Surveyor Posted December 28, 2021 Share Posted December 28, 2021 Went to use the hitch the other day, my fault found it seized, having looked can get it working again hopefully. As always have a good look and refer to as much reference I have before commencing, I noticed that one bolt head was "funny" tried to unsecrew it and the head twisted, I have now after a lot of gentle persuasion got it out, the remainder come out with no issues. I have hunted but cant find the size of the bolts nor any reference for part numbers for the unit, its from a 110 Land Rover, as always any help would be appreciated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruxy Posted December 28, 2021 Share Posted December 28, 2021 The reason you have damaged the head is because they are 'safety critical' and are cemented (with a correct procedure) in with a Loctite thread lock. You need to apply a little heat to soften before screwing out. Dixon Bate - may supply ? but I doubt it because they don't like them being removed, likewise I don't think Land Rover have ever supplied. ------- I can't find a FV No. most of the pintle other components do have. --------------- However the NSN (NATO stock No. is - G1/5305-99-941-1751) so search on that also check with The XMOD - up Scotland Borders - IIRC Peebles (must be on your travels). Details are :- Screw Machine UNF thread , steel , flat, CSK (countersink) Head , Slot-drive , zinc-coated , 1/4" x 7/8" lg. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
utt61 Posted December 28, 2021 Share Posted December 28, 2021 (edited) They are easy to source, perfectly normal 1/4" UNF countersunk screws. I am not in a position to challenge whether officially they are considered safety-critical and thread-locked but over the years I have overhauled at least half-a-dozen of these pintles and have never come across one which has been thread-locked by anything other than rust and corrosion, which is commonplace. Equally I don't see how they could be considered SC since all they do is hold the two retaining plates in the right place when the pintle is not mounted to a vehicle, it is the four mounting bolts which provide the strength to tow. It is my experience that they seldom can be removed from a typical well-used pintle without the use of an impact driver, and quite often require drilling out. It is also my experience that since Bradley Dixon Bate was taken over by Al-Ko their aftermarket and technical support on all former Bradley and DB products has been virtually non-existent, to the point that they even denied that Bradley ever made the lunettes fitted to wide-track Sankey trailers, this despite the Bradley plate and NSN on the product I was asking about. Hopeless. Edited December 28, 2021 by utt61 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruxy Posted December 29, 2021 Share Posted December 29, 2021 Your penultimate post here was requesting Part No. for plate regarding trailer warning plate for voltage. Yes there are 12 volt & 24 volt available & reason why a Defender FFR will be 12 volt. You also mentioned the recent crash damage to rear X member , then you mention your pintle is seized. DB 's attitude is - we give you a grease nipple , keep it primed and it will rotate OR corrosion set-in and we are never responsible for that. THEREFOR I CONSIDER YOU HAVE CRASH-DAMAGE TO THE SPINDLE. DB have never wanted total strip-down , in fact they have never made the public aware of the check for wear (non-serviceable) to the top latch or swivel. NP (non-provisioned parts) is the DB way of saying , we don't condone , if you have to go there "you are on your own). PRODUCT LIABILITY INSURANCE - I don't believe DB have ever issued their damage assessment instructions / wear rejection criteria to the public. This is because trailers were being flipped long before the theory of "something must always rotate" instructions). I understand that DB only supplied in red-oxide primer , and in recent years Defender/Wolf was leaving Solihull left in red-oxide (because they issued instructions for periodic NDT testing that is best done without any more paint than is basic necessity , however I am aware that DB have issued some guidance notes to the MOD , that they will not even reply to the general public. These pintle have been made over /abt. 60 years , I have noticed just a odd detail difference other than markings. + Mounting bolts to chassis for Defender did go down in dia. to 12mm from 1/2" I doubt if these 1/4" screws have been metricated to 6mm , but I have not dismantled one off a truck dated later than 1980. Chemical thread-lock has been around many years , certainly others have found these screws threadlocked. If I applied then I would clean male threads with just a wire brush and a blunt tap on internal threads. btw , go to Ex-MLRA Forum and Search on words such as stripping/dismantling NATO hitch/hook etc. What you will find is others have found (as well as self) that these screws have been found secured with a threadlock (and you have quite a selection). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Surveyor Posted December 29, 2021 Author Share Posted December 29, 2021 (edited) Many thanks, yes thinking about it now, the crash was about 6 years ago the hook was hit, the 3 remaining screws came out with a little pressure no problem. Trying to think i am pretty sure i have rotated the beast since return from the repairers, unfortunately its chucking down with rain today so cant do any more on it as no garage. Peebles can be on my travels as live in Fife work in Yorkshire. I have seen a few videos on you tube and the can be dismantled. Will follow up your suggestions as well. As always thanks for the advice Edited December 29, 2021 by Surveyor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Surveyor Posted December 29, 2021 Author Share Posted December 29, 2021 (edited) A follow on question related to the above. In the manual from Dixon bates it says the bolts to the Land Rover need to be tightened to a certain torque, yes can understand this, however looking at the exploded diagram on line the 2hook" is held to the plate fitted to the Land Rover by these 4 screws, I would have thought this was the weakest spot, yet all the weight seems to be on these screws, Any comments would be appreciated. Ignore this just realised something from following post Edited December 29, 2021 by Surveyor Being blinkered in thinking Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MatchFuzee Posted December 29, 2021 Share Posted December 29, 2021 Bolt size discussion:- https://forums.lr4x4.com/topic/11877-nato-hitch-bolt-size/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Surveyor Posted December 30, 2021 Author Share Posted December 30, 2021 Been a nice morning and following Ruxy's comment about crash damage a sleepless night, however striped down and rebuilt it was lack of grease that caused it to seize, also found out why, the grease gun donated to me and i was using turns out doesn't work or I am using it wrong. The circlips need to be replaced as damaged when being removed. And Yippeeee something new learned today Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruxy Posted December 30, 2021 Share Posted December 30, 2021 The C'sk head screws , identifiers = Pozidrive , so if you used a Phillips bit or screwdriver - you would cam-out. IIRC - I use a Facom screwdriver with a hex. at handle & fit a spanner - so I put all my weight with two hands on driver & get assistant to turn the spanner acw. The 'snap-rings' may be a standard made by Anderton that you may be able to obtain at a bearing sales type place, they are more secure than a C type external circlip. Again NP , because DB consider their staff are the only ones competent., but the official nomenclature according to MOD Rover 10/11 Parts book (earlier S2A parts book has no mention) is RETAINING RING STEEL EXTERNAL 5/8" The NSN = LV6MT1/5340-99-910-8192 Quote Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Surveyor Posted December 31, 2021 Author Share Posted December 31, 2021 Ruxy Many thanks, I have good friends down at Kwik Fit who help out when needed, same with screwfix, and was going to check the rear bumper today to see if the spreader plate was retained, yet is raining again Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mk3iain Posted January 3, 2022 Share Posted January 3, 2022 Some parts available through dealers in Australia, most likely ex mil stock. Search results (klrautomotive.com.au) The manuals also show a parts breakdown but with mainly local part numbers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Surveyor Posted January 3, 2022 Author Share Posted January 3, 2022 3 hours ago, Mk3iain said: Some parts available through dealers in Australia, most likely ex mil stock. Search results (klrautomotive.com.au) The manuals also show a parts breakdown but with mainly local part numbers. Many thanks, I have the MoD manuals and lucky 2 doors up the rad ex i think REME but now a civie who works at the base Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Surveyor Posted January 8, 2022 Author Share Posted January 8, 2022 Thanks to my friends at SCREWFIX, its an M 6X 20, unfortunately they did not have any, EBay has so they should come this week, another successful job for this learning mechanic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Surveyor Posted January 15, 2022 Author Share Posted January 15, 2022 On 12/29/2021 at 3:34 PM, MatchFuzee said: Bolt size discussion:- https://forums.lr4x4.com/topic/11877-nato-hitch-bolt-size/ Putting the parts back together, i find i have no backing plate as part No5, but an additional plate in front for the hook in case of break away, I am beginning to think part 5 was not replaced when the vehicle was upgraded so as to not bother getting longer bolts Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruxy Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 The break-away plate with two loops - to attach dog-clip ? IIRC that was introduced abt. Y2k , I have one to fit on my 90" but not got around to it . You do need a proper backing plate - large form flat washers are no use - seen them pulled through rear X members. For the hitch 'project' I have a civvy Defender drop-plate (somewhere in garage , I shot-blast it , red-oxide primed ++ grey primer then never continued) for 50mm ball , the pressed dish plate that bolts under X member and has two RSA braces back to chassis - this will be a addition to NATO hitch , don't see why a Britpart / Bearmach £cheap Series drop-plate can't be used , decided to go for proper one as chassis is ready to take the additional braces. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Surveyor Posted January 16, 2022 Author Share Posted January 16, 2022 Ruxy Thanks it ties up with the history of the vehicle, i am in 2 minds, put back as i found it and most have been there for 20 years or put a spreader plate in. I am heading for the first option as I dont think any heavy loads are going to be pulled by the beast. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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