79x100

Tom, there are very slight differences in the press work underneath WD16H tanks but it is a unique 'flat-bottomed' tank with only a small dome in order to make it possible to remove the sparking plug. They're quite distinctive. Look out too for the presence of the inflator mounts. Not a major problem to fabricate if they're missing (which they often are) but a nuisance if you weren't planning a re-paint. Don't focus too much on the tank though. There were three or four roughish ones at Kempton Park last month around the £100 mark. As I mentioned on another forum (I think), genuine forks are a much bigger concern. Indian forks have mild steel tubes and cast iron lugs. They do not follow best practice and have not been tested in any meaningful way. A set of genuine forks will cost you at least £600 plus the cost of reconditioning which brings with it a waiting list....Duff forks will spoil your summer.

This is Khaki Green No.3 on an area which had been formed an airtight compartment on the back of the brake drum on my '39 16H. The colour oxidises as well as fades and was quite a goose-shit green when unexposed. and less brown than it often appears on older samples. It is characteristic of the colour that it can pass through many shades of green and brown depending on lighting, angle and adjacent objects. Bearing in mind the fragmentation damage to the bike, there is a good chance that this is original 1940s mud too :-)

Thank you so much for the helpful reply and detailed photographs. I'm glad to hear that you haven't sold the Norton. I thought that I saw it on 'Le Bon Coin' a year or two ago. It's one of the very best early-war WD16Hs in the world....The February 1940 component dates sound correct. Delivery of the contract commenced on 4/3/1940 and I'd suspect that yours, as the 931st built would have been one of the 86 machines received by Royal Ordnance, Chilwell on Wednesday 3rd April 1940. There are some other aspects that I'd like to query with you and I'll send you a 'personal message' if that's OK. This photograph of C4153065 is the closest that I have to your number C4153099.

Is that the Norton which was restored by Thierry Simon ? (I believe that he sold it ? ) Almost certainly one left in France in 1940. Would it be possible to share a close up high resolution image of the voltage regulator box ? I'm researching the dates and styles. Thanks.

Have you removed and cleaned the jet block thoroughly ? A blocked pilot will often cause stalling. The choke can disguise this. I see that you were having the same problem with the previous carb, three years ago...Sorry if this is a suck-eggs situation, but you are operating the choke correctly, aren't you ? Tight wire = choke off, slack wire = choke on so lever needs to be pulled back towards you after starting.

Computerisation began in the early 1970s so by the the time the paper records were destroyed, this vehicle had not been taxed for more than ten years. The paper records were held by local authorities and there would have been a significant cost for securely storing the cards...which would have been a thieves charter if made public. This sort of decision regarding public records is made all the time. There is also little doubt that DVLA were aware of the abuses going on at the time with number plate dealers and were desperate to draw a line under it. Tax discs have not been acceptable as sole evidence of entitlement for some years. They do not actually identify a vehicle....If it's not on the DVLA computer with chassis number then it's really a case of finding the old 'buff' log book or nothing.

YCF was an early 1964 Suffolk (West) registration. (They were one of the areas that didn't use the 'A' suffix, I believe). Unfortunately, there don't seem to be any surviving records but these are unlikely anyway to have provided a link between chassis number and registration. During the late 1970s, Swansea decided to definitively put any surviving vehicles on their computer record and there was extensive advertising to enable vehicle owners to do just that. Unfortunately, many didn't and after the exercise was over, the local authorities who held the paper records were instructed to destroy them. Most did, but one or two with devoted archivists held on to the records. I've never seen any evidence to suggest that Swansea have sold or re-issued non current numbers although local authorities sometimes used to. A shame really that the transfer of numbers has ever been allowed.

According to Associated Press in Berlin, the '¨Propaganda Omnibus' was brought into use on 14th August 1939...This image and caption was saved from eBay. At least it's a clearer photo.

The explanation for the apparent registration number anomally is contained in Les Newall's book. The pre-war MM series are a bit all over the place anyway as some were Government but the majority were reserved for the car dealer Stewart & Ardern and therefore spread over a longer period than might have been expected. The 'CMM' series, CMM 2 - CMM 999, was issued for WD vehicles commencing May 1935 of these, CMM 800 - CMM 999 were allocated to armoured vehicles. The crucial aspect here is that the post-war Glasses Guides carried no mention of the WD number blocks, only civilian issue. Apparently in 1952, when Middlesex ran short of numbers, the decision was taken to re-issue numbers allocated to armour, including CMM 800 - 999 and these were used again from July 1952 - January 1953. It was only done with armour as it was considered that there was no prospect of them still existing and requiring road registration. Some pre-war 'B' vehicles had entered the civilian market still with their original numbers and with no central computer record, the risk could not be taken that there were duplicate numbers in use. Glasses Guide picked up on the 1950s re-issues and having no record of the 1930s issue, stated slightly incorrectly that these were 1950s numbers and in the case of CMM failed to document that it was only 800 - 999 anyway. CMM 275 was an early Morris-Commercial and CMM 754 was the MEE test model of the Norton WD 16H which can be dated exactly. (CMM 749 was a Matchless)

Thanks very much for sharing those details. 522 'missing' Norton frame numbers can now be allocated to a contract and some light shone on others. I too would be fascinated to see any earlier editions.

That's the spirit 🙂

Vinyl-covered cables first appeared in the early-to mid-1950s. If you're looking for authenticity (and in my opinion as a fully paid-up rivet counter, it does make a big difference to the period looks) then you'll have to go the route of using shellac-coated linen-covered Bowden outers. It is still possible to find NOS lengths if you look hard...sometimes boxed for other WD motorcycles etc. There is no problem in using modern inner wires but you will have to be proficient in soldering cables as there are no commercial sources of ready-made cables.

Ron, you really should go off-roading with the SWD Big 4. I'm an experienced passenger who doesn't mind getting muddy Just give me a shout 🙂

Steve knows that I'm knowledgeable. So does Ron actually. Both of them are aware that later-war 2-strokes aren't really my thing but perhaps appreciate that the hundreds of hours I spend researching in archives assists in the understanding and appreciation of historic military motorcycles. I promise not to annoy you on the Civvy Stinkwheel Forum though.

If the motorcycle section of this forum was moderated for military content then no, you probably wouldn't be able to get on with posting. I have a Norton Commando. is the name enough to make it military ?

You don't need a functioning charging system to run the bike and the French daytime headlight law only applies to post-1965...I'd bet that a third of the bikes on the campsite won't have dynamos that work ! Don't let it spoil your holiday 🙂

January 1940-dated and with the mica illumination window. Definitely not expensive. It looks identical to the 11/39 instrument that was on my 16H as found.

I've edited my comments above as I've been back to look at my correspondence from the time and my recollection wasn't completely correct. Dave Tann told me that his glasses are 193mm but that he has supplied some at 195mm...which he thought may have been for car applications. The WD parts book refers to the glass for the DU142 being numbered NG13/4 which is what appears on both the (different coloured) paper envelopes that I have. Diameter is referred to as 7 13/16” This seems to equate to 7.8125” which converts to 198.4mm

I had the same problem Ron and I have a couple of originals here to compare with. The response was one of having supplied several and not previously had a complaint. We had some discussion about sizes but I rather let it drop. I probably should have pursued it as it is a bit of a rattling fit but mine was an experiment to apply BEF blackout paints to. Regrettably, I don't think that he has the correct size for the 7½" DU142. The response wasn't what I'd expected to be honest.

Is the glass one of the commercial replicas ? How did it seem, size-wise ? There is something odd going on with the wire 'W' clips. They shouldn't be visible as they should be holding the reflector from the rear.

Just to confirm, the Triumph was delivered to RASC Vehicle Reserve Depot at Slough and the first (and only) transfer was to 3rd C.T.A.C. (3rd Corps Troops Ammunition Company) RASC. on 13th January 1940. Your grandfather must have gone to France sooner than the main body though as 3 Corps Amn. Coy. didn't go to France until 4rd April. They took 46 motorcycles at that time.

Mark, Fantastic stuff. It looks as if, during his time with the BEF that he was 3 Corps Troops Ammunition Company who would have displayed the Corps fig leaf sign and an arm of service sign comprising the figure '40' on RASC red over green diagonal with white corps bar above. 3 Corps were responsible for the units rotated on the Saar (Maginot Line) and the date on the palm cross indicates that your grandfather was there prior to 51st Division arriving, to whom he was then attached. Jan (Rewdco' s) Enfield WD/C (also an RASC machine) was found close to Metz and he marked it as 51st Div RASC. In the mid-ground here is a 3 Corps Triumph 3SW with a serial begining C39177** - Not your grandfather's though as it still has the tax disc holder. I do like your Triumph advert by the way. Pretty sure Ron will be making himself one of those shortly 🙂 It certainly adds to the impression that C4631 were pretty much standard civilian production.

The 3SW was an RASC vehicle under the earlier system which had them responsible for their own vehicles and for other 2nd line units. The V.R.D. (Vehicle Reserve Depot) at Slough was one of the major distribution points. There is a good chance that C3917745 is somewhere along the rows in one of these photos. We can be pretty sure now that these photos were taken at Slough, and not the other big depot at Feltham. A definite documentary link between frame, engine and serial numbers is a rare and useful thing to have. Would there be any chance of scanning and posting the documents that you have ?

No-one has mentioned the OGEL yet, but it seems unlikely that the France exemption will continue to apply and prior to the acceptance of open borders, there was a considerable difference between vehicles being driven or ridden internationally and those being carried as cargo. Motor vehicles being exported will be subject to the full paper-chase both to make it acceptable to the country being visited who will then have to document departure and of course provide proof on re-entry to the UK to avoid having to go through a NOVA procedure. In the event of 'no deal', things will not simply go back to how they were in the 1970s, there were agreements in force at that time and there is no time left to re-instate them. It will be more akin to exporting to Albania in the 1960s. If the UK really does crash out at the end of March, then I wouldn't bank on being able to take an MV to France just over two months later. The ending of the EHIC will mean that it is essential to have medical insurance and to have told insurers about medical history and any pre-existing conditions. But hey-ho, such is progress.

The Triumph Club need to put some work into a factory records database, as the Norton Club did some years ago. It's not 100% as it relied on volunteers reading seventy-year old cursive handwriting, but it's a starting point. The general system is that parts such as gearboxes were stockpiled and there was no talk of first in - first out . The VMCC at Burton have the post-1941 factory records available on microfilm. There is nothing to stop you going there and putting in the time yourself. They've got all the wartime magazines etc. in bound volumes too. Well worth a couple of days.