Scotch Harry Posted May 4, 2012 Share Posted May 4, 2012 Over the past 20 or so years i have amassed a large amount of 58 Patt webbing,probably 10-15 full sets and various bits and pieces as sometimes you have to buy a load just to get the 1 odd pouch or item. I gather that quite a few foreign countries used it and have some strange Pea Green bits-some British Maker marked but most unmarked and was hoping they could possibly be Iraqi and also have a set of what conforms to the early style and colours but just dont seem right due to construction etc so is there or is/was there ever REPRO 58 Patt around(cant imagine why as its so plentiful) Would be great to have a thread on 58 Patt as while pretty much unloved its an important part of British Army load carrying equipment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rdx10 Posted May 4, 2012 Share Posted May 4, 2012 I gather that quite a few foreign countries used it and have some strange Pea Green bits-some British Maker marked but most unmarked and was hoping they could possibly be Iraqi and also have a set of what conforms to the early style and colours but just dont seem right due to construction etc so is there or is/was there ever REPRO 58 Patt around(cant imagine why as its so plentiful) It wasn't always plentiful and you could buy new Indian made 58 lookalike pouches , belts and full sets around 20/25 years ago . From memory the weave was different , it was a lighter weight , a darker green, the stitching and metal fittings were different quality . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Topdog Posted May 4, 2012 Share Posted May 4, 2012 Its interesting to see how availability and prices of stuff changes from year to year at Beltring. 58 webbing and Clansman stuff varies greatly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wdbikemad Posted May 4, 2012 Share Posted May 4, 2012 (edited) 58 (and 44) webbing was seemingly manufactured in the UK for foreign markets......the only real difference is a slightly lighter green colour and (usually) no issue markings whatsoever.......I have a 44 small pack (pre 64 type), ammo pouches and pack L-straps of this type in NOS and apart from the above they are identical in quality and construction to the MoD issues..... 58 webbing WAS commercially made during the 70s and early 80s for the UK market........it was seemingly done because the issue kit was very difficult (and expensive) to obtain at the time and the common source was usually Silverman's......similar situation with 68 pattern DPM at the time I seem to remember..... Rather nicely, NOS 58 pattern kit is now available in abundance.....Sabre Sales are still a good (and very reasonable) source for 80s production NOS items (as is the internet)......they have Yokes, Kidney Pouches, Large packs, L & R Ammo Pouches and Water bottle Pouches.......but no NOS belts !.....bizarely, the latter are now being reproduced...!!! Rumour is, the 1st pattern waterbottle pouches with the twist-type fastener are now also being replicated...... The morale is, snap it up now.......I did similar with NOS green PLCE within the last 3 years and have managed to acquire enough for several sets......only in production and service for 2-3 years...... Edited May 4, 2012 by wdbikemad Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotch Harry Posted May 4, 2012 Author Share Posted May 4, 2012 Still a fair bit of Green PLCE on Ebay so no panic buying just yet:-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wdbikemad Posted May 4, 2012 Share Posted May 4, 2012 Still a fair bit of Green PLCE on Ebay so no panic buying just yet:-) I'd agree, but on a scarcity scale, decent NOS yokes and ammo pouches, both the early L & R models and the later (and scarcer) universal type are not as common as utility & waterbottle pouches.......luckily, the green PLCE belt remained unchanged when DPM introduced, although if assembling a set look for an 88-89 dated belt to be totally correct...... Green PLCE rucksacks are becoming harder to source in NOS condition, although the daysack yoke, entrenching tool pouch and bayonet frogs still seem plentiful.....rifle grenade pouches in green are now rather hard to source NOS, with other items such as the pistol holster assembly rather difficult too..... As for DPM PLCE....still okay, although utility pouches, subtly different to the waterbottle pouch, seem harder to find and if NOS always twice the price.....DPM rucksack "hippo" pads are also hard to source (genuine issue at least)..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotch Harry Posted May 7, 2012 Author Share Posted May 7, 2012 This set is how i got it with nothing added or changed by myself and has been used by somebody at sometime-cadet maybe?? Ammo pouches,yoke,water bottle pouch and kidney pouches are of the 1st type and bizarrely seem to be scaled down,the water bottle pouch wont even hold a bottle:cry::cry: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotch Harry Posted May 7, 2012 Author Share Posted May 7, 2012 A few more oddities,in a horrid mushy pea colour(have a full set somewhere). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2 para Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 been after a full set of 58 webbing but never seem to be any about when i have the funds :mad: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotch Harry Posted May 7, 2012 Author Share Posted May 7, 2012 been after a full set of 58 webbing but never seem to be any about when i have the funds :mad: You have a PM:) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panzer nut Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 (edited) double post Edited May 7, 2012 by Panzer nut Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panzer nut Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 Ermmmmm Scotch that webbing set with the black dots on looks like its a 58 pattern WE Mark 1 set. Almost all 58 webbing you see is Mark 2.... YOU GIT!, get rid of the yank bottle. notice that there is no top support for the kidney pouches, the twist catch on the water bottle, no stra loops on the sholder straps ofthe yoke . and i suspect the ammo pouches are straight fittinga nd not slanted. Grrrr Jon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotch Harry Posted May 7, 2012 Author Share Posted May 7, 2012 It is indeed a MK1 set but not i think original unfortunately. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotch Harry Posted May 29, 2012 Author Share Posted May 29, 2012 been after a full set of 58 webbing but never seem to be any about when i have the funds :mad: Any chance please you can reply to the messages ive sent regarding payment for the web set you were after going back around 2 weeks now,either way if no longer wanting it can you at least let me know please-Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotch Harry Posted May 29, 2012 Author Share Posted May 29, 2012 On the subject of MK1 58 Patt ive always gone by Howletts book(not that keen on the Europa series of webbing books to be honest). Regarding the ammo pouches ive always been led to believe that there were only 2 types,early that were smaller,straight belt hooks,reinforced larger top pouch sides and the strap and buckle arrangement inside the pouch,later pouch,larger,angled belt hooks etc etc. Well,just got a couple of oddities-British issue(not foreign)CN numbers,dated 1965 by ME Co and exact as the early pattern other than the top flap sides arent reinforced and same size as the later pouches so seems that there were at least 3 types and not 2 as always believed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wdbikemad Posted May 29, 2012 Share Posted May 29, 2012 (edited) On the subject of MK1 58 Patt ive always gone by Howletts book(not that keen on the Europa series of webbing books to be honest). Regarding the ammo pouches ive always been led to believe that there were only 2 types,early that were smaller,straight belt hooks,reinforced larger top pouch sides and the strap and buckle arrangement inside the pouch,later pouch,larger,angled belt hooks etc etc. Well,just got a couple of oddities-British issue(not foreign)CN numbers,dated 1965 by ME Co and exact as the early pattern other than the top flap sides arent reinforced and same size as the later pouches so seems that there were at least 3 types and not 2 as always believed. There were two versions of the early pouches.....original issue with metal side reinforcement on the lids and the later issue without (and slightly reduced sides).......I haven't checked mine out as they are in storage, but there may exist a slight increase in overall size on the 2nd version of the early pouches.......Sabre Sales did have a fair few used early pattern pouches in stock (both versions) only last year, and they may still have them mixed in with all the other used 58..... It seems that the original 58 pattern gear entered production during 1959 (the earliest pouch I have seen with this date) and it seems that the metal-reinforced lids lasted up to 62-63 followed by the non-reinforced version.........not sure when the pouches were redesigned with the angled rear attachment and deletion of the inner strap, but I would guess late 60s........? There is also a very late version of the right-hand pouch that lacks the Energa (or KFS) pocket on the side......some NOS examples still retain the manufacturers assembly marks for the pocket but it seems that it simply wasn't fitted, rather than later removed........I think these date from around 84 onwards and lasted up to the end of production in 1990...... 58 webbing did not see a mass-introduction in the early 60s, although many infantry and assault troops did receive priority over the initial issue.........some TA and second line formations were still using 37 pattern gear right up to the late 60s in some instances...... Interestingly, I have most of the rare issue trial 58 webbing in nylon (missing only the poncho roll, waterbottle pouch and large pack - though I'm not certain if the latter was actually produced in nylon ?)......all items are NSN marked and dated 1977.......the ammo & kidney pouches and yoke conform to the later 58 pattern in specification.......Silverman's stock this trial stuff at a very reasonable £15 per item....some is used and the odd item NOS (yokes for example).........all items carry various British Army unit marks.....rare items in the extreme..........they have ammo pouches, belts, kidney pouches and yokes.....no ponch rolls or waterbottle carriers, sadly...... Edited May 29, 2012 by wdbikemad Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chevpol Posted May 29, 2012 Share Posted May 29, 2012 picked up a late right hand pouch without the energa pouch............also a left hand one without the bayonet straps....... Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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