Steve 82

Quote: ` ......i feel they should recognise the expectations and feelings of groups like ourselves who have spent 12 months planning and anticipating only to feel effectivly disregarded purely because we can't be present a week ( or is it two ) before it all kicks off. Am I alone? ` Due to my being on long term posting overseas, I am rarely able to reach the UK to arrive anywhere near early enough to claim a stake in the living history area - but, did have a lucky-run until 2008 (which much help from Greg Cottee). However, having turned up the last 2-years running with all the display kit - only to be relegated to Monktons field (a great campsite by the way, or for speed testing for your armour) - I feel it more appropriate to leave Living history to those fortunate enough to be able to arrive earlier. Will still attend of course - its a great show, but as a happy camper only. Cheers,

Thanks for the update gents Steve 82

Great pics Les - more please ! Am constantly looking for examples of field settings - in order to improve my displays at shows, so any 60`s / 70`s pics of mogs in the field would be especially appreciated. The one below, whilst showing a 1980`s setup makes a good example on how to cam-up a radio station (using the older-styled nets) Great thread though ! Cheers Steve 82

Would someone be so kind as to update us as to the latest situation on this matter or, post a link to any official statements (have tried searching the official website in vain). The next challenge will be to establish the practicality of getting early 1960`s vehicles MOT`d to standards applied at the time. Anyone started along this route yet ? Thanks Steve 82

Here are a few images of my ex-BW 404 Mog - based Telex system (the same was also used by the Dutch and Belgians apparently). Truck & Trailer Radio Body Siemens Generator

Gents, Looking at the above hard-bodied versions, I think we have to differentiate between German Heer (Army) body types and those used by the other branches of the Armed forces (Bundeswehr) and Civil Defence / Police. (lets not get started on the Dutch and Swiss varieties for the moment). Remembering that all bodies (koffers) were produced by contractors as opposed to Mercedes, it is hardly suprising that differences regularly appeared - even in the same models. However, regarding the above b/w images, the first does appear to be police / civil defence (shiny paintwork !) and, the second could be an early Heer or Luftwaffe version - will have to check. I attach below an extract from an early 1960`s Unimog manual (Heer) illustrating the principal radio-bodied variations of the time (my personal vehicle is a Version 3.1). As you can see from the first image, there was at least one higher bodied version recognised by the Heer. Cheers Steve 82

Barrie and other Radio Mog fans, As mentioned above, the FM Mogs s came in a variety of flavours. Here is a particularly complete example of the FM – Telex broadcasting / re-broadcasting version based upon the SEM25: Interior: http://kreuzer-thomas.privat.t-online.de/HomepageClassic01/mogbelad.htm Exterior: http://kreuzer-thomas.privat.t-online.de/HomepageClassic01/unimog404s.htm My original Bundeswehr manual copies describe in detail all components for the above and several other FM-radio-fits based upon the Unimog 404 – down to individual NATO stock codes. If you can identify the exact version, then there is a good chance I can suggest a parts shopping list . Willem Noorloos of Holland has been mentioned earlier in the thread and, have been in touch with him for several years. However, as with a few other collectors, he uses the vehicle as a shack for all his military radio needs rather than as a strict rebuild of the original specification (please correct me if I am wrong). He may be able to help with radio fit details also. Not seen many recent commencial sources of manuals however, few years ago, a chap by the name of Delissen (in Holland I think) used to re-gurgitate copies of old NATO signals manuals. Might be worth trying to track him down through the Dutch amateur miliraty radio society (SRS). Hope the above helps Cheers Steve 82

Hi Barrie, I may be able to assist. Am into ex Bundeswehr radio vehicles and have the Teletype relay station Mog (funkfernschreib) - see a couple of pics here: http://hmvf.co.uk/forumvb/showthread.php?10794-Hi-There-from-Kidderminster-!&p=111616#post111616 From discussions with Steff in the distant past, I believe the vehicle is an FM version - though there were several sub-models again ! Have a number of different original radio fit manuals for the Mog so, PM in the first instance and will see what I can do. Be warned though, the full radio fit could be difficult to source these days as these vehicles were disposed of between 10 and 15 years ago and, few were maintained in their original form. Whilst the radios are relatively straightforward to acquire (at a price)......its the accessories that cause the difficulty ! Cheers Steve 82

Hi, Being posted overseas, I am missing the chance to play with my vehicles in all this snow / difficult weather. Would love to see any pics of UK members vehicles being used to effect under the current conditions – any pics out there (or can anyone point me to other relevant threads ?) Thanks, Steve 82

Nick , Peter & the W&P Team, Upon reflection, my comment was somewhat harsh and for that I appologise to the W&P team. Am sure they were as caught out by the final flight of the helicopter - as was everyone else. However, I should have telephoned Mr Cadman to discuss my concerns directly and will do so soon. Sincerely, Steve 82

A brief comment. I have taken my son and a couple of his friends to W&P for several years and am really dissappointed just how ineffective the show team there were at enforcing what must surely be one of the biggest safety breaches in recent shows. Its one thing to put your own life at risk (as happened previously), yet quite another to put many others in harms way. As a health and safety risk assessor, I know only too well how dim a view the authorities would take on a repeat of such a lapse - which would ultimately force considerably tighter H&S and spoil the enjoyment of 1000`s. Come on guys, I think most folks would support you taking a strong line on such behaviour. Well, thats my pennies worth Steve 82

Hi, I am trying to assemble some more knowledge about the defrosting / demisting units fitted to many German Forces soft-skin vehicles during WW2. Information collected so far is limited to photographic evidence and images of surviving examples. Wartime images Here are a few images randomly taken from various wartime winter pics (pardon the Kubel – bias). Unfortunately, none are particularly clear, and it would be great if someone could contribute better quality images to help more positively identify the types of unit used at the time. Types The above images seem to suggest more than a single type of unit – although as noted, clearer images would help confirm this. From surviving examples it has been possible to identify the principal components: A glass panel (hardened) set in an unpainted metal frame. Strung along the length of the frame are up to 5No electrically powered heating elements (wires) – suspended from small metal arms - which are capable of being used with 12v and 6v electrical systems. The glass sheet is separated from the windshield with a rubber surround – which also serves to hold the heated air – hopefully improving the unit`s effectiveness. Units are mounted to the windscreen by 2 adjustable arms – extending up and downwards at each end of the unit. The tips of the arms are very thin and sit in between the windscreen glass and the rubber surround Units comprised an on/off switch and employed a standard KAKO plug for conveying power. Cable is woven cloth covered. Notwithstanding the above, the following differences appear to exist: Type 1 – German Forces WW2 Production – the glass panel and metal surround is in turn embedded in a square, dunkelgelb – painted fame. A small on-off toggle switch is mounted on the left of the frame. The unit appears to provide a very `narrow` viewing window. Type 1 mounted of restored Schwimmwagen Type 1 frame, without mounting arms Type 2 – German WW2 production – Military / civilian ? Identical in principle to the German Forces units but, minus the dunkelgelb – painted outer frame. Also, the on/off switch is a much larger toggle device mounted at the base of the unit. The unit appears to provide a `larger` window area. Type 2 - minus the KAKO plug. American Forces production – WW2 As a comparison, the following images illustrate the US forces equivalent of this unit – as produced by Durkee-Atwood. The basic unit is more similar to the Type 2 unit, with the exception that the US units are mounted to the windscreen using suction-cups and, the on/off switch is mounted away from the unit. The unit was also produced after the war and presumably modified for operation with 24v electrical systems. As noted previously, further information / images of these little units, would be much appreciated. Cheers Steve 82

Have not made a complete survey of the scene, but must admit I never understand why some show organisers charge MOP`s the same as exhibitors. I mean, the cost of getting the vehicle there is huge in many cases - to the point, we are funding the shows for the MOP`s to attend. Would be interesting to hear others views. Cheers Steve 82

Hi List, Watching this thread daily at the moment, and many thanks to all on keeping us up to speed with developments.:tup:: Whilst legislation has not yet been passed, there does seem to be a general acceptance that some form of testing is inevitable for post 1960`s HGV`s. Correct me if I am wrong. One point though, with regards to light vehicles, I am very aware through personal experience that not all MOT testers are conversant with older test requirements and must assume that for HGV`s, it is going to be the same. What will be very useful in time will be a list of those testing facilities accross the country who understand the older requirements, in order that we can avoid unnecessary heartache when striving to satisfy (and probably exceed) the test standards. Cheers Steve 82

AntarMike, Many thanks for taking the time in the preparation the response document - contains well thought out arguments on all points addressed. Steve 82

[ NOTE : UPDATED LINK ] Talking WW2, US Army Intelligence prepared a large number of documents on the Germans during WW2, both for general training of officers and preparation of NCO`s about to go into combat. These were based upon captured manuals and interrogation reports and covered most aspects of ground force operations – the ` German Squad in Combat` manual is especially good for small formation tactics. Publications I have found so far : WWII Special Series: The German Armoured Army German Military Training The German Motorised Infantry Regiment German Tactical Doctrine The German Squad in Combat German Anti-Aircraft Artillery German Military Abbreviations German Infantry Weapons German Coastal Defences German Doctrine on the Stabilised Front German Winter Warfare German Ski Training and Tactics German Mountain Warfare Company Officers Handbook of the German Army Information Bulletin No 20, German Methods of Warfare in the Lybian Desert WW2 Technical Manuals: German Volkswagen (Kubelwagen) Handbook on German Forces These are available online (free) through the US Army Combined Arms Centre Online library : http://www.cgsc.edu/carl/wwIIspec/ Loads of American technical manuals also (Jeep manual etc) Cheers, Steve in Kidderminster :coffee:

Guys, I have been out of UK for a little while and just caught up on this. Could someone please brief me on the current status of this. Thanks Steve

Hi Guys, Whats the latest on this ? Cheers Steve

I use a breathable motor-home cover for a Unimog 404 when I keep it on the drive. Was quoted 500 Pounds + from one supplier - in the end found a Chinese made equivalent for 150 Pounds which has served me 3 winters so far. Water deflecting, breathable - so dries quickly during times of high humidity and is physically strong enough to resist some serious winds !

Hi, This might not be the forum for this but......Kemble is far closer to where I live (Kidderminster - when I am home that is), and on the sight of it, lots to offer. I attended the show 2004, 2005 and 2006 and for me, the biggest issue was the climb in an already under-powered truck from the motorway to the higher ground, in addition to the windy and (unfortunately) rainy weather. Watching the rabbits hop past me on that hill was also soul destroying ! Seriously though, am sure the slightly higher ground has at least some influence on conditions and a site smewhat closer to the lower-ground M5 would be more appealing to many anyway. The rumour of another airfield sounds a logical idea, but lets hope that other locations are fully considered also. For those of us who cannot afford the costs of taking their big toys to Kent each year, we really do need an alternative at this end of the country, so lets hope it continues Cheers Steve

We were put out to graze in the furthest and emptiest field - and apart from the Dutch army truck which came around like a disco on wheels in the wee hours of the final Sunday Morning (good music though guy`s), the location was deadly quiet both during the days and evenings - thoroughly recommended for the light sleepers (and families) . Cheers, Steve

Hi, Not an expert at this, but the soil at the Hops farm is particularly fine-grained - and finds its way into the fibres. The best countermeasures are : 1. wash it with a brush and mild soap at the show (ie stop the soil from hardening) or 2. use something like a dispersant such as `vanish` or `shoot`(thats the products the wife uses). Fine for you average NATO stuff but, may be a bit strong for original wartime clothing A special degreaser is available or oil stains. Regards Steve

Thanks for the responses guys. What I did not mention is that I am on a long term advisory posting to the Northern Gulf region and can usually only get permission to return to UK at the beginning of the week. Have been in touch with Rex and Greg over the past couple of years in the weeks preceeding the event - which has not made very much difference. The booking form is a bit like the fine print in any contract I suppose - and is written in such a way as to prevent liability to the organisers. As for living history being present the whole 5 day, I totally agree and hope that someone will remind that to the rather large number of folks leaving throughout Sunday. Anyway, I still love the show - facilities and all, but do wish that folks would be up front and have the courtesy to let me know there is no chance of a slot, that way I would probably come as an MOP and avoid the wasted 2 days frantic preperation after flying home. Cheers Steve (back in the Gulf)

Hi All, A quick comment. I was booked in for living history – arrived Thursday, and told by Greg, no room, everywhere taken – for the third year running. We had made a substantial effort this year to haul a load of gear for the display, only to be placed in an area where no-one was visiting. WHATS WAS THE POINT OF ALL THE PLANNING AND PREPARATION ? Have decided that I shall not now bother with living history for future W&P and concentrate on other shows closer to my base (W. Mids). The stalls should still be worth visiting though. As for those areas large `pre-booked` areas – I was really disappointed at the amount of free (wasted) space, not to mention the number of civvie vehicles across the display areas. Shame that after 12 years of attending, this matter seems never to have been addressed. Cheers, Steve

Slipped a disc on Friday, and spent the rest of the show in agony ! Still the paramedics were great (including their very loud siren) and, the pain killers were VERY strong :shake: Some idiots on quads nearly hit my kubel when they failed to slow-down in time - why is it no-one seems to enfoce the speed limits ? Cheers Steve