mcspool Posted February 2, 2013 Share Posted February 2, 2013 (edited) Went to check out a 1979 LHD Lightweight for sale today, as I want one as a runabout. It has its common Lightweight problems (doortops, outriggers, etc), but as the engine ran smooth and the drivetrain seems to work o.k. I made an offer. The man I was dealing with is the owner's cousin so he had talk to about it and get back to me. Meanwhile I thought to post a couple of pictures with questions here: 1) Could a 1979 LW have served in the British Forces in a sand colour? If original, I think this would be Light Stone? Being a LHD vehicle this was an ex-BAOR LW, which I think were all painted NATO green? Or were some kept in a sand colour to be sent overseas? 2) Who can tell me more about the military history of reg.no. 25-HF-72? What else can I learn from the numbers on the data plate? Thanks in advance! Hanno Edited February 2, 2013 by mcspool it's 1979, not 1978 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fv1609 Posted February 2, 2013 Share Posted February 2, 2013 (edited) What else can I learn from the numbers on the data plate? That it may not be the original plate. The numbers are all over the place & it is screwed on not riveted. PS It says contract no. as FVE22A/87 to be specific it was FVE22A/87/4 Edited February 2, 2013 by fv1609 Contract number Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcspool Posted February 2, 2013 Author Share Posted February 2, 2013 That it may not be the original plate. The numbers are all over the place & it is screwed on not riveted. Thanks Clive! I thought the stamping was sloppy workmanship.... If I pursue the deal I will double check the paperwork and serial number which should be on the chassis somewhere. Would the Serial No 95404355A make any sense for a 1979 LHD LW? H. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fv1609 Posted February 2, 2013 Share Posted February 2, 2013 Yes that serial number does seem right for a LHD Lt Wt. That number plate, I would expect the vehicle description, contract, code no. all to be printed on the plate just the unique things stamped on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcspool Posted February 2, 2013 Author Share Posted February 2, 2013 (edited) Yes that serial number does seem right for a LHD Lt Wt. Here I found the following info: Export LHD started at 95400001 to 95404518, this included vehicles for the UK armed forces. And CalVIN, the Land Rover VIN CALculator came up with the following, explaining the "A" suffix: 95404355A[TABLE] [TR] [TH=width: 80]954[/TH] [TD]Model: Land Rover, Series III[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TH][/TH] [TD]Body type: Lightweight[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TH][/TH] [TD]Wheel base: 88in[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TH][/TH] [TD]Engine: petrol[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TH][/TH] [TD]Model years: 1972-1980[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TH][/TH] [TD]Destination: Export, left-hand drive (LHD)[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TH]04355[/TH] [TD]Serial number[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TH]A[/TH] [TD]Design: Unmodified[/TD] [/TR] [/TABLE] Edited February 3, 2013 by mcspool added text Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fv1609 Posted February 3, 2013 Share Posted February 3, 2013 The info on that first link seems to have come from Mark Cook's book. Both my LtWts were in fact LHD but I've long since lost all the details. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivor Ramsden Posted February 3, 2013 Share Posted February 3, 2013 I would agree that the reg number and chassis number are in the right ball park for the vehicle. The plate looks like a replacement but that doesn't necessarily mean that it's dodgy. I'm in the process of reproducing an accurate data plate for our lightweight because it was missing and it's very difficult deciding just how ours would have looked originally because of all the variations in the way that plates were marked. Some have some bits printed whilst others are all stamped. The stamping is usually neater than this one, though. The vehicle would have been NATO Green originally or possibly it could have been one of the last in Deep Bronze Green. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruxy Posted February 3, 2013 Share Posted February 3, 2013 (edited) To nitpick rivet count , everything is wrong. I will not bother going into great detail. --- Genuine plate but hand-stamped , and I may add incorrect type of plate for vehicle BUT there is a good reason. --- That type of plate is available as a genuine part - IIRC it started about "KA" (1982/83). Does come in handy if a original is lost - but only for a 17 digit VIN and this truck is well pre 14 digit VIN that started abt. end of 1979 or early 1980 and lasted for 12 months (then pre-fix SAL started , that means Land Rover) - hence the 3 extra digit. At this time a VIN plate was fitted under the bonnet and this would (BUT NOT ALWAYS) have reference to LEYLAND CARS. However this is the inside of cab nomenclature plate and the wording would be like this :- All will be in-line because of the way the "indexing head" does it tidy , each contract would be done , any error and it is quite easy to knock a few extra off. ====== When this truck was manufactured - most of the details were in fact printed on the anodised plate , less info. was die-stamped using a "indexing head" - exactly the correct amount for the contract. ---- The correct style plate will be available as a very clever vinyl printed plate , when in doubt , check with cele thinners. You would have to rub like hell to fade genuine anodized finish. FVE22A/87 is wrong on its own 25HF72 , would fall into Item 4 of the contract so it would read FVE22A/87/4 (or ITEM 4 may at times be used in full - depends Lol). Don't expect to find all these plates secured with rivets , ISTR some are affixed with screws from new. Don't go by this one - it too was repositioned when steering changed to RHD. ========================== or I would have to do a bit more checking to decide what style of plate would be correct LoL , a one-off anodized would cost loads of £££ as a "genuine repro" to pass muster. ======= Pity not more photographs , often the truck can be very close identified for age etc. this way. Yes , I wonder if the number branded on the dumb-iron is correct stamped (unmolested) and matches the "replacement" plate LoL Edited February 3, 2013 by ruxy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcspool Posted February 3, 2013 Author Share Posted February 3, 2013 I would agree that the reg number and chassis number are in the right ball park for the vehicle. The plate looks like a replacement but that doesn't necessarily mean that it's dodgy. I'm in the process of reproducing an accurate data plate for our lightweight because it was missing and it's very difficult deciding just how ours would have looked originally because of all the variations in the way that plates were marked. Some have some bits printed whilst others are all stamped. The stamping is usually neater than this one, though. The vehicle would have been NATO Green originally or possibly it could have been one of the last in Deep Bronze Green. Thanks Ivor! Meanwhile I found another listing of LtWt serial numbers plus colours here: http://www.lrfaq.org/Series/FAQ.S.chassis_numbering.954.html. From this listing at least it seems they only came in Bronze Green and Nato green from the factory, with the change over made somewhere before 15 Feb 1980. So the sand colour either was an in-service repaint, or done during civvie life? H. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcspool Posted February 3, 2013 Author Share Posted February 3, 2013 FVE22A/87 is wrong on its own 25HF72 , would fall into Item 4 of the contract so it would read FVE22A/87/4 (or ITEM 4 may at times be used in full - depends Lol). Don't expect to find all these plates secured with rivets , ISTR some are affixed with screws from new. [snip] Pity not more photographs , often the truck can be very close identified for age etc. this way. Yes , I wonder if the number branded on the dumb-iron is correct stamped (unmolested) and matches the "replacement" plate LoL Ruxy, Thanks for the extensive listing of plates. On the one for sale I only saw the plate on the dash. I checked under the bonnet to see the plate on the bulkhead at the rear of the engine but I could not see one fitted. What pictures would you need to see for more identification clues? I have some more. Hanno Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruxy Posted February 3, 2013 Share Posted February 3, 2013 25-HF-72 - it would not have a plate under the bonnet. -------------- Well - I can tell you this with certainty, I own 23-HF-86 , without doing the maths - that is 200 vehicles earlier build , however saying that - they are so near and slightly different contract , well no - same Contract but different Item No. 23-HF-86 is a 12 volt GS. RHD They are so close they could have gone down the two lines next to each other. FV.22A / 87 / Item 3 Now then - the DIS is July 1979 , Unfortunately - I don't think I have done a MOD History search on this lightweight - so uncertain which R.A.O.C. Depot is was received & date. However - I can tell you that it was painted by Solihull in NATO Green. Somewhere - I do have the approx. date & cContract change from DBG to NATO Green. IIRC - it was a 1979. ------- Photographs - I like to see a pic of the dumb-iron , there were early & late S3 chassis - so this gives the ball park chassis date for if genuine original. Also later FFR's (single ammeter on shunt) the control box was secured on underside of chassis , there are two extra brackets - this also helps. More pics the better. e.g. There are loads of internal changes - too many to list here that can date (I am better off not making this list public) LoL External tool-box / underbonnet tool-box. Lighting positions + holes in rear body. If with IR lighting Type of front wings (later FFR had different wings) Tail-gate types (a few , 4 qty lower tail-gate are good for dating - but can get swopped about) Series 3 early axles , Series 3 "Rationalized" axles. + the "Hybrid" axles of abt. 1979 (loads of differs here , don't wish to make too many folks aware). Obviously all parts can be swopped for earlier / later. However - a Bitsa , best avoided. I normally weigh up all - any suspicion - investigate further. Ringers are often outed on balance of probability of a few things. Lots of L'wts are rung to get "Historic" road tax free , meaning for re-sale they are greatly de-valued (because you can't make them legal unles the owner were to own up and hand over correct docs. & plates) - why bother when there are genuine unmolested trucks for sale ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Autokaci Posted June 2, 2014 Share Posted June 2, 2014 For those looking for new data plates, maybe this site could help: http://www.landroverchassisplates.co.uk http://www.landroverchassisplates.co.uk/page4.htm Regards, Kaci Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theredkite Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 In terms of the sand colour, I bought my Lightweight in 1999 from XWD. They had about 50 - it was one of the last batches, or should I say one of the many "last batches" that were available around that time Anyway a few of them were in "sand paint", but the reality was that there was a very rough covering of sand, with plenty of green/black whatever showing underneath. I'm sure that someone here can confirm that some Lightweights made it into Op Granby, and that some would have been painted for that. But given the evenness of the paint in the photograph, imho it's very unlikely that the paint on the vehicle was applied 23 years ago! Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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