fv1609

That's a nice selection of Humbers, thank you. On "Humber softskin no.2" it has no sign of external turn lights unlike most that have various sized additions I think after leaving service. In the cab of that particular one is there a turn light switch? Might sound a silly question as there are no external turn lights why would there be a switch? Unlike GS Humbers that did not have turn lights, Pigs had separate turn lights (curiously 12v ones with resistors in a 24v vehicle!!) But the FV1609A (originally designated Mk 1, as what are known as Mk 1 Pigs are actually Mk 2, & what we call Mk 2 should have been called Mk 3 but the Army forgot about the FV1609A as being the Mk 1) anyway these had a 24v turn light system that utilised the stop lights as indicators. This required an intricate bit of switching in the turn light & stop light circuits. If you look on very early Humber CT circuits this same switching is present as the CT had "hidden" turn lights. When HMG wanted to save about £200 per vehicle they were re-assigned as GS doing away with unnecessaries. I believe the turn lights was one & another was the cab heater. I have yet to find a GS that is still CT with a heater & these early turn lights. I am particularly interested in the turn switch as that should also have originally been in my FV1609A.

What I would like to see is one of the 30 RUC halftracks issued in 1958-60. Afterwards they went to IDF & probably a few have now come back & are marked up for D-Day no doubt.

Trouble is above the 'sign the petition' link, there is a link for more details so I can see what I might or might not sign, but the link is dead.

From another thread The give away on the converted No.3 Foamer was that there was a reason why there was no barricade ram & the OS rear door had the panel welded up where the hydrant hoses connected. But there is a lot of ignorance about them many people get mixed up with Pig Squirt & in service there was a documentary a couple of years ago when an ATO was showing what they used to use & described how foam was blown out from the nozzle on the roof! As we know that was for the dispersant, so I don't know what he thought all the stuff at the front was for. So you have run it up? Do you have the UHB? I noticed that one of your Pigs is ex-RUC (2988 OI) re-registed as 27 BT 89 that started out as a 32 BK 58. Is there any chance of a few pictures of it especially the chassis plate & the cab plate?

I'm going to reply on the Humber Pig pictures thread as I don't want to cause an upset for hi-jacking the thread.

TXN - Transaction (Date) SO - Struck Off (Census)

A thing I found on one carb that was rebuilt for the Army under contract was that the wrong spring had been fitted in the economy device. It was too long so the whole spring was compressed just to get it in place so the was no possibility of the diaphragm moving.

Ok Neil thank you I don't use that medium, I just didn't want to find that the site had relocated.

Although Sainsburys in Hythe only open at 0800, they do stay open until 2200 & it seemed very quiet in the evening & easy to park.

David do you know of any news? Been getting on for a couple of weeks now, presumably it will still be on http://www.afra.org.uk

It is commonly supposed that there were only two Foaming Pigs, 10 BK 34 and 11 BK 10 This is suggested by trawling through the BK sequence of Humber registrations. In fact there were three. This was a FV1609A registered 32 BK 80 & was struck off to the Ministry of Home Affairs in 1958 for use by the Reserve Force of the RUC. As the vehicle was struck off census it no longer existed. When it was taken back on census in April 1971 it was registered as 27 BT 90. It was rebodied & underwent up armouring in Op Bracelet. After the rather disappointing performance of Foamers (1779.2501) it reverted to an APC role. I first saw it at Stoneleigh 25 years ago as it had no barricade ram. Someone had made one out of aluminium tubing but didn't realise that the top two bars needed to be spaced to allow the headlights to shine through, so these segments were cut off. If that didn't look strange enough a Mk 1 canvas was tied to the roof & a fluffy toy fitted. The next time I saw it was with a different owner who sold it a chap in The Netherlands, it then went to Germany where it received some D-Day markings :rolleyes: then onto a serious collector who went to a lot of trouble downgrading it to appear as near as possible as a Mk 1. A few years ago the Pig was brought back to the UK.

Just re-reading my post in the light of day Ian. Although it was meant to be jokey it was not meant to be flippant, the figure was not plucked out of the air! I share a curiosity with statistics of supply, whether they are jerrycans or cartons & boxes. I was impressed, by not just the figure, but by the effort made by a range of ordinary people to help in any way they could. The extract came from a 1945 edition of an Army Quarterly. Seeing your link & recalling the statistic reminded me I am trying to collect these publications. Went hunting & bought these, so your post helped me expand the collection. http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/231816249375?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

Ah but what I'm looking for Ian is the 375,000,000th cardboard box produced in readiness for D-Day. Did you see the switch he has that is popular on certain trailers? http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/NOS-EX-MILITARY-VEHICLE-LUCAS-31001-DIP-SWITCH-AUSTIN-BEDFORD-DAIMLER-HUMBER-/291675646786?hash=item43e9392b42:g:kr8AAOSwa-dWsLBN

Ted & some more waffle from me VE is the VESPER Code that replaced Census Code. After WW2 Census Codes were allocated consisting of 4-digits + 2-digits + 3-digits in 1955 these changed to 6-digits + 2-digits + 3-digits. The system gave a good deal of information about the vehicle but did not lend itself to Automated Data Processing (ADP) that was being introduced from 1964 in the form of VESPER (Vehicles, Equipment, Spares, Provision, Economics, Repair). VESPER Codes used 4-digits + 4-digits, the first 4-digits form the Establishment Code Number and the last 4-digits the make, model and mark. When lumped together as 8-digits it forms the Vehicle Code Number. In 1983 SALOME was introduced (System for Accounting & On-Line Management of Equipment) This was focussed not just on vehicles but equipment that also had codes and was known as Forward Management Codes which morphed into such things as Asset Codes and Liability Codes etc in 2005 with the introduction of JAMES (Joint Asset Management & Engineering Solution). 4-digits + 4-digits codes persist to this day but are derived in an entirely different way from the VESPER days. An FOI request as to the structure of VESPER Codes reveals that the MOD does not hold such information, despite some rather old things like trailers being derived from the earlier system that are still on census. “B” in front of the VESPER Code of course indicates it is a “B” vehicle although now Green Fleet vehicle codes are prefixed “NB” as deployable assets. White Fleet vehicles (not necessarily white but in delivered livery) are prefixed “B” indicating they are non-deployable assets. “32” Could well be the "Serial No" in categories of vehicle types. The publication it appears in has 426 entries for "B" Vehicles - Trucks & Vans. Virtually all entries from 1 - 60 are for Rovers. 32 is listed but has no allocation because the date of this book is 1963. Trailers, "A" & "C" Vehicles all have Serial Nos in their own classes that start from 1. I can't really see how it adds much meaning to defining a particular vehicle type.

UIN N0104A = 42 RM CDO (=Commando) Colour Code A6 A = Army/NATO Green (not always necessarily NATO Green! But on age of this vehicle probably was) 6 = IRR (just plain not distinctive/disruptive) I'll be back later for other bits as time permits Ted

Thank you that was a very sensible interview. A couple of phrases I noticed "very poorly drafted and unclear" and draft "is not necessarily going to happen".

I can well understand the brake pipes rotting out in the cavern, it was a fascinating place but not appropriate for keeping vehicles. Here it is on display. 13 BK 56 Chassis No.21356 Contact No. 6/V/6443 FV1601B (B = with winch) Date in Service 10/12/53 Delivered to 31st ‘B’ Vehicle Depot Church Broughton Receipt Voucher CBR/R/4527 Engine No. 6172 Converted to FV1611B 1959-60 Contract No. 6/V/2/455 Stuck off Census 19/8/70 Sold DSDC Ruddington 18/11/70 Sale No.108 Lot No.1163 Price £110 The sales catalogue annotated “Me” is unfortunately not me but the dealer. He obviously reckoned yours was a good one being “OK”. Many people would have assumed that soon after the deployment of Pigs in NI at the start of Op Banner in August 1969 was the signal to retain Pigs in reserve. But you can see from this page there were 4 good Pigs being sold off in fact these sales continued through into 1971. Then in 1972 appx 200 were repurchased! You can use the 25A, Gen Panel No.2 they are more common & reliable than the 12A, Gen Panel No.1. But you can’t use them the other way around on a 12A system.

Alun welcome. Tell us about your Pig please, how far have you got with it & what it was it like when you had it. Pictures would be good, do you have the registration? I may have a picture of it & can give you a basic history. There are a few Humber owners on here, but not enough really

I believe Class refers to the Reliability Class Class 1 - for first 60% of planned life Class 2 - for next 40% of planned life Class 3 - over planned life The dates give the periods of attaining the Class. I believe ARN is the Applicability Reference Number that defines responsibility of repair & maintenance whether that is done by first, second or third line units, the trade involved & the tasks required. There is a vast amount of stuff defining these activities in EMER MANAGEMENT. I have 9 ring binders of this stuff & find it overwhelmingly complicated & I still can't understand the structure. Examples of the last letter trade/task indicator A - Repaired by Vehicle Mechanic B - Renewed by Vehicle Mechanic C - Repaired by Control Equipment Technician D - Renewed by Control Equipment Technician E - Repaired by Electrician F - Renewed by Electrician etc

Yes sometimes a seller describes something ineptly or incorrectly or spells it incorrectly. Consequently there is little in the way of bidding & you can get a bargain. Sometimes a well meaning person not interested in the item spots it & as a public service draws everyone's attention to it, that can be great, but not so great if you are patiently waiting for the sale to end & you have placed a low bid.

There is a bit of coverage on pages 5 & 6 of this: http://www.hmvf.co.uk/pdf/TENTS%20Version%2002.pdf

I can't see a lot from your picture but it looks to have still been in service up to 1973 albeit it with an NSN rather than the VAOS JA, with an "insect screen".

Richard they are both listed in a 1946 publication. I note in a 1976 handbook that sandfly netting was abandoned as it was so fine it stifled the free flow of air.

Depends on the size of the netting. Tent, Bivouac, Mosquito-Proof, JA 5717 Tent, Bivouac, Sandfly-Proof, JA 5718 The sandfly netting is much finer

Like these they had one year. So you go in a Gent & come out a Lady :wow: