Microns and the size of bits for an average oil filter

[R Cubed]

Hi all, with the engine disassembly of my GMC 270 going well and the questionable wear on pistons / rings, the big ends and mains as a start point :cry: :cry: :cry:

 

( don't mention how frequently I change the oil as I make it a point to do it at the start of every season and use Morris straight 30 )

 

I have been wondering about fitting a modern full flow remote filter, is there anyone out there who knows what the average micron size of modern spin on oil filter can is, or can suggest what they might think it should be ?

 

I might have a damn fine way of fitting a remote filter to a standard engine without the risk of drilling the block stay tuned....

[Stormin]

You mention you ran straight 30w oil rather than a modern detergent multi-grade to suit the by pass filtering of the GMC engine. But when changing the oil did you flush the remaining debris form the sump or remove the sump to clean the system.

 

Non detergent oils and bypass filtration are designed to dump the rubbish in the sump rather than carry it round to the filter, hence the recommendation to regularly clean out the sump. If you are fitting a full flow filter are you going to modify the full oil system to suit, alter by-pass and pressure relief valve? Will you in future be running multi-grade or detergent oil to carry all the debris to the filter?

[R Cubed]

You mention you ran straight 30w oil rather than a modern detergent multi-grade to suit the by pass filtering of the GMC engine. But when changing the oil did you flush the remaining debris form the sump or remove the sump to clean the system.

 

I am sorry to say I have not done either, but in my defence the oil drained has always been debris free, not the best answer I know though. Now the sump is off I have to say there is a lot of sludge in there but it has a hard crusty surface to it so I think it has suffered before I wore it out.

 

Non detergent oils and bypass filtration are designed to dump the rubbish in the sump rather than carry it round to the filter, hence the recommendation to regularly clean out the sump. If you are fitting a full flow filter are you going to modify the full oil system to suit, alter by-pass and pressure relief valve? Will you in future be running multi-grade or detergent oil to carry all the debris to the filter?

 

Yes modifications will be to retain the original bypass oil filter casing to be aesthetically pleasing but not functional, and to cap off the oil feed to the filter, this is all that will be necessary as the oil pump is capable of producing far more than 40 psi which my engine generally ran at so all it will mean is there will be a little more oil flowing thought the oil relief valve back to the sump, just like a modern engine.

[Zero-Five-Two]

Best info on filters probably comes from the individual manufacturers. Fram are very good, and Fleetguard are backed by Cummins. Both have very good websites with plenty of technical help available.

[rbrtcrowther]

Try googeling parker absolout bypass oil filters. Filters like this have been used for years on lorrys. some manufactuers say you can just change the filter and leave the oil in for ages as oil never wears out, It only gets dirty

[Stormin]

Try googeling parker absolout bypass oil filters. Filters like this have been used for years on lorrys. some manufactuers say you can just change the filter and leave the oil in for ages as oil never wears out, It only gets dirty

 

Oil never wears out! Cobblers!

 

The long chain molecules break down over time and it becomes less effective. No matter how fine the filter it won't remove water from condensation in the oil. It won't remove petrol or diesel that has seeped past the rings on cold starts from the oil. It also won't remove acids that form as a result of the combustion process.

 

Modern oils are far better at resisting these contaminants and modern engines are far better at reducing them but you're never going to stop it. Synthetic oils are widely advertised as being good for 30 to 50 thousand miles in modern cars, I'd rather someone else tried that than me. 10K miles max between oil changes for me on my modern motors and less on the old stuff.

 

You cannot beat regular oil changes for preserving an engine. The oil is at it's best the day you re-fill the engine with fresh and simply degrades every day from thereon.

[R Cubed]

Best info on filters probably comes from the individual manufacturers. Fram are very good, and Fleetguard are backed by Cummins. Both have very good websites with plenty of technical help available.

 

Thanks, had a look on the above sites and it seems to be 20 microns is the norm probably much much better than the 10% an hour of the old system. Seen some nice UCC filter heads in Hypehose also have bypass indicators on them too to indicate when filter is getting blocked.:cool2:

[Grasshopper]

We get 40,000miles between oil changes in diesel multiple units using a 5W40 oil. The engines can be running up to 20 hrs per day. We also use Parker (Racor) filtration for the standard filter and also have centrifugal filters fitted. I believe the Russians were big fans of centrifugal oil filters, my old Zil131 had one.

 

We also monitor the oil by way of sampling, and change on condition if required.

[rbrtcrowther]

Thats sort of what i was getting at........ Hey ho......

[Stormin]

We get 40,000miles between oil changes in diesel multiple units using a 5W40 oil. The engines can be running up to 20 hrs per day. We also use Parker (Racor) filtration for the standard filter and also have centrifugal filters fitted. I believe the Russians were big fans of centrifugal oil filters, my old Zil131 had one.

 

We also monitor the oil by way of sampling, and change on condition if required.

 

I believe the Land Rover TD5 engines also use the centrifugal oil filtering method to great effect and the engines tend to achieve great mileages as a result. I believe the sevice interval on these engines was still in the order of 10-12000 miles though.

 

The fact that the engines in DMY's run twenty hours per day helps the oil life as a lot of the contamination comes from cold starts condensation and piston blowby contamination. Keeping an engine at operating temperature for as long as possible is desirable as a lot of this contamination can actually be evaporated out of the hot oil.

 

Most cars and certainly most peoples military vehicles don't operate in anywhere near these ideal conditions.

 

Whilst I accept that modern sythetic oils are far superior to past products I'm not convinced they're the miracle product that the manufacturers would have us believe. Recent experince with undue wear on my road car despite more than regular oil changes is part of my reasoning for this.

[N.O.S.]

You can hear the centrifuge on a Scania 8 litre engine filter spinning like a turbo after shut down :cool2:

[rbrtcrowther]

 

http://www.blackstone-labs.com/by-pass-oil-filtration.php There you go Mr Cube a little more info for you to chew over......

[Giles]

You can hear the centrifuge on a Scania 8 litre engine filter spinning like a turbo after shut down :cool2:

 

And on my Tombraider Defender TD5. Just remember to clean/replace the centrifuge as recommended.

 

My Peugeot 205 diesel has done 235,000 miles. I bought it new in '88. Changed oil every 5000 miles or every school holidays. Also friction reducer added every 25000 after the first service. Uses about 1 litre between oil changes.

[Amphibi boy]

The L.R. Td5 has 2 filters, a rotory and a normal spin on. The spin on has a habbit of coming loose, and is a swine to get to on some models, unless you have a slim filter strap. So you td5 drivers,keep a check on these! .The rotory sits in its housing, then the top is bolted down with a "o" ring seal, its common that the bolts are overtightened, and strips the threads, its only soft ally. .We used to have lots of customers saying "my turbo seems to make a whinning noise when i switch off the engine, is it normal" no its your filter! So many would not believe you until you showed them one on an opened one. .Going back to the original post, what about placing a remote filter somewhere out of site? You have the advantage of modern filtering, but its hidden out of view? .cheers shaun

[R Cubed]

http://www.blackstone-labs.com/by-pass-oil-filtration.php There you go Mr Cube a little more info for you to chew over......

 

mmmmm chew chew........

 

Seems that the ordinary full flow filters like those on modern cars seem to filter to about 20 microns.

So I am going to get a remote head and spin on cartridge filter and also retain the bypass filter as standard fitment to GMC's so hopefully get the best of both worlds.

 

Thanks