DafT 244 Posted June 29, 2014 Share Posted June 29, 2014 Hi! I have now bypassed the fuel tank in case there is a blockage stopping fuel getting to the pump.... At least have found fuel pump is ok, it now primes with some resistance on the lever.....however, the fitting on the return pipe (flexy to steel pipe) starts to leak when I'm priming it....Traced flexy pipe up to a 1/8" pipe just under cylinder head...this is fed by a 'T' piece from 2 places, 1, from leak off on the injectors and 2, from the top of the lift pump. Does the fuel cut off solenoid valve (electric) bypass the fuel from the lift pump/injectors and back to the fuel tank? If this is the case, it would explain the starting problem! If it is stuck in its 'stop position' where do I go from here? TIA Gaz.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 johnwardle Posted June 30, 2014 Share Posted June 30, 2014 Firstly, there is no fuel cut off solenoid, the fuel cut off is cable operated, is the stop cable pushed in fully? Secondly if you have bled the fuel system have you loosened the injector piped to purge the air from them? Just loosen the pipes at the injectors, turn it over on the key until diesel spurts out them re tighten the injector pipes then it should start. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 DafT 244 Posted June 30, 2014 Author Share Posted June 30, 2014 Firstly, there is no fuel cut off solenoid, the fuel cut off is cable operated, is the stop cable pushed in fully? Secondly if you have bled the fuel system have you loosened the injector piped to purge the air from them? Just loosen the pipes at the injectors, turn it over on the key until diesel spurts out them re tighten the injector pipes then it should start. Thanks for the reply John, it looks like I will have to give that a go! Cheers! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 Tony B Posted June 30, 2014 Share Posted June 30, 2014 Once the injectors are loose and fuel is spurting, whilst the engine is still turning over, then tighten up the injector. That should get it to fire I had an old engine that would only start by towing after bleeding, only a few feet but from then on no problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 DafT 244 Posted June 30, 2014 Author Share Posted June 30, 2014 Once the injectors are loose and fuel is spurting, whilst the engine is still turning over, then tighten up the injector. That should get it to fire I had an old engine that would only start by towing after bleeding, only a few feet but from then on no problem. Thanks John and Tony! There is one small problem with trying this option.. Unless I can rig up a remote starter cable/switch! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 Tony B Posted June 30, 2014 Share Posted June 30, 2014 (edited) Another trick, take off the fuel cap and wrap an airline in rag which you then stuff into the filler and pressure the tank, doesn't need to be much but garuntees fuel gets through. An odd thought, there isn't a paticular set of steps for bleeding is there? Some engines need say 5 pushes of the throttle then turn over and push pedal 5 more times. May be worth giving a local dealer a ring. (Or the bodge way, get a lot of cans of Easy start and just keep squirting and swearing) This method is TOTALLY banned to our Bus Engineers, so they use brake claener sprays. Edited June 30, 2014 by Tony B Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 DafT 244 Posted June 30, 2014 Author Share Posted June 30, 2014 Another trick, take off the fuel cap and wrap an airline in rag which you then stuff into the filler and pressure the tank, doesn't need to be much but guarantees fuel gets through. An odd thought, there isn't a particular set of steps for bleeding is there? Some engines need say 5 pushes of the throttle then turn over and push pedal 5 more times. May be worth giving a local dealer a ring. (Or the bodge way, get a lot of cans of Easy start and just keep squirting and swearing) This method is TOTALLY banned to our Bus Engineers, so they use brake cleaner sprays. Hi Tony, now the airline option I can have a go at! Got a compressor and enough hose to reach the street! The only thing I can find is, it says in the drivers 'manual' to press accelerator pedal and keep it to the floor when starting... I think what I'll do tomorrow is crack the banjo's on all the injectors while priming, and then give it a whirl! Many thanks! Gaz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 johnwardle Posted June 30, 2014 Share Posted June 30, 2014 Thanks John and Tony!There is one small problem with trying this option.. [ATTACH=CONFIG]93629[/ATTACH] Unless I can rig up a remote starter cable/switch! You don't need a remote starter cable, I just open the door with the cab tilted push the throttle pedal down with my left hand and turn the key with my right hand. No easy start needed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 DafT 244 Posted June 30, 2014 Author Share Posted June 30, 2014 You don't need a remote starter cable, I just open the door with the cab tilted push the throttle pedal down with my left hand and turn the key with my right hand. No easy start needed. Hi John, will see if I can get the door fully open with the wall where it is (It's right up against it!) and, have already been warned about easy start on here! Cheers and thanks! Gaz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 DafT 244 Posted June 30, 2014 Author Share Posted June 30, 2014 BTW, have ordered a new sedimentor to replace the one I broke, from X-Mod! It's the clear body one and going by the pics, my original one didn't have any internal bits! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 m109a3uk Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 Most faults with these are the fuelline couplings they are brass with an o ring inside that perishes x mod sell them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 Tony B Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 Yes and when you change the end fittings. Make sure you put the pipes on the pumps the right way round! Just been head banging for an hour after changing the lift pump on my Disco. Came to the conclusion after an hour, it'll start, eventually, but revs won't pick up. So new pump must be faulty , refit old. At that point the eyes were roving over the fuel lines. Something niggled. Thought (HAH!) lets just change pipes over on the new pump..... :red: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 DafT 244 Posted July 3, 2014 Author Share Posted July 3, 2014 Most faults with these are the fuelline couplings they are brass with an o ring inside that perishes x mod sell them. Hi m109a3uk!, that's very interesting info about the brass fittings! I went to a few local firms who deal with this stuff and no one could tell me if there was an 'O' ring inside or not! Cheers! Gaz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 Tony B Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 Are they O rings or Olives ? The Disco uses olives to join the flexi pipe to the solid end of the pump. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 DafT 244 Posted July 4, 2014 Author Share Posted July 4, 2014 (edited) Are they O rings or Olives ? The Disco uses olives to join the flexi pipe to the solid end of the pump. Hi Tony.. Got to admit these push fittings are great when there is not much access for spanners etc but at least olives don't perish! Have tried your suggestion to pressurize the tank and it worked! Pumped diesel in and out of the sedimenter (certainly saves taking the cup off and filling it by hand!) and connected the pipe and plastic can and got fuel running into that fine! Re connected pipe from sedimenter to fuel pump and cracked 4 of the injector feeds and pressurized tank again..and got fuel out of 3 of the 4 I cracked...But still having trouble with getting any pressure while pumping the lever to bleed system?... At least I know there is no blockage from tank to pump now! I had a word with our works fork/clamp truck mechanic and he agreed that there may be a problem with the pump (diaphragm) or the solenoid fuel shut off valve is stuck in the 'fuel off' position. He suggested someone get in cab and switch ignition on (not crank) and I listen for the valve to click...he said I will have no problem hearing it! Am working for the next 2 days so will order a new fuel pump from X-Mod, at £36+shipping, it's not worth messing about with a repair kit... Just hope it not the stop solenoid as it looks like the injector pump has to come off first! Thanks for your time chaps! Gaz Edited July 4, 2014 by DafT 244 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 DafT 244 Posted July 4, 2014 Author Share Posted July 4, 2014 Here are a few pics....Mine is a '94 Cummins 6B 313 Euro II with a Bosch injector pump Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 Tony B Posted July 4, 2014 Share Posted July 4, 2014 Happy to be of use! :-D 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 callum daf 45 Posted April 11, 2021 Share Posted April 11, 2021 On 7/4/2014 at 7:29 PM, Tony B said: Happy to be of use! 😄 hi have you got a manuel for these engines. im having a simlair probblem. came to truck today would not start i did try pumping lift pump but not much resistance so took fuel filter off not a great deal off fuel in it. so filled it up. still noting i had no choice but to try easy start had to move the truck. anyway after cranking and a couple off sprays and it was running cut out a short time later same again and stayed running. but once i left it a couple off hours same probblem would not start. can you point me in the right direction thank you callum my email ; calmac93@hotmail.co.uk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 callum daf 45 Posted April 17, 2021 Share Posted April 17, 2021 On 7/4/2014 at 7:29 PM, Tony B said: Still having a nightmare with it 🤬. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 ruxy Posted April 17, 2021 Share Posted April 17, 2021 Try more fuel bleeding , what state batteries ? charge up and borrow a tractor battery and couple with jump leads , keep barring until it fires. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 callum daf 45 Posted April 17, 2021 Share Posted April 17, 2021 Hi got two brand new battery’s last week . Started fine . Whent to move it couple off days after just wouldn’t start . Give it a spray off easy start . Fired up . So changed them bits and it’s still just cranking over . thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 callum daf 45 Posted April 17, 2021 Share Posted April 17, 2021 I made sure filter it full . Emptied the seperator filter . Filled with diesel. Pump the lift pump. Turned it over cracked no1 no3 no6 injector got fuel firing out . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 ruxy Posted April 17, 2021 Share Posted April 17, 2021 Get the batteries properly analysed , I have had a couple of premium batteries fail just after new. Although you must know if the cranking is healthy speed ? Try 5 to 10% petrol in your jury-rig tank. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 callum daf 45 Posted April 17, 2021 Share Posted April 17, 2021 Will get them tested Monday. Seems to be fireing over pritty quick. Where the petrol ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 ruxy Posted April 17, 2021 Share Posted April 17, 2021 39 minutes ago, callum daf 45 said: Will get them tested Monday. Seems to be fireing over pritty quick. Where the petrol ? Add a bit of petrol in your temporary header tank to see if it improves starting, Son's Focus diesel has hardly been used this last year. No DERV added to tank in last year. Starting normally instant , was hesitant - so he brimmed the tank and took it for a long run , now back to normal starting. Also a earlier resolved problem on pre-engaged starter that I had considered to be the problem , I took it to bits , brush box dirty. Had to remove a second time , I had left ring gear & pinion dry as they were still perfect after 120K + miles (leave well alone policy). I sorted it by smearing a bit of CV joint grease on the ring. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 Richard Farrant Posted April 17, 2021 Share Posted April 17, 2021 2 hours ago, callum daf 45 said: I made sure filter it full . Emptied the seperator filter . Filled with diesel. Pump the lift pump. Turned it over cracked no1 no3 no6 injector got fuel firing out . Hi, Forgive me for asking, but you say you cracked the injectors pipes open, but did not mention about bleeding the injection pump. This video might give you some tips, first part the guy is changing the fuel hoses due to "diesel bug" but his bleeding procedure may be useful to you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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DafT 244
Hi! I have now bypassed the fuel tank in case there is a blockage stopping fuel getting to the pump....
At least have found fuel pump is ok, it now primes with some resistance on the lever.....however, the fitting
on the return pipe (flexy to steel pipe) starts to leak when I'm priming it....Traced flexy pipe up to a 1/8" pipe
just under cylinder head...this is fed by a 'T' piece from 2 places, 1, from leak off on the injectors and
2, from the top of the lift pump.
Does the fuel cut off solenoid valve (electric) bypass the fuel from the lift pump/injectors and back to the fuel tank?
If this is the case, it would explain the starting problem! If it is stuck in its 'stop position' where do I go from here?
TIA Gaz....
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