Jack Posted September 12, 2005 Share Posted September 12, 2005 People look upon MV owners and re-enactors as separate entities, but are we? Surely we drive and display vehicles to recreate and to educate the same as re-enactors do in their respective fields and use MV's as part of their displays. So would it be fair to say the MV's owners are re-enactors? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
polecat paul Posted September 12, 2005 Share Posted September 12, 2005 It really depends wether or not the owner of said mv actually dresses up in the uniform of the era of the vehicle ....thats what i think anyway :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oddball Posted September 12, 2005 Share Posted September 12, 2005 Is that re-enacting though :?: I wear that sort of clothing A. because I always have & B. because it is hard wearing & comfortable. These days it's just being fashionable anyway, the last time my wife dragged me into Debenhams I saw that they were selling very good copies of M43 jackets :!: When I take the jeep for a bounce along the ridgeway, or wherever, I don't feel that I am re-enacting anything, just going for a fun drive in the country. I would consider re-enacting to be running around in a field at a show pretending to shoot each other. Sorry, I will get down off my ration box now :!: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M8Greyhound Posted September 12, 2005 Share Posted September 12, 2005 Guys i think it depends on what you are actually portraying...for example our unit is a recon company of the 2nd Armored Division and as such the vehicles are part of our living history display and there fore we dress accordingly and correctly so there fore we are reenactors and vehicle owners. The same goes for people that own vehicles and use them to accesorise static displays. But the crux of the matter comes when the "purist" MV owner looks down upon the re enacting hobby personally speaking it doesnt irk me to see flecktarn in a landy or a 432 or abbot but you put BD or flecktarn in a M4 Sherman or an M5 Stuart and it becomes a different matter. my own opinion is you dress to suit the vehicle and the time period as correct dress is a perfect accompyment to the MV and the hobby..and thats part of the FUN it is only a HOBBY and i think some people lose sight of that. Off soap box now Regards Lloyd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
berni Posted September 12, 2005 Share Posted September 12, 2005 another way to look at it is. In the re-enacting world the re-enactor dressed up is the display piece and not his mode of car, where as in the MV world the vehicle is the display piece not the driver. Many drivers drive the MV to a show & then walk off & do & look at other things so no one knows that you've got a vehicle anyway( well i go & look at other stuff). Many of the MV shows are country fayres & steam rallies & walking round the 'junk in boxes' stalls fully kitted up in Airbourne/Bd kit is completly wasted anyway. The classic car owners look down on you, the tractor drivers ignore you & the Bus owners look at you with disdain. ( sorry if this includes you it is a generalisation not a pop at individuals) They are 2 quite similar hobbies but in some cases they are worlds apart, it is a shame but as new younger blood comes into both hobbies I think some of the fences are having gates put in them. More re-enactors are getting vehicles & more vehicle owners are getting the kit, in a lot of cases the divide is not too great but there are some of the original die hards on both sides & unfortunatley we have to hope that their predudice doesn't get passed down Also the German ban at events hasn't gone down very well with re-enactors as can be seen on their forum. If you type in MVT on the ww11 forum then you will see a thread from me (i post as mver) about the MVT. I can't remember a lot of the replies but it was a good debate. Me & Russ bat for both sides of the coin so to say & do Brit & German & have so far not come across anything unsavoury. The divide is getting smaller though . Cheers Berni Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Grosvenor Posted September 12, 2005 Share Posted September 12, 2005 Hello Personally, I don't consider myself as a re-enactor just because I own MV's I wear camo gear when I take one of the vehicles for a run or to a show but this is more a case of having a bit of fun and getting into the spirit of things. True re-enactors ,such as Rolling Thunder, must spend ages researching and finding just the right equipment and their vehicles are just another "prop". Has anyone else noticed that at alot of re-enacted battles the Americans start off completely out numbered, dodge hundreds of bullets and shells , then they fire a few shots back and the entire Viet-Cong army fall down dead! :wink: Regards Richard Grosvenor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M8Greyhound Posted September 12, 2005 Share Posted September 12, 2005 I think Berni has it spot on there.....re enactors use MVs as display accesories..... MV owners use "uniforms" as accesories the gap is definatley if very "slowly" narrowing..... Regards Lloyd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karoshi Posted September 12, 2005 Share Posted September 12, 2005 Some interesting comments here. For my part re-enacting doesn’t start until badges are worn. Up to that point 'in keeping' clothing may appeal for a number of reasons, practicality, comfort or just in support of the military theme. BUT add a badge or Divisional Marking or a Unit Insignia and to my mind you've crossed that unwritten line. You're now portraying history; events lived out by real people in real situations. To my mind there is now at least a moral obligation to respect and to honour their commitments and sacrifices. I'm not suggesting for a minute that re-enacting is in any way wrong or that it should be banned or controlled, but bearing a unit insignia and maybe a badge of rank, takes it to a whole new level. There are those that have crossed that line and honour that commitment, unfortunately there are also those who do not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M8Greyhound Posted September 12, 2005 Share Posted September 12, 2005 Karoshi i think thats exactly where the problem lays.....RANK and DECORATIONS. only speaking for our unit...we DO have a rank structure in keeping with our recon unit. As we have multiple vehicles and multiple platoons we utilise correct rankings for vehicle commanders ,drivers, infantrymen , Squad leaders etc as that was "correct" for the period and the unit we represent.... It has the desired unit effect and also as we portray "actual" people we DONT abuse the rank Just my £1 worth Regards Lloyd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Posted September 13, 2005 Author Share Posted September 13, 2005 well that has certainly given me something to think about, so have to ask the question, if MV owners where period dress are then re-enactors and if re-enactors drive MV are they then MV owners and not re-enactors? Or are we all re-enactors seeing as we are all displaying something from a certain time and place? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oddball Posted September 13, 2005 Share Posted September 13, 2005 It all depends what you choose to do with your mv doesn't it :?: If you choose to spend the majority of your time with other like minded people re-creating a particular part of history down to the last nut & bolt then you must be a re-enactor. On the other hand if you prefer just to use your mv as part of your daily life & go for drives in it etc (admitedly you probably wouldn't want to take your dragon wagon to Tesco's) then you must fall into the owner bracket, or should that be user :?: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
berni Posted September 13, 2005 Share Posted September 13, 2005 Many MV owners who re enact are also part of a re enactment group with a specific unit/ regiment & vice versa but there aren't many shows where they overlap. Im not sure if an MV owner who dressed to match his vehicle can be classed as a re enactor as re enactors put a lot of effort & research into their displays & roles with in a group. However a static display using the vehicle as a prop with other equipment to portray a certain scene can be classed as a living history diorama. To re enact is to re do. ie if a few GMC & jeep owners had a convoy going from an inland town to a coastal point involved in the ambarkation for D Day than they could call it D Day -3 for instance & it would be a re enactment of a certain event as many American service men were transported to the the coast in preparation for D Day. But if the convoy consisted of a few GMCs, a jeep or two, a landrover,a bedford RL, a REO & a schwimwagen etc then regardless of how they are dressed it could not be classed as re enactment or living history. There are many re enactment groups of all nationalities for those who would like to take the hobby to a different level & if they have a vehicle & could commit themselves then I am sure they will be made to feel most welcome. I know of a few MV owners who see re enactors as the poor relations this just isn't so. Re enactors have probably taken more time & money to get themselves kitted up to the correct standard than many owners have spent on vehicles. ON the other hand there are also predudices coming from re enactors about MV owners who spend the time & money on a vehicle & then drive it around wearing flecktarn trousers & a string vest. We are on both sides of the coin like I said before & have had a few winges from both sides, when MV owners think we are just re enactors & when re enactors think we are just MV owners. Once you start to get recognised everything is fine & also once others know you are not just a flash in the pan . Respect has to be earnt from both sides & it takes a bit of effort on your part to earn that respect. That I'm afraid is human nature :roll: I'll come down off my soap box now :lol: cheers for listening berni Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karoshi Posted September 13, 2005 Share Posted September 13, 2005 It all depends what you choose to do with your mv doesn't it :?: (admitedly you probably wouldn't want to take your dragon wagon to Tesco's) :?: If I had a M26 DRAGON WAGON I'd take it to Tesco's. Whats wrong with Tesco's. I do it with the Deuce. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oddball Posted September 13, 2005 Share Posted September 13, 2005 If I had a M26 DRAGON WAGON I'd take it to Tesco's. Whats wrong with Tesco's. I do it with the Deuce. Your Tesco's has obviously got a better layed out car park than ours then :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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