centi521 Posted May 22, 2009 Share Posted May 22, 2009 what did you think ? is the m113 better than the fv432 or not ? i think m113 is better then his faster, lighter , can better swim , better engine, i don't now if the fv432 can behind the whole wall or only a door can open. the m113 is the successful tank (and in more wars). the question based only of the basic version ( without turred or mortar.) now , what do you think ? ^^ :-D M113.jpg 800px-20050626-006-FV-432.jpg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grasshopper Posted May 22, 2009 Share Posted May 22, 2009 Isn't M113 made of aluminium? 432 would offer better protection? Also the 432 looks like it can carry more troops. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
centi521 Posted May 22, 2009 Author Share Posted May 22, 2009 m113 can 2 + 11 fv432 can 2 + 10 one point more for the m113 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
protacman Posted May 22, 2009 Share Posted May 22, 2009 i've used both I own a 432,in case i'm accused of bias....... 432 has better protection,similiar mobility,but harder to service, track system is similiar. I've seen mikes get hit with rpg's and they just burn, til your left with rollers and pack. Seating, in Israel the seats were moved to the centreline, back to back. Kit storage was built up over the tracks, helping to stop spalling injuries. Based on my own experiance and barrack stories I'd rather use a 432. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
centi521 Posted May 22, 2009 Author Share Posted May 22, 2009 i've used bothI own a 432,in case i'm accused of bias....... 432 has better protection,similiar mobility,but harder to service, track system is similiar. I've seen mikes get hit with rpg's and they just burn, til your left with rollers and pack. Seating, in Israel the seats were moved to the centreline, back to back. Kit storage was built up over the tracks, helping to stop spalling injuries. Based on my own experiance and barrack stories I'd rather use a 432. you have a m113 ? in which price range are they trading ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulob1 Posted May 23, 2009 Share Posted May 23, 2009 the new reengined bulldog does 44mph, stops like a tank should do and certainyl should not be floating in water....it has steel armour which does not burn, but it will still cook up if hit...and it is a sweet ride.... Perhaps if the M113 was any good it would not have been replaced so readily ( not a great argument I know) and although the Bulldog is determined as a bit boring it is a great low profile box for carrying infantry men to a place of war and with the new engine and steering box, faster more reliable and bloody great off road... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Farrant Posted May 23, 2009 Share Posted May 23, 2009 Perhaps if the M113 was any good it would not have been replaced so readily ( not a great argument I know) As there were 80,000 M113 vehicles produced and used in many forces around the world and the FV432 production was about 3,000, it must have been good at its job and is still in use. The FV432 was due to have been replaced by now, but an upgrade is surely only a stop gap, or money saving move? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fadedsun Posted June 28, 2009 Share Posted June 28, 2009 m113. 80,000 plus made Better weapons suite (Adaptable from heavy cannons to machine guns to mortars etc), better engine, and floats. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoelH Posted June 30, 2009 Share Posted June 30, 2009 From the perspective of which is nicer to drive. I can say by far the M113 is by far nicer to drive. The drop down ramps of the M113 make for a nice display for shows etc... I doubt you would find a M113 for sale. Also there is another major point, the 432 is full of lumps on the top of it, the M113 is a great deal less-cluttered on the top, making walking along the top of the vehicle in low-light conditions a great deal easier. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lightweight Posted June 30, 2009 Share Posted June 30, 2009 80,000 plus made So why is the market not loaded with them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sirhc Posted June 30, 2009 Share Posted June 30, 2009 The Americans won't let anyone own US armour. Some did come up for sale in New Zeland, but they had to cancel the sale and cut them up instead. They end up like this... Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lightweight Posted June 30, 2009 Share Posted June 30, 2009 What a shame, would love an Aussie one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EMacionga Posted July 2, 2009 Share Posted July 2, 2009 I would think that many of them were surplused out to other countries. But more and more of them have ended up in front of National Guard Armories and museums after being phased-out (for the most part) by the M3/M4 Bradley after the 1980s. The 113 and even the ITV swim well! I have used them in amphibious operations during my service. they take on water no matter how well you grease and tighten down the belly plates, but they do have a bilge-pump. Ed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fadedsun Posted July 6, 2009 Share Posted July 6, 2009 So why is the market not loaded with them? They are still in use! The US military is the largest user of the m113. When ours are done they are scrapped, not resold to the private market like Britain ( sigh :cry: ) Nearly every single nation in the world that has armoured vehicles has an m113. Jordan, Pakistan, Israel, Egypt, Iraq, Iran, Syria, Georgia, Turkey.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B85 Posted July 9, 2009 Share Posted July 9, 2009 I think I am going to be SICK! My tax dollars at work! :shake: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shakey985 Posted July 9, 2009 Share Posted July 9, 2009 We have cut ours up as well to make this The old M113 was very user friendly, easy to drive and easy to maintain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulob1 Posted July 10, 2009 Share Posted July 10, 2009 fv 432 isnt easy to maintain, well actually it is if you let someone else do it.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EMacionga Posted July 10, 2009 Share Posted July 10, 2009 We used to change road wheels with a one-peice device called a "dog bone" - a peice of metal about one and a half foot long, inch and a half thick shaped like an opened end wrench. One would lie under the vehicle:sweat: and the driver (with hopefully a very good ground guide) would back over you and the dog bone would ideally pop upright jacking the bogie in the air. It was also possible to jump start this vechicle using seven strands of commo wire with the ends stripped. The trick was to start it up before the plastic melted. One had to have nerves since electrical tingles were creeping up the arms long before that time. :shake: Ahh! when we were young and dumb, etc. Ed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sirhc Posted July 10, 2009 Share Posted July 10, 2009 A 432 is easy to maintain, you can lift the pack in 20 mins and everything you need to service is right there. The only problem is you need a crane! Wheels/tracks etc are no more hard work than any tracked vehicle, keep the nuts tight and eveything full of oil or grease. The 'dog bone' you mention is a jacking strut, there is one for the 432, but here's one at work on a CVRT. Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fadedsun Posted July 10, 2009 Share Posted July 10, 2009 (edited) A 432 is easy to maintain, you can lift the pack in 20 mins and everything you need to service is right there. The only problem is you need a crane! Wheels/tracks etc are no more hard work than any tracked vehicle, keep the nuts tight and eveything full of oil or grease. The 'dog bone' you mention is a jacking strut, there is one for the 432, but here's one at work on a CVRT. Chris We have the same thing on the AAV. The biggest problem on the aav is that it takes two Marines to do anything engine related..you need 2 to lift the front 'hood' (called plenums, they hold the hydraulic system that shuts the air intake for water ops and the air cooling system) which weighs close to 2000 lbs. It has a spring to assist in opening though, so it's not THAT bad. Edited July 10, 2009 by fadedsun Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plainmilitary Posted July 15, 2009 Share Posted July 15, 2009 By far the FV430 range is the best vehicle. It has forefilled just about every roll with-in the British Army and is still going. It has been everthing from a missile launcher (Swingfire), Artillery gun (Abbot) Coms, Medivac, APC, recovery, Mine layer, Mortar. It is well protected, non of this lightweight Ally stuff. The next generation is just as awsome, the Bulldog is a much up-graded vehicle. From the outside it looks almost the same but dig a bit deeper and the up-grade unfolds before your eyes. Bulldog can carry all types of weapon. Mortar, 7.62 GPMG, 50cal either single or double and of late the new RWS. So for me, I think the FV432 is the best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Elsdon Posted July 19, 2009 Share Posted July 19, 2009 When i was out in Sarajevo with the UN, our bug out plan from UNPROFOR HQ in the event it all went horribly wrong, involved two Danish operated M113's, we Exercised continuity of operation, and would pile into the M113's with the Danish boys, who had .50 Cals as top cover. One of the sites we used for operating was also the base for the British Cymbeline troop, they had the Cymbeline Radar, which located the bad guys mortar and artillery positions, and that was mounted on the FV432. So there you have it, a rambling involving both vehicles! Actually thinking about it, it was a pretty weird setup, Brits operating Clansman and COTS radios which we fitted into an American built APC operated by the Danish for the UN. That would make for an interesting MV show vehicle, it would give the originality freaks a melt down! COTS = Commercial Off The Shelf. As for the original question, I quite liked the M113, mainly because it was alot better than a Land Rover, given the conditions :cool2:. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WCMatt Posted June 6, 2014 Share Posted June 6, 2014 As previously stated, the Americans won't release any of their AFVs to the civilian world. M113s (or any other AFV) doled out in aid packages to other countries come with a demil clause that requires the end user to cut 'em up when they're done with them. The Italians purchased a manufacturer's license to build M113s in Italy. I wonder if A: the Italians have a similar attitude towards surplusing out AFVs or B: Can the Italian built M113s be surplused out (or imported into the US)? There are a few M113s in private hands but certainly more FV432s have made the leap from Military to Civilian ownership. I wouldn't kick either off of the parking pad for leaking oil.....:cool2: Matt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lauren Child Posted June 7, 2014 Share Posted June 7, 2014 Aren't the tracked rapier and M548cargo/resupply based on the M113? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WCMatt Posted June 7, 2014 Share Posted June 7, 2014 Aren't the tracked rapier and M548cargo/resupply based on the M113? the M548 is but not 100% sure about the rapier (sure looks like it, though). Interestingly, the M548s also come with a demil requirment (unless something's changed in the last couple of years). Matt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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