fv1609

Ian excellent PM coming.

Been a busy day two more manuals up, so currently there is: Shorland Mk 3 Civilian Parts Catalogue Shorland Mk 3 Military User Handbook Shorland Mk 4 Civilian Operator's Manual Shorts SB401 Civilian/RAF Operator's Manual including Parts Catalogue http://www.shorlandsite.com/Manuals.htm With time there will be extracts (it is very big) of the Shorland Mk 3 Military Illustrated Parts Catalogue. These extracts will be prompted by requests for which particular sections are of interest.

Jim ok well the double shunt box, of what I can see of it, looks normal enough. I have no idea about the nonsense in the other box which as you know is not part of the original installation. In fact those boxes were mounted on the wings of my Lightweight for the storage the coax cable & plug when not plugged into the wing mounted ATU (Aerial Tuning Unit). OK some ball park resistance readings for Generator. Select ohms negative probe on pin W. Appx readings. Positive probe in turn on P, T & R - 30 ohms. X - 100 ohms. F - 130 ohms. Reverse the probes & repeat should be greater than 10k. Both probes on U & V (either way round) - 15 ohms. Let me know what you get & if its different I'll try & tell you where the fault lies. I've started work on an All Charged Up No.4. This will provide new info with simplified circuit diagrams enhanced with colour & newly labelled photos in colour. The articles originally appeared in Windscreen before it went colour. There will be a bit of repetition so that it could be a stand alone article without having to refer back to the articles & it will try to simplify tests but provide more info for someone with a multimeter to have a go. Together with more advanced tests for perhaps a knowledgeable friend to embark on as well.

When the Shorland had its MOT last year it got the rollers & passed. Then it had to have a drive out with the Tapley, seemed a bit pointless but at least his Tapley agread with mine.

Been a bit of a blockage in the system. A lot more to come but today there is a new topic up. Click on the last photo here: http://www.shorlandsite.com/CarMark1.htm This was the first restoration when I got it, there have been two more restorations since. The most recent was last year after a 12-year lay up & it's still going on!

Jim, it would be nice to have all the leads & cables as nature intended. It would be satisfying to rip out the bodgeries with a vengance, but perhaps it would be worth just getting it back to the state that it was when it was last charging. Once that is sorted then move onto reinstating the proper wiring. Otherwise you could be introducing more unknowns into the system because you will be unlikely to find NOS cables, they will invariably be take offs from a system that might have had faults. Cables do turn up there is a steady trickle of people who for various reasons decide to convert their 24v system to 12v. A useful source of bits would be to join this forum. You have to register, you don't have to be a member of the association. http://forum.emlra.org/index.php I don't know what is missing & bodged can you post pics? If you have the main gen to gen panel cable unnscrew the gen end & carefully check the soldered leads are still good. Also do a pin to pin continuity test for each wire within the cable & check there are no shorts. Really you should use a Megger to check for leakage between wires & the braiding as well, but at least put your ohmeter on max resistance & check for leakage. I think the circuit diagram of the Gen Panel No3 is in one of the articles. Was the workshop able to give any help on the generator? I'll dig out resistance readings.

Jamie I think it would be more useful if it could distinguish between UNF, BSF, BSP that's where the difficulties come I find. Identifying UNF, UNC & Metric isn't usually too difficult & besides just trying a few known nuts isn't too much hassle particularly if it saves you £30 & besides with this kit you still have to try it on, so might as well use some from your own box.

Just looking at the bidding histories. On a couple of items bids jumped by £1,200 in one go. On some of them the winning bid was placed 1 second before end of auction. Nerve racking stuff!

Yes that was quite exciting ! Just the small RIC helmet badge went for £2,550 I was going to bid on the tunic only which was my size. It had been stuck on £165 then went up to £565. All his RIC items went for nearly £18.5k

Robert I think you will find one of the valves is an AR8, this was used in the 18 Set but not in the 38 Set. The 38 Set used 4 x ARP12 & 1 x ATP4. There is a picture of the ZA9817 box on here: http://www.wftw.nl/gallery/ws18.html

No its not as simple as that, continuity could mean something is shorting. The diodes to function exhibit a different resistance depending on whether they are conducting a forward or reverse current. So applying an ohmeter will mean in one direction you have high resistance the other way low resistance. The reading that you get will depend on the sensitivity of the meter (ohms per volt). The diodes can be damaged by prolonged overload (ie overheating), transient high voltages produced with no load ie running the alternator with no load (eg no battery) & nasty voltages resulting from electric welding You can trace what goes where in the gen panel from the circuit diagram. A good medical principle is no treatment without a diagnosis, I think you need to follow through the flow diagnosis to pin down whether the fault is the gen or gen panel. I feel you are fighting a battle on several fronts. :-)

Sorry I didn't realise that, fair enough then. I spent quite a lot of time measuring, photoing & studying the 2/6 turret. This was because I was going to construct a replica for the Shorland. It was not until I got the Shorland parts book that it made any sense of the few Vigilant Shorland photos I had. Now that was crude & entirely different to the relative sophistication of the 2/6. To make a 2/6 with missile cradles needs some ingenuity because it is not just the cradles to make but there is the elevation mechanism, hydraulic missile hold back system, missile firing circuit cut out etc But you could go pre 2/6 as 2/3 with Vigilant! I have seen some articles that claim to cover 2/6 (& I suspect this also appears in a book) that use FVRDE photos of early Vigilant Ferret trials which predate the 2/6 design. This is certainly crude consisting of angle iron welded to the turret to support the Vigilant bins.

Well you'll be able to test the integrity of the field winding & to some degree the output windings & the associated diodes & confirmation that the carbon brushes are making contact. The final verification is connection to the gen panel. The main function of that is to regulate the current in the field winding, this controls the electromagnetic field which in turn regulates the output voltage. The other function of the gen panel is to connect the vehicle & radio batteries in parallel & to the generator output, there is some radio interference supression as well.

I think it would be a 18 Set specifically. Although ATP4 (Army Transmitting Pentode No.4) & ARP12 (Army Receiving Pentode No.12) were used in the 38 Set. ARP12 was quite versatile & was also used in Mine Detector No.3 (Polish)

Paul, there may be people who have an interest & knowledge of a particular type of vehicle who no longer own such a vehicle but would be excluded from your list yet have advice to offer. There are people who own a particular vehicle but may not want to get involved in giving advice. This may be lack of time, lack of information ('help! why doesn't my vehicle work anymore' type of question), the fact that the question has already been covered & the answer could be found with a 'search' or feeling unsure of their answer as it might not be quite right or subject to criticism or long wrangles. Answering a post can take up to half an hour or sometimes more if looking up in books is required. I get phone calls & emails on a regular basis & it does take up time. So some posted queries I have to walk away from if I've had enough for the day, but certain topics Humbers, Shorlands, EMERs & part number are hard to resist. So basically those with knowledge & the time will be answering anyway as they will tend to hang around those parts of the forum where the topics & vehicles are of interest to them.

With two ammeters in the dash it would have been intended to work with a Gen Panel No.9 Mk 3 or earlier. But this way round a Mk 4 panel which is transistorised should work. You need to establish which Mk of panel you have for any detailed fault finding. If it has a third smaller socket on the box it will be a Mk 4. Bear in mind that the -ve output only becomes earthed only after it comes out of the gen panel & at the shunt box. It is easy for these connections to become undone or damaged.. I would be surprised if a normal workshop would be able to cope with testing an alternator that has no internal regulation. So you might get no joy there I'm afraid. When you get it back I can give you resistance readings to check for. Some photos of all these bits would be of help.

Well the helmet is £1,600 with a day to go but a small badge has more than tripled this evening it is now £2k & a day to go! http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=140377832481&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT

Greetings. 66 KF 15 that was Contract 22A/340, I used to have one from the same contract 76 KF 70 I think!

Mike I tend to agree with you, that was my view when this one cropped up before. With the downgrade as this one clearly has had I take to be a 2/7. I am doubtful that a fancy plate would have been specially manufactured to show this. Ferret 2/6 is implicite that it is operational & fitted with Vigilant & the supporting accessories. http://hmvf.co.uk/forumvb/showthread.php?16452-Withams-Auction&p=181990#post181990

Ok the circuit diagram is on page 5 of article 1. The connections are on page 10 of article 3. Have you followed the diagnostics in article 3? Did the system work once or has it never worked in your ownership? Have you or previous owner made some 'modifications' to the wiring? You say it is not charging. On what basis is that, the charge light still on, no movement of the ammeter if you have radio batteries fitted, no voltage increase if you rev? Do you have a multimeter so you can measure volts & ohms? It is important to verify if it is a Mk 4 as it is significantly different inside from earlier Mks. In general, but not necessarily, a Mk 4 installation has a single ammeter in the shunt box rather than 2 ammeters on the dash.

You'll need to tell us whether you have a 40A or 90A system & what is the Mk of your Generator Panel?

Mike, I think you deserve a little treat for wrestling with the proposed legislation on our behalf. Hope its of interest.

The problem now highlighted on here: http://www.mvt.org.uk/news.htm

:rotfl:

Chris well done. Yes they were all the same size, once! I would gently flatten them up with a file to get them uniform. I would use the poorer ones on the upper row so that if there are future difficulties getting them off then you can get at them better. I think new ones will be hard to find.