that, once disturbed I will wind up with big end noise rapidly if I refit the existing ones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeePig Posted February 22, 2015 Share Posted February 22, 2015 So I have permission from the OH (a rare occurrence indeed) to bring it inside to paint and store. :shocked: Well, it sounds like you are going to have something to keep you from loafing on the sofa. Are you going to paint the rest of the engine while you are at it? trevor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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