Jump to content
demon

Royal Enfield WD/CO transmission leak

Recommended Posts

I picked up my new Royal Enfield 350 WD/CO today.. Started and ran fine when I inspected it before I parted with the money.

When I got it home I tried starting it with a wee bit of trouble (probably due to inexperience of owning a classic bike) finally got her running but she has developed an oil leak from the kick start.. See attached picture.

 

My question is how much of an arse ache is it to replace this seal? I'm presuming it is transmission out and complete strip down?

 

Also I have a fuel leak from the bottom of the carb.. I'll take a picture of that tomorrow when I'm in the workshop. And ask the relevant questions regarding parts etc.

image.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There's no seal as such. The kick start shaft runs in a metal bush (I can't remember if it's steel or bronze) This bush has probably worn and possibly the shaft also. You can remove the kick start and inner covers with the box in the frame. A good engineer will be able to make a new bush, pressed in and honed/reamed matched to your shaft.........Again from memory, the nut on the end of the main shaft might be left hand thread. Too cold to go to the shed to check my manual. Ron

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A range of bronze bushes can be bought from http://www.bearingboys.co.uk/

 

Once pressed in it will of course need reaming.

 

Diana

 

 

There's no seal as such. The kick start shaft runs in a metal bush (I can't remember if it's steel or bronze) This bush has probably worn and possibly the shaft also. You can remove the kick start and inner covers with the box in the frame. A good engineer will be able to make a new bush, pressed in and honed/reamed matched to your shaft.........Again from memory, the nut on the end of the main shaft might be left hand thread. Too cold to go to the shed to check my manual. Ron

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Cool thanks I have a good engineer who can sort that once I've stripped it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The 276 type carbs with separate float chambers do have rather a lot of places to leak from. It's probably a good idea to obtain a set of seals and washers and give it a good going over. Joint faces etc. should be clean and free from burrs or distortion.

 

One of the major causes of leaks is dirt in the float chamber - it doesn't take much as the needle seals metal-to-metal and the buoyancy of the copper floats is borderline. If the level rises too far, it will overflow via the mixing chamber.

 

If you haven't worked on this type of carb before, it would be a good idea to ask for step by step advice. It's possible to case quite a lot of damage by attempting to remove the jet block using too much force.

 

You'll get used to it all. After a riding season of onwnership you'll be able to strip an Amal blindfolded !

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

On closer inspection it turns out the oil leak is coming from the clutch push rod.

What's the process for this job?

 

Thanks for the carb advice.. It looks like it's leaking from where float bowl attaches to the carb body.

I'll order a carb rebuild kit.

image.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Good old royal oil-leak, my father used to say he could sell the oil rights to the Arabs for where I used to park mine in the garden :-)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Has it been over-filled ? I don't know Albion boxes (and I don't want to !) but clutch pushrod height seems quite high to be the oil level in a countershaft box.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

To be fair I'm not sure... I've been working on a car today so not had time to check the oil level. Is there a dip stick or is it checked through filler?

 

When checking the level for the engine and gear box should the bike be sat on both wheels or on its rear stand?

 

I ask as on it's rear stand it raises the rear and tips the bike forward. I checked the engine oil on its stand and the dip stick shows its over filled.

 

Is there an oil filter, if so where is it?

 

What oil does the engine use?

 

I presume the gearbox is EP90 as it smell like gear oil?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I wouldn't risk EP oil in these old boxes. Extreme Pressure oils have properties that can have an adverse effect on bronze bushes.

Best use straight 50 or 90. You can't really overfill them as you just fill to the level plug on the back of the box.

 

I've found 'Hitchcocks' to be one of the best firms for parts. Dead easy to order from their on line parts books, next day delivery. It might be a good idea to invest in a manual.

 

http://www.hitchcocksmotorcycles.com/books-manuals-workshop

 

Ron

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Cheers Ron the manual is on my list. I think to over fill it, it'd need to be filled on its side stand. I'll check it out today and I'll be onto hitchcocks tomorrow for a manual and carb rebuild kit too.

Edited by demon

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Oil level is fine...

 

It only leaks when the engine is running. Manual ordered so hopefully and exploded view of the gearbox will shed some light on what's in there.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It sounds like you need a sealed bearing in the inner cover. When I last did a few boxes, I asked Hitchcocks about sealed bearings but they only did open bearings (They did say it was a good idea and now they stock them). I got some sealed bearings off the net and fitted those on both sides and they've never leaked a drop. I have to check there's oil in there just to be sure I put it in!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Many thanks Chris that sounds like the issue I have.

 

Can I remove that cover and replace the bearing without removing and stripping the box or is it box out and strip?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You can do it in situ if your careful.

 

Before you do though, check the level of your engine oil and primary chain case. I have heard of wet dumping engines forcing the oil Out of the drive side engine bearing into the primary chain case and filling that. If that oil built up enough I suppose it could find its way down the main gearbox shaft and out of the other end.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I had this problem with the engine running and transmission oil leaking from the gear box through the shaft and out, it dribbled out faster dependent on the speed/revving . However in the end I had the help of Ray Tew who worked at Hitchcock's previously. My fault was there is a type of Archimedes screw for oil to on the shaft if I recall, there had been a batch made incorrectly Ray told me and this pumped oil out of the gear box; or it could possibly be worn, it was replaced and the problem was solved. Hitchcock's (Alan) has Ray's number if you need any more information. Just a thought!

 

There isn't much Ray don't know about Royal Enfield's.

 

http://www.realclassic.co.uk/enfieldcontinental.html

Edited by Enfield 42

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Cheers guys there's a few possible causes to investigate. I spoke to Dave 2 at Hitchcock's the other day and he also suggested checking the oil level in the primary chain case first. I know the engine oil has been over filled so maybe that been done too. No harm in checking everything I can before I start to pull it apart.

 

Carb rebuild kit has arrived so thats another job to do too.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've removed the casing today for a closer look. The clutch rod (see picture below) has some moment from side to side.

 

Should this be a snug fit?

 

Should there be a gasket between the cover and the gearbox? There was some silicon sealant between the two and around the clutch rod opening.

image.jpg

image.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If there was a significant amount of oil inside that outer cover? It's probably as Chris has already suggested and coming through the mainshaft bearing. That bearing is well above the oil level and is fed by the gears picking up the oil and leakage is kept to a reasonable minimum by a simple steel shield/thrower.

 

From my experience it's usually the kick start bush that leaks and especially as it's down near the oil level. If you decided to take the inner cover off, the nut on the end of the mainshaft is L/H thread and if you fit one of those sealed bearings (good idea) I would remove the lipped seal from the inside. I usually fit these to the drive end as a matter of course during any gearbox rebuild.

 

I doubt the push-rod is worn enough to give a problem, but easy to just pull it out for inspection/measuring. Ron

Edited by Ron

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Oil leak located... With the engine running you can see the leak from behind the washer on the main shaft and not from the the push rod.

Once the washer is removed you can see it's an open bearing and this is where the oil is coming from.

 

So a sealed bearing should solve this problem. I presume this is a gear box out fix?

image.jpg

image.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well that bearing is absolutely shagged anyway ! The oil looks like mayonnaise so it's not surprising that it has rusted.

 

The oil level still looks too high to me, if the height of the filler is related to the mainshaft bearing.

 

Bearing (sorry !) in mind the seriousness of a seized gearbox on a motorcycle, my preference is always to strip and check the box on an unknown machine. With new bearings and bushes all round, you'll have peace of mind.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes the milkiness indicates it's got water in there somehow, and maybe hence the high level. ... Has A previous owner been wading? You don't need to remove the whole box, you can take that cover off with the box in the frame. Ron

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yep there is moisture in the oil for sure... I'll get onto Hitchcocks for the parts needed but I have a 69 Cougar in the workshop that's got to be finished before I can really get stuck into this job.

 

Fingers crossed I'll have some news in the next few weeks for you.

 

Thanks for all your input guys I'm sure I'll be a sing for more as I learn about old motorbikes.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...